Justice League movie thread

[Delorean90 42]

I just want any Justice League movie to be a separate universe from the Bale films. If Nolan's involved on such a project, I'm perfectly fine with that.

[Red 75]

I'm with Karol. The Dark Knight Trilogy was its own self-contained animal. Opening that up to the DC universe is something it wasn't created for, and it causes way too many problems, with the biggest one being the oft-cited, "If superheroes are real in the TDK universe, where the hell were they when Bane was threatening Gotham with a nuke?" Another one is that Bale being involved as Batman would utterly spoil the point of the whole bloody trilogy.

Exactly. This doesn't make any logical sense any way you look at it. I sincerely hope this doesn't happen.

[Koray Savas 2,251]

You could say the same for The Avengers too though. Why didn't Captain America go help out Thor?

[BloodBoal 7,538]

Because he was under a lot of ice?

[A24 4,338]

I'm with Karol. The Dark Knight Trilogy was its own self-contained animal. Opening that up to the DC universe is something it wasn't created for, and it causes way too many problems, with the biggest one being the oft-cited, "If superheroes are real in the TDK universe, where the hell were they when Bane was threatening Gotham with a nuke?" Another one is that Bale being involved as Batman would utterly spoil the point of the whole bloody trilogy.

I think it's perfectly possible that WB wants Nolan and Snyder to be in charge for the whole DC department. Still, we still have to wait and see what WB will say after Man Of Steel is released but with Nolan's name attached, I think it will do very well at the box-office. Snyder might even direct a few of them but one thing I don't see happening is Christian Bale playing Batman again (next to a bunch of other caped heroes, no less). I think he's done with Batman. Then again, Nolan (with WB breathing down his neck) might convince him to do a very small scene (as some kind of wise advisor). After all, 'advise' is all Batman has to offer in universe full of godly super powers.

Alex

[Quintus 5,399]

If Cavill proves to be superb in MoS, then I'm all for this 'pairing with Bale's Batman. Sounds a like great excuse for rousing summer blockbustery to me, the artistic side of such broad entertainment being of little importance; same as any semblance of art was nowhere to be seen in The Avengers (which is what the producers of this hope to mimick).

[Brónach 1,302]

the artistic side of such broad entertainment being of little importance

Then why'd one want to see it?

[Quintus 5,399]

Why not? Two hours of popcorn cinema is right up my alley on a summer's evening.

[Brónach 1,302]

I don't actually follow your whole chain of thought but whatever.

[Quintus 5,399]

You're far too dull and take yourself ridiculously seriously to ever understand my chain of thought.

[Brónach 1,302]

Now you're just trolling. I actually understand your train of thought, but I disagree on some points so I make it as if I don't understand because I didn't really feel like arguing over nothing important but I couldn't stay quiet. It's funny you even bothered to come back with that.

[Quintus 5,399]

You shouldn't have replied with this if you weren't being truthful:

I don't actually follow your whole chain of thought but whatever.

Give up the pointless second guessing games and just speak to me straight. And I'm not about to take you seriously when you end with "but whatever".

[Koray Savas 2,251]

Avoiding conversation by replying to someone's post, how does that make any sense?

I'm all for a good blockbuster, I just don't think The Avengers was one of them.

[Brónach 1,302]

I thought it was good, but I could have done with more stuff in it. Add more Loki and stuff about the aliens, like 15 minutes or so, and the film would be cooler.

[Koray Savas 2,251]

You wanted more? It was bloated enough as it is. Cut out 15 minutes of the 45 minute set up and things would have been smoother.

[Brónach 1,302]

What would you cut? I think it's all right. It's a tried and tested structure. Reminded me somewhat of Alan Moore and Kevin O'Neill's League of Extraordinary Gentlemen. Of course, it's not as cool.

[Koray Savas 2,251]

Another bad film

I would change a lot with The Avengers and I didn't care for it at all so I don't really want to go much into it. The whole set up of finding each one and convincing them to join took up too much time. This is something that should have been taken care of in each of their previous films. There's very little actual plot in here, it's just all of them being smart asses to each other. That whole ship fixing sequence was what, another 20-30 minutes?

[Red 75]

You could say the same for The Avengers too though. Why didn't Captain America go help out Thor?

The difference is that those films were specifically designed to co-exist and lead up to the Avengers. The Dark Knight Trilogy has never been that, it has always been a unique, standalone take on Batman that had a definitive end with Rises.

[Brónach 1,302]

Another bad film

I would change a lot with The Avengers and I didn't care for it at all so I don't really want to go much into it. The whole set up of finding each one and convincing them to join took up too much time. This is something that should have been taken care of in each of their previous films. There's very little actual plot in here, it's just all of them being smart asses to each other. That whole ship fixing sequence was what, another 20-30 minutes?

There's plot, you just seem to want to take it out of the film. The whole characters being smartass is basically character interaction, which Whedon does pretty well.

There isn't a film of The League of Extraordinary Gentlemen.

[Delorean90 42]

Also, why would them getting rounded up be in their individual films? You're going to have the same plot point (Loki taking the Tesseract) happen in each hero's respective film, and then show Fury getting them to help respond? Then we'd be going, "What the hell? This is all part of the same story, why not just put that in The Avengers?" And it wouldn't have anything to do with their respective plotline. I'm annoyed enough about the ending of Captain America:

I wish that they had left out the present day bookends and ended on the shot of the kids playing in the street--THAT'S where the film's story really ends. Steve didn't just help in combat, but became an inspiration to a generation. Do the present day stuff after the credits if you must.

[Brónach 1,302]

The scene with the kids is pure narm. When we saw the film people laughed.

[Koray Savas 2,251]

Another bad film

I would change a lot with The Avengers and I didn't care for it at all so I don't really want to go much into it. The whole set up of finding each one and convincing them to join took up too much time. This is something that should have been taken care of in each of their previous films. There's very little actual plot in here, it's just all of them being smart asses to each other. That whole ship fixing sequence was what, another 20-30 minutes?

There's plot, you just seem to want to take it out of the film. The whole characters being smartass is basically character interaction, which Whedon does pretty well.

There isn't a film of The League of Extraordinary Gentlemen.

Uh yeah there is. It ended Sean Connery's career.

Also, why would them getting rounded up be in their individual films? You're going to have the same plot point (Loki taking the Tesseract) happen in each hero's respective film, and then show Fury getting them to help respond? Then we'd be going, "What the hell? This is all part of the same story, why not just put that in The Avengers?" And it wouldn't have anything to do with their respective plotline. I'm annoyed enough about the ending of Captain America:

I wish that they had left out the present day bookends and ended on the shot of the kids playing in the street--THAT'S where the film's story really ends. Steve didn't just help in combat, but became an inspiration to a generation. Do the present day stuff after the credits if you must.

I meant the simple act of getting them to agree to help. It could be done in 5 minutes at the end of each film. Then round them up in the beginning of The Avengers for the trouble starting there instead of meandering around for 45 minutes. I also thought the whole point of The Incredible Hulk was to establish that Banner could control his rage but we don't learn that until the end of The Avengers.

[Brónach 1,302]

Uh yeah there is. It ended Sean Connery's career.

YOU LIE!!

[Quintus 5,399]

Connery retired so he could spend his days playing golf in Spain.

[crocodile 8,017]

God now that was a bad film.

Which is a pity because the books are so good. Not a blockbuster material at all, though.

Karol

[Brónach 1,302]

Which is a pity because the books are so good. Not a blockbuster material at all, though.

The first one could be adapted pretty much literally and it would make a really fun film. But it would be a pointless thing to do, because it's already in the book.

[crocodile 8,017]

Yeah, exactly. The best thing about it has nothing to do with plot. It's all about references and puns.

Karol

[Koray Savas 2,251]

Connery retired so he could spend his days playing golf in Spain.

He retired because of how awful the movie was.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qfdux5WPX2c

At least he went out with a bang of hilarious one-liners.

[Quintus 5,399]

He retired because he pissed 400mil down the drain, actually. Which is why he spent his days after playing golf near his villa, to help him forget...

Now though he lives in Greece.

[Wycket 36]

You could say the same for The Avengers too though. Why didn't Captain America go help out Thor?

The difference is that those films were specifically designed to co-exist and lead up to the Avengers. The Dark Knight Trilogy has never been that, it has always been a unique, standalone take on Batman that had a definitive end with Rises.

Says who. The ending of the film left things open and can allow for more adventures. There's plenty of ways to bring Bale back and personally I'd love to see him interact with other heroes. I don't get this prevalent idea that Batman can't coexist with these other heroes. It works in the comics and can work in film. Once Nolan had Two-Face go around half burned as if nothing happened he abandoned any reality that Batman existed in, not that Begins was all that realistic to begin with.

[crocodile 8,017]

Yeah, but if you want a realistic film then you'd have to scrap Batman as well. That's not the point. As it has been said many times, that trilogy was set in a world where other superheroes don't exist. That's the reason Batman even exist in this version. And if superbeings appeared somewhere later, why would Batman even want to come back? It still doesn't justify anything. And would ruin (a very good) ending of Nolan's trilogy. It's just a lame and pathetic excuse to give the project some credibility.

Karol

[Quintus 5,399]

The devil is isn the details, Karol, but I don't believe in him. I can easily see Batmans and Supermans... LIVING TOGETHER!

[Delorean90 42]

The scene with the kids is pure narm. When we saw the film people laughed.

Sorry, I don't see this at all. Thought it made for a great closing shot/ending, and I really liked Silvestri's redemptive burst of Cap's theme there.

I also think it would've made a lot more sense to segue from this to the patriotic imagery and full-blown Captain America March of the beginning of the end credits, drawing the connection to the good that Steve did.

Another bad film

I would change a lot with The Avengers and I didn't care for it at all so I don't really want to go much into it. The whole set up of finding each one and convincing them to join took up too much time. This is something that should have been taken care of in each of their previous films. There's very little actual plot in here, it's just all of them being smart asses to each other. That whole ship fixing sequence was what, another 20-30 minutes?

There's plot, you just seem to want to take it out of the film. The whole characters being smartass is basically character interaction, which Whedon does pretty well.

There isn't a film of The League of Extraordinary Gentlemen.

Uh yeah there is. It ended Sean Connery's career.

>>>

Also, why would them getting rounded up be in their individual films? You're going to have the same plot point (Loki taking the Tesseract) happen in each hero's respective film, and then show Fury getting them to help respond? Then we'd be going, "What the hell? This is all part of the same story, why not just put that in The Avengers?" And it wouldn't have anything to do with their respective plotline. I'm annoyed enough about the ending of Captain America:

I wish that they had left out the present day bookends and ended on the shot of the kids playing in the street--THAT'S where the film's story really ends. Steve didn't just help in combat, but became an inspiration to a generation. Do the present day stuff after the credits if you must.

I meant the simple act of getting them to agree to help. It could be done in 5 minutes at the end of each film. Then round them up in the beginning of The Avengers for the trouble starting there instead of meandering around for 45 minutes. I also thought the whole point of The Incredible Hulk was to establish that Banner could control his rage but we don't learn that until the end of The Avengers.

Well, Iron Man wasn't being allowed in as of IM2, which was part of the tension between him and Fury. Last we saw Thor, he was in Asgard trying to get back to Earth. Hawkeye and Black Widow didn't have their own films. I don't see how you organically get them all to buddy up with S.H.I.E.L.D. before The Avengers. Pulling the team together was part of the fun. It's the origin film of the group.

[crocodile 8,017]

Nolan not involved in the film and his Batman films not part of the JLA/Man of Steel universe.

Thank god.

Karol

[Jay 37,368]

[Delorean90 42]

Whew!

[Red 75]

I figured that's the way it would happen. There was just no way.

[Wycket 36]

Batman totally could have worked as Nolan conceived him. I don't understand the aversion that most members here seem to have to that idea. The Batman as presented in the Nolan films is very similar to the Batman featured in Year One, The Long Halloween, and a number of other comic arcs. Maybe not as fleshed out, as expected considering the restraint of a film's run time, but I have little doubt he would have fit into the larger picture of a DC Universe. Aided by technology and his brains, he would have been the leader of the group from a tactical standpoint, with others providing muscle to compliment his weapons (Tumbler, Batpod, The Bat).

Of course, I am always open for a new interpretation of the character and would love to see a take more akin to the modern comics on film (minus all that Batman Inc. nonsense).

[Koray Savas 2,251]

The character may have worked, but not the universe Nolan created because there are no superheroes in his Gotham.

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

I agree. It would feel weird seeing Bale's "realistic" Batman suddenly interact with the Son Of Krypton and Wonder Woman.

[A24 4,338]

But that's exactly what Nolan wants for Man Of Steel, that is, making a Superman film that is grounded in realism, as if he really existed in the real world (as opposed to in a comic book world). He did the same for the Bats.

And with Batman, perhaps in the form of Bruce Wayne, in a small advisory role, you don't really need Bats and Supes fighting along each other.



Alex

[crocodile 8,017]

That can mean different things: relatable Superman as a character, a situation where he arrives on Earth and how people would react

What he means is verisimilitude.

Karol

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

But that's exactly what Nolan wants for Man Of Steel, that is, making a Superman film that is grounded in realism, as if he really existed in the real world (as opposed to in a comic book world). He did the same for the Bats.

Alex

Even in the comics I never bought the idea of Batman and Superman fighting side by side as equals.

Supes is basically a God, while Batman is a very well trained and resourceful human.

The reason The Avengers sorta worked is because Marvel never really attempted to portray their world as realistic.

[A24 4,338]

That can mean different things: relatable Superman as a character, a situation where he arrives on Earth and how people would react

What he means is verisimilitude.

Karol

Yes, and once we relate to him as an alien stranger who tries to find his place on Earth, and not as a farm boy who happens to be a god, the stage is set for him to have a meeting with the Bats ... or Bruce Wayne. Two weirdo outcasts with capes fighting evil ... I don't see a real problem.

Nolan not overseeing Justice League ... A missed opportunity?

Alex

[crocodile 8,017]

No, I'd rather him to do his own films. Like that Interstellar he's prepping at the moment.

Karol

[A24 4,338]

That's not a problem. He's not directing JL.

Isn't it possible WB wants to wait and see how MOS will perform at the box-office before they will persuade Nolan to act as a producer for JL?

If MOS is a huge success, they are not going to want another style for Justice League. They are going to want Nolan and Snyder badly.

If it flops, then it's back to square one for everyone.

If it flops, Supes is cinematically dead for the next 30 years.

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

Thank God for Marvel getting it right!

[A24 4,338]

It took them some time though ... remember Ang Lee's HULK?

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

Urgh, far to a creative and artistic rendering of the character! Thankfully the Eddie Norton sequel got it right!

[A24 4,338]

That was much better, of course, but they really got the Hulk right with Mark Ruffalo. I can't wait for Planet Hulk!