New Goldsmith Lionheart recording coming in 2024

[1977 1,743]

6 hours ago, Steffromuk said:

I'm wondering if the lack of buzz might be because Lionheart is not fans' favorite?

I have to admit, I was surprised to see it annouced as the next kickstarter. I would have thought that another beloved incomplete and lost score like Underfire would have gotten much more cheers and reposts.

 

An Under Fire re-recording would be fantastic! I love the CPPO re-recording on those two Goldsmith anthologies.

[Tallguy 3,399]

I haven't listened to it much but when I have I've enjoyed it. But there's a seemingly vocal contingent of Goldsmith fans that can't give this score the time of day. Which is weird to me because it has so many echoes of what would later be some of JG's most popular scores. (It's like a First Knight prequel, isn't it?)

[Marian Schedenig 8,200]

7 hours ago, Steffromuk said:

Lionheart is not fans' favorite?

 

Since when?

[Yavar Moradi 2,599]

11 hours ago, Steffromuk said:

I'm wondering if the lack of buzz might be because Lionheart is not fans' favorite?

 

Pretty sure Lionheart is very considered a fan favorite, in spite of the disappointing orchestral performance. I've seen it referred to as "Jerry's Conan the Barbarian" and the like. Varese's 2021 Deluxe Edition was probably their only Club release in the past decade to sell out within a matter of a few months, besides Silvestri's Death Becomes Her Deluxe Edition (which I think was limited to fewer copies than Lionheart's 2000).

 

And until Joe Dante joined us for a couple epic Soundtrack Spotlight podcasts on Matinee and The 'Burbs this past year, Lionheart was The Goldsmith's Odyssey's second most popular Soundtrack Spotlight after Legend (a much more remembered film).

 

The Filmtracks Scoreboard community recently polled members on their 100 favorite scores from two time periods (1908-1974, and 1975-present)... despite the extreme obscurity of the film, Lionheart placed an impressive 59th, out of all film scores written after 1974! (I didn't even participate in this vote, for the record.)

https://www.filmtracks.com/scoreboard/forum.cgi?read=128164

 

And this is popularity to the general film music community; Filmtracks is not a particularly Goldsmith-centric community (not like FSM, anyway): only ONE Goldsmith score placed in the top 40 (Star Trek: The Motion Picture at 10th place) compared to 12 Williams scores, 10 Horner scores, and 3 scores each by Zimmer, Powell, and Shore.

 

11 hours ago, Steffromuk said:

I have to admit, I was surprised to see it annouced as the next kickstarter. I would have thought that another beloved incomplete and lost score like Underfire would have gotten much more cheers and reposts.

 

Since you bring it up, Under Fire was actually the second highest ranking Goldsmith score (after Star Trek: The Motion Picture) in that Filmtracks community poll... in 42nd place overall. Not really that far ahead of Lionheart's 57th place in terms of popularity, still. I *do* think a new complete recording of Under Fire would be popular because it has more unreleased music than Lionheart does, but people are also a lot happier with the original album and the orchestra's performance of the music. A re-recording would have to compete against a stellar recording, with a stellar orchestra and Pat Metheny as soloist (unless he could be brought back?) and might likely come up short, whereas the performance of Lionheart can easily be bettered.

 

But really it all comes down to what Leigh himself wanted to tackle next. The GE Theater series started out as him just wanting to tackle "The Bar Mitzvah of Major Orlovsky" on its own as an EP, because he really liked the audio of the episode we had shared with him. There are a lot of total premieres by Goldsmith which he could have tackled next as well, which are more "needed"... and he's not uninterested, but he wanted to do something BIG after the GE Theater success. And Lionheart has been on the top of his own personal wishlist to tackle for over a decade now. Here's a response I prompted from him in April 2013 (I'll leave my post on top in italics, for context):

https://filmscoremonthly.com/board/posts.cfm?threadID=95569&forumID=1&archive=0

Quote

So new question: Obviously what scores get done is mainly up to Luc at Prometheus who's footing the bill, but as a Goldsmith fanatic yourself, what's your current dream project for this new series?

Yavar

I'm not sure how many scores are planned for the series - but, if I could pick anything, it would be one of three things:

. Complete Lionheart (the soundtrack performance is pretty poor)
. A CD of his scores for Thriller & Twilight Zone
or
. Orchestral realisation of one of his 'synth trilogy' scores (which maybe interesting, as he tended to write quite orchestrally for the keyboards on those projects)

Those would be my choices...but who knows what's next :-)

 

I hope I've given you more insight as to why Lionheart was selectced, but I guess the only real test of its popularity is whether his campaign successfully funds or not!

 

Yavar

[Marian Schedenig 8,200]

1 hour ago, Yavar Moradi said:

I hope I've given you more insight as to why Lionheart was selectced, but I guess the only real test of its popularity the sanity of the film music community is whether his campaign successfully funds or not!

 

Fixed.

[Yavar Moradi 2,599]

7 hours ago, JTWfan77 said:

An Under Fire re-recording would be fantastic! I love the CPPO re-recording on those two Goldsmith anthologies.

 

Agreed a complete release of the score would be fantastic, and a re-recording would be nice if the original film recording (which sounds great) just can't be located. But, while those CPPO recordings of cues are okay, I personally think they are noticeably inferior to the original film recording/performance. Guitar soloist Pat Metheny's absence is particularly felt, but I also think the orchestra just isn't as good as the original. I think the CPPO today would do a *lot* better than they did a quarter century ago, though.

 

37 minutes ago, Marian Schedenig said:

Fixed.

 

Hah! I share your love for the score, but I don't think someone is insane for being satisfied with the original recording, as flawed as it is. It's not Conan the Destroyer or Battle Beyond the Stars... in fact it's a superior Hungarian orchestra who does a superior job with tougher music than some of Jerry's other recordings in Hungary. But that's not saying a lot, and a score THIS great deserves an A+ recording.

 

Yavar

[Marian Schedenig 8,200]

25 minutes ago, Yavar Moradi said:

Hah! I share your love for the score, but I don't think someone is insane for being satisfied with the original recording, as flawed as it is.

 

Not someone individually, no. But while our community is small, if it doesn't have enough interested people to fund this, then something is not right.

[Amer 2,110]

If only Bruce Botnick could also be engaged to do the project then it would the perfect Goldmith resurrection. He would essentially capture the Goldsmith sound so well.

 

 

[Andy 4,138]

I would support this. I’m not a long time fan, having only heard the latest Deluxe Edition a few times, but it did scratch the itch for me. 

[1977 1,743]

On 13/10/2023 at 9:19 PM, Yavar Moradi said:

Guitar soloist Pat Metheny's absence is particularly felt

 

I honestly find his performance rather dull, the CPPO guitarist (session player?) seems to add in more licks and flourishes and it just feels more raw and in the moment to me. I really struggle to get through the OST, and it's not for lack of trying.

 

Weirdly I also prefer the CPPO performance of the Baby: SotLL end titles to the original score.

[Thor 7,513]

52 minutes ago, JTWfan77 said:

 

I honestly find his performance rather dull,

 

Sacrilege!

[1977 1,743]

Sorry, just how I feel about it. Perhaps it's due to exposure bias. The CPPO recording was my first ever exposure to the score and I only got hold of the OST some years later (I've never seen the film). James Fitzpatrick mentioned that he spent quite a bit of time on that recording, and I feel it shows. Perhaps a modern remaster of the OST would change my opinion of it.

 

Off topic, it's the same with Gerhardt's CE3K. I vastly prefer his reading of those particular parts of the score and find the OST less inspiring (the re-recording was the first ever score album I owned). I must have listened to it well over a hundred times before I got the OST. The choral performance on the Gerhardt is vastly superior to the OST I feel - perhaps because it seems to have a larger male component with the accompanying gravitas that brings. I also enjoy the little woodwind flourishes added during the Barnstorming part which are absent from the film recording.

 

 

[Ollie 1,059]

@JTWfan77

 

I can understand that. I heard Meco’s disco version of Star Wars before I got Williams score. It was a shock hearing the difference. 
 

The same with Midway. Obviously I had the Varese recording before the Original and it took awhile to get over the tempo differences. Outside of the theme I wasn’t that familiar with score, having only seen the film when I was much younger.