King Mark 3,631 Posted January 27, 2012 Share Posted January 27, 2012 Ok, the 2 most recent Williams adventure scoresThe much maligned and underrated KotCS (Lucas resentment spilling over to the music) vs. the overrated Tintin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
indy4 155 Posted January 27, 2012 Share Posted January 27, 2012 KotCS, although both scores are good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Not Mr. Big 4,642 Posted January 27, 2012 Share Posted January 27, 2012 I like Tintin better. The Crystal Skull has too much reused material from the other Indiana Jones films and I don't like the original material very much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KK 3,307 Posted January 27, 2012 Share Posted January 27, 2012 Tintin by a long shot, although both are great scores. KotCS is a great entry in the franchise and sadly underrated but Tintin is a far superior score! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hlao-roo 389 Posted January 27, 2012 Share Posted January 27, 2012 KotCS is the bee's knees, but Tintin is the dog's bollocks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Docteur Qui 1,544 Posted January 27, 2012 Share Posted January 27, 2012 Tintin, easily. Way more thematically rich and inspired IMO. I still can't get enough of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Demondm810 399 Posted January 27, 2012 Share Posted January 27, 2012 Overrated Tintin?!? KM!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Faleel 5,365 Posted January 27, 2012 Share Posted January 27, 2012 KOTCS By Faaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaarrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josh500 1,615 Posted January 27, 2012 Share Posted January 27, 2012 Tintin, of course, but not because KotCS has some reused material.Tintin is just a better score overall. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crocodile 8,020 Posted January 27, 2012 Share Posted January 27, 2012 Tintin is more fun, but I'm really fond of KOTCS. In fact, I listened to it twice this week.Karol - who likes KOTCS more than the prequels Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quintus 5,399 Posted January 27, 2012 Share Posted January 27, 2012 Tintin because it feels fresh and full of ideas compared to the tired old autopilot staleness of KotCS. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonesy 55 Posted January 27, 2012 Share Posted January 27, 2012 Tintin, but I have to say that I love the unreleased music from KOTCS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joni Wiljami 1,206 Posted January 27, 2012 Share Posted January 27, 2012 Tintin!Never heard any unreleased music from KOTCS. Actually never listened even the OST through.The only interesting moments are the recycled old themes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BloodBoal 7,538 Posted January 27, 2012 Share Posted January 27, 2012 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joni Wiljami 1,206 Posted January 27, 2012 Share Posted January 27, 2012 No, "never listened even the OST through" can be more than just the first track, like skipping all the boring parts. And it can also include multiple tries to finish it but NO, it's just not working. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brónach 1,302 Posted January 27, 2012 Share Posted January 27, 2012 I think the Unicorn is, in general, a more vibrant an interesting score than the Skull.Edit: in the case of the Unicorn I'm basing myself only on the OST, mind you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Incanus 5,716 Posted January 27, 2012 Share Posted January 27, 2012 I think there is a more vivid and vibrant sense of adventure in Tintin yes. KotCS sounds like Indiana Jones suddenly had grown dark and grim. Be that as it may I do like both scores almost equally for their different strengths in the same action/adventure genre. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Datameister 2,044 Posted January 27, 2012 Share Posted January 27, 2012 Not sure yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brónach 1,302 Posted January 27, 2012 Share Posted January 27, 2012 My thing with KotCS is that I find a big deal of it to be a bit boring. I like the music for the soviet characters, I like some orchestral outbursts here and there, but overall, meh. On the top of that the reuse of music puts me off a bit, and I miss some strong "main idea" like the Ark music, the slave children's theme of the Last Crusade theme were to the previous films.I think the structure and style of the film influenced the music in the wrong way. The film has slow, empty, stale parts, half of it looks like it was shot in a sound stage and, to be a film about the search of a lost city, the lost city and the sense of wonder of it don't matter much. It needs humour and danger. If some of these elements changed we could have had a more interesting score, say JW writing music for a lost city, say JW going back to The Lost World jungley sound, say JW creating music for an imaginary culture had they dared to make something about that in the film.In The Secret of the Unicorn, by contrast, the brisk pace, the sense of humour of the film are reflected in the music. The making of a random pirate treasure into An Awesome McGuffin is also reflected in the score, as are the several characters or the different locales. JW might not see many films, but he understands them wondefully when he sees them. And when something in the film is worth noting is probably going to end up in the music somewhere.For example, Irina Spalko is probably the best designed villain in an Indy flick. And of course, JW tries to make that patent. I remember JW saying that Spalko was a sexy character or something like that. Granted the actual character wasn't up to such design and such music, but JW got that there was something there to explore, and it was correct to do so. Or the magnificent shot of the mushroum cloud gets quite cool music as well. You get the idea. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joni Wiljami 1,206 Posted January 27, 2012 Share Posted January 27, 2012 Hey there is truth in this spaniard´s words.Half of the post deleted due to the creepy presence of the moderator. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay 37,378 Posted January 27, 2012 Share Posted January 27, 2012 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Faleel 5,365 Posted January 27, 2012 Share Posted January 27, 2012 ??? from me as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joni Wiljami 1,206 Posted January 27, 2012 Share Posted January 27, 2012 Why in the world? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Penna 3,696 Posted January 28, 2012 Share Posted January 28, 2012 Surprisingly, I like listening to KotCS more. Quite a bit of it is boring as hell, but when it's good, it's really good.Tintin has just seemed unfocused to me from day one. None of the action sequences grab me and overall it's just too much of a jazzy score for my tastes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dark Trilogy 39 Posted January 28, 2012 Share Posted January 28, 2012 I voted for The Adventures of Tintin.(...) and overall it's just too much of a jazzy score for my tastes.If you would say this issue about Catch me if you can, I would agree with you. This score is really too much jazz. But not in the case of Tintin. There is a bit of jazzy-like here and there but overall it is orchestral music with a minor portion of jazz only. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KK 3,307 Posted January 28, 2012 Share Posted January 28, 2012 Surprisingly, I like listening to KotCS more. Quite a bit of it is boring as hell, but when it's good, it's really good.Tintin has just seemed unfocused to me from day one. None of the action sequences grab me and overall it's just too much of a jazzy score for my tastes.Jazzy? The only moments that are jazzy is the first track and maybe some of the piano riffs in the next two cues, but other than that, this is a classic adventure score from the maestro. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
indy4 155 Posted January 28, 2012 Share Posted January 28, 2012 The jazz elements of Tintin are the best parts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Penna 3,696 Posted January 28, 2012 Share Posted January 28, 2012 Maybe it's not just the jazz... the whole style of the score just seems thematically unsatisfying to me. It just never clicked. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muad'Dib 1,802 Posted January 31, 2012 Share Posted January 31, 2012 Jazzy? The only moments that are jazzy is the first track and maybe some of the piano riffs in the next two cues, but other than that, this is a classic adventure score from the maestro.Capturing Mr. Silk has lots of jazz elements. Even some blues. Introducing the Thompsons has some jazz too, and The Flight to Bagghar has a very jazzy instrumentation, specially thanks to that awesome Baritone Sax.Tintin for me. But I really like KOTCS too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Crichton 4 Posted February 5, 2012 Share Posted February 5, 2012 Tintin by a mile. It has something Indy 4 is sorely lacking in: life. Zest. Zeal. I thought, was afraid, that Indy 4 sounded old and tired due to Williams feeling that way. Now I'm thinking it's just because Indy is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay 37,378 Posted February 5, 2012 Share Posted February 5, 2012 Tintin by a mile. It has something Indy 4 is sorely lacking in: life. Zest. Zeal. I thought, was afraid, that Indy 4 sounded old and tired due to Williams feeling that way. Now I'm thinking it's just because Indy is.Wow John, well said. I hadn't thougt of it that way. I do admit I seem yo like Indy 4 more than you but you cant deny War Horse and atintinvare both "fresher" and display much more originality than Indy 4 score. I really feel like JW will continue to come upvwith memorable and relevant music until the day he dies Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KK 3,307 Posted February 5, 2012 Share Posted February 5, 2012 Tintin by a mile. It has something Indy 4 is sorely lacking in: life. Zest. Zeal. I thought, was afraid, that Indy 4 sounded old and tired due to Williams feeling that way. Now I'm thinking it's just because Indy is.Wow John, well said. I hadn't thougt of it that way. I do admit I seem yo like Indy 4 more than you but you cant deny War Horse and atintinvare both "fresher" and display much more originality than Indy 4 score. I really feel like JW will continue to come upvwith memorable and relevant music until the day he diesAgreed. Williams is gifted with the talent to be able to come up with strong memorable music consistently unlike any other composer. I don't even know how to explain it but with nearly ever score Williams delivers a piece of memorable and relevant music (regardless whether you like it or not). How he does it, I will never know! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Incanus 5,716 Posted February 5, 2012 Share Posted February 5, 2012 KotCS is heavily informed by Williams' previous Indy scores (for good or for worse) but it is interesting how he seemed to integrate almost WotW style darkness to the alien aspect of the film in his music. The use of subtle choral effects (real and synthesized) to convey the same unknown and alien as he did in WotW. The high register almost keening choral textures seem to him denote uncomfortable and unknown, alien and something ghostly. In KotCS they do not rise to such feverish pitch as they do in WotW but the technique is the same, especially in the finale where two worlds meets so to speak and the alien craft starts to unravel from the temple and the portal opens. WotW and KotCS choral music has antecedent in e.g. CEO3K where the choir is used in similar exotic ways to convey fear of the alien and unknown to great effect and I think it is interesting in itself that the most human instrument, our voice, is so effective in both soothing us as it is to unsettle us, indicative of familiar and alien at the same time.The grim and grinding action music with Williams' modern heavily rhythmic approach instead of balletic one is another example of where this score is different from the 3 predecessors, although setpieces like Jungle Chase and Whirl Through the Academe exhibit balletic scoring.The deep and dark sonorities of the exploration music, the eerie wonder of Akator instead of the warmth of let's say TLC both show how differently Williams thought of this film. This music certainly has familiarity of Indy scores at times even in the above mentioned moments but the Crystal Skull as McGuffin somehow brings a deep darkness to everything in the music. The music has sections where I feel the old sparkle and spirit very vividly but at times there are moments when I think Indy has gotten old, grim and jaded. Determined, grim and gritty is what I would use to describe many cues in KotCS.Tintin on the other hand feels very familiar but it has a youthful sparkle that is a joy to hear and get swept off with on an adventure. It does not exactly break the mold but uses some unique orchestrational effects and instruments to freshen up the approach. While I do enjoy Williams doing new things and trying his hand in different styles I also love to hear the Maestro do what he does best with his symphonic arsenal. With a plethora of wonderful themes for a new hero and story the classic Williams adventure/action mode is a joy to hear each and every time, a fusion of the old and familiar and new and unexpected. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
indy4 155 Posted February 5, 2012 Share Posted February 5, 2012 There was real choir in KotCS? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Incanus 5,716 Posted February 5, 2012 Share Posted February 5, 2012 Yes I think there are two pieces in the finale of the film that used a real choir. Both are on the OST: Hidden Treasure and the City of Gold and Temple Ruins and the Secret Revealed. The high female choir as Spalko approaches the alien skeletons sounds real to me as does the one used in the finale where Spalko is disintegrated.Also it says Choir: Hollywood Film Chorale in the credits of the soundtrack booklet Indy4. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
indy4 155 Posted February 6, 2012 Share Posted February 6, 2012 Oh wow, I had no idea. Thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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