BLUMENKOHL 1,068 Posted March 31, 2006 Share Posted March 31, 2006 To be honest, I like Doyle's efforts for GoF. As some might remember, I initially hated it...mainly because of the "it's not JW" shock factor...But I got over that...and now...And now... I don't believe that Williams could do much better. I've never been a fan of his subdued dark epic scores...Doyle's material works perfectly with the movie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Docteur Qui 1,544 Posted March 31, 2006 Share Posted March 31, 2006 But that's just it - what would have Williams written? If we all remember, PoA was a huge shock for all of us - albeit a brilliant shock. Is that because Doyle's score is a "subdued, epic" affair? In that case, how couldn't Williams do a better job? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Mark 3,631 Posted March 31, 2006 Share Posted March 31, 2006 Doyle's score has a few good cues i the first half of the film,that's about it.Williams scoring the final wand duel could have been the most brilliant thing ever.Williams always rises to those moments,like Buckbeak's Flight in PoA.K.M.Who's opinion hasn't changed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Crichton 4 Posted March 31, 2006 Share Posted March 31, 2006 Williams would have knocked The First Task out of the park too, Doyle's cue for that was pretty medicore. Every time I see the movie I can't help but hum the Flying Theme every time Harry jumps on his Firebolt. Doyle did do a good job on the Second Task, however. One of the best cues he did.John- who's opinion also hasn't changed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gkgyver 1,646 Posted March 31, 2006 Share Posted March 31, 2006 I just rewatched GoF on DVD and couldn't help but think that it's pretty poorly spotted as well. Well, "poor" is maybe too strong a word, but the spotting is definitely not the best, and neither are the ideas behind it. In the graveyard scnene, I don't like how Doyle scores every dramatic moment with a dissonant trumpet chord, which he often doesn't even build up to; it's painful for the ears and distracts from the movie.It's either this overbearing sound or a whisp of melodic nothing, like during Dumbledore's final speech to all the students. I keep playing Harry's Wondrous World in my mind during this scene. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Docteur Qui 1,544 Posted April 1, 2006 Share Posted April 1, 2006 I think the worst spotted scene in that whole film is Ron and Harry's argument. The music was ridiculous; it shouldn't have had anything at all underscoring it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bowie 45 Posted April 1, 2006 Share Posted April 1, 2006 I bet people would still hound me if I suggested the task of rescoring the film with Williams music. Ouch. Nobody liked that idea which I thought would be a fun challenge (if possible). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeinAR 1,949 Posted April 1, 2006 Author Share Posted April 1, 2006 To be honest, I like Doyle's efforts for GoF. As some might remember, I initially hated it...mainly because of the "it's not JW" shock factor...But I got over that...and now...And now... I don't believe that Williams could do much better. I've never been a fan of his subdued dark epic scores...Doyle's material works perfectly with the movie.sorry have to disagree with you, you don't believe Williams could do much better, hello, Harry Potter and the Sorcerer's StoneFawkes the Phoenix, Chamber of Secrets, Buckbeaks Flight, Window to the Past, hello, HELLO, IS ANYBODY THERE. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Damo 0 Posted April 1, 2006 Share Posted April 1, 2006 I have to disagree also I think John Williams is capable of doing much better. Doyle score for GOF is a OKAY score and it work alright with the film but since John Williams started off with Harry Potter film series he should of stayed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panthera 0 Posted April 1, 2006 Share Posted April 1, 2006 A lot of you are biased. This is a John Williams message board after all.And ya, its true, a lot of potter fans are the same way about Patrick Doyle.I like all 4 Harry Potter scores, and the 4th is good, but the the others some of the others are better for obvious reasons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Docteur Qui 1,544 Posted April 1, 2006 Share Posted April 1, 2006 Yes, but why are they biased? Because Williams music speaks to them much more than others. You can't just say "you're biased because you like Williams"; opinions are still valid, they're just influenced a bit more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unlucky Bastard 7,782 Posted April 1, 2006 Share Posted April 1, 2006 Potterfans elsewhere on the net seemed to eat up Doyle's score and always gave ill-informed criticisms of Williams' scores for the sake of it. There seems to be a good balance here.Personally, I reckon Doyle's score wouldn't be out of place in a Rick Berman produced TV show, stale and and almost themeless. Despite that, people are, of course, entitled to like it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Docteur Qui 1,544 Posted April 1, 2006 Share Posted April 1, 2006 I don't understand the criticism for Williams' first two scores. It's almost irrational to me. It's not like there are reasons other than personal taste like with GoF - there's no "previous composer" or continuity issues. It's strange... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
minimike 0 Posted April 1, 2006 Share Posted April 1, 2006 I thought you might like to know that I have uploaded an unrerleased piece of music from GOF at http://www.scorewars.port5.com/HTML%20File...s/GOFreview.htm which is Doyle's take on the full version of Hedwig's Theme. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gkgyver 1,646 Posted April 1, 2006 Share Posted April 1, 2006 This is better than the entire score. And it's just a new arrangement of Williams' theme. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Mark 3,631 Posted April 1, 2006 Share Posted April 1, 2006 Thanks,that's the best part of the entire score.jK.M. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted April 1, 2006 Share Posted April 1, 2006 It's the best rendition of Hedwig I have ever heard.Doyle managed to bring out something onto that theme, that even Williams was never able too.To bad they are both dead now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Mark 3,631 Posted April 1, 2006 Share Posted April 1, 2006 There is a Williams version of Hedwigs's theme that sounds like that,the one in the first HP PS teaser trailer,near the end.K.M. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gkgyver 1,646 Posted April 1, 2006 Share Posted April 1, 2006 Every composer with a sane mind would want to record a version of Hedwig's Theme with a little more weight; and don't think Williams won't do it and do it better, should he ever do a Potter movie again.I'm very sure that Williams will at least score film 7, if he isn't dead or retired by then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panthera 0 Posted April 2, 2006 Share Posted April 2, 2006 I'm very sure that Williams will at least score film 7, if he isn't dead or retired by then.Retirement would be sad, but death would be horrible, especially if it isn't even from old age.And thanks for the new track. Do you know where it would be on the soundtrack if everything was in chronological order? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Henry B 50 Posted April 2, 2006 Share Posted April 2, 2006 I thought you might like to know that I have uploaded an unrerleased piece of music from GOF at http://www.scorewars.port5.com/HTML%20File...s/GOFreview.htm which is Doyle's take on the full version of Hedwig's Theme.Sweet. That wasn't in the film, though. It sounds a bit like the music where we see a Hogwarts tower and Harry eating breakfast, but... better. I may have to buy the DVD and rip all this awesome unreleased music (like the end credits). Then assemble a expanded CD list. Well. Nahhh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Crichton 4 Posted April 2, 2006 Share Posted April 2, 2006 I may have to buy the DVD and rip all this awesome unreleased music (like the end credits). Then assemble a expanded CD list. Well. Nahhh. LOL I'm half tempted to rip the end credits, it has a good statement of Hedwig's Theme. Then I'd also have an excuse to burn a new copy with unreleased music, and without the Cocker crap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
minimike 0 Posted April 2, 2006 Share Posted April 2, 2006 Retirement would be sad, but death would be horrible, especially if it isn't even from old age. And thanks for the new track. Do you know where it would be on the soundtrack if everything was in chronological order?.I think it accompanies a scene with the owelry (Doyle specifically associated this theme with owls) but I'm not sure where it was in the film Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Docteur Qui 1,544 Posted April 2, 2006 Share Posted April 2, 2006 I've got the end credits somewhere I think if anyone wants it. Just PM me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marcus 390 Posted April 2, 2006 Share Posted April 2, 2006 Greetings!Honestly, I find the Doyle rendition of "Hedwig's Theme" to be a very good demonstration of all of the qualities in Williams' writing absent in Doyle's. And, again, Doyle is an O.K. film composer.John Williams is a GREAT composer, who happens to write for film. The harmonic "twists" Doyle adds actually gives the theme a more streamlined, or should I say mainstream, harmonic profile, very much in the musical lingo of most composers working in the field today. Not that there's anything wrong with that. But Williams adds a sense of craft, a sense of style, a finesse, unparallelled by Doyle (and everyone else).Texturally, harmonically, orchestrationally...Williams' renditions are FAR superior!But it is always interesting to see another composer's take on a colleague's material.And I pray Williams is bored enough to return to the Harry Potter series... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cmu2401 0 Posted April 2, 2006 Share Posted April 2, 2006 It's funny how people can hear things differently. If anything, most film composers try to copy (and fail to copy) Williams' style. Doyle's sound is among the most distinctive, you can instantly tell his stamp on any material, including Hedwig's Theme - you will never confuse his sound with anyone else's, particularly not Williams. Williams of course is highly distinctive too - but more composers are chasing after his example. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BLUMENKOHL 1,068 Posted April 2, 2006 Share Posted April 2, 2006 To be honest, his rendition of Hedwig's Theme reminded me of Henry V more than anything... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gkgyver 1,646 Posted April 2, 2006 Share Posted April 2, 2006 Doyle's sound is among the most distinctive, you can instantly tell his stamp on any material, including Hedwig's Theme - you will never confuse his sound with anyone else's, particularly not Williams.The Story Continues: Danny ElfmanQuidditch World Cup: Media VenturesThe Dark Mark: Danny Elfman + Media VenturesRita Skeeter: Doyle trying to sound like WilliamsGolden Egg: Doyle trying to sound like Williams + Media Venturesthe two waltzes: Doyle trying not to be genericHarry In Winter: Doyle trying to sound like Howard Shore, but instead of being positively static, he's annoyingly static Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Breathmask 555 Posted April 2, 2006 Share Posted April 2, 2006 Anything featuring a certain kind of percussion seems to get labeled as being "Media Ventures" with a bad ring to it.So what of the end of Prologue from War of the Worlds? I was reminded of Backdraft when I heard it, but I suppose because it's Williams, it's "daring stylistic deviation."- Marc, who thinks good things have come out of MV from time to time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marian Schedenig 8,211 Posted April 2, 2006 Share Posted April 2, 2006 The Story Continues: Danny ElfmanQuidditch World Cup: Media VenturesThe Dark Mark: Danny Elfman + Media VenturesRita Skeeter: Doyle trying to sound like WilliamsGolden Egg: Doyle trying to sound like Williams + Media Venturesthe two waltzes: Doyle trying not to be genericHarry In Winter: Doyle trying to sound like Howard Shore, but instead of being positively static, he's annoyingly staticLOLMarian - :? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BLUMENKOHL 1,068 Posted April 3, 2006 Share Posted April 3, 2006 I don't get what's so horrible about MV and MV-like material...they've had their downs...but they've had quality material as well.*Happily Listening to and enjoying....Spanglish, Last Samurai, King Arthur, Pearl Harbor, Hannibal, Prince of Egypt, CrimsonTide, Backdraft...etc. etc.* No I wouldn't want MV scoring Potter. And I love the "MV track of GoF" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BurgaFlippinMan 7 Posted April 3, 2006 Share Posted April 3, 2006 I have no problems with the MV sound, or as I prefer to call it, the Zimmer sound. Like many said, good stuff has come out of him before. I think my main problem with the MV sound is that its being overused by with all the Zimmer proteges/clones out there that its actually becoming more and more generic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panthera 0 Posted April 3, 2006 Share Posted April 3, 2006 Has anyone made a complete Goblet of Fire soundtrack? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BLUMENKOHL 1,068 Posted April 3, 2006 Share Posted April 3, 2006 Unfortunately people involved with Harry Potter scores are not very good at leaking much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gkgyver 1,646 Posted April 3, 2006 Share Posted April 3, 2006 On a side note, can anyone find his way through the Leaky Cauldron Forum? You need the Marauder's Map to find anything there. All those sub- forums with the 100 % spoiler- free titles, I wouldn't even know where to look for a complete GoF score (had I actually the urge to get ahold of one).I bet if you open a GoF score thread there, it will be moved to a place you need ages to find before you get any valuable responses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BLUMENKOHL 1,068 Posted April 3, 2006 Share Posted April 3, 2006 On a side note, can anyone find his way through the Leaky Cauldron Forum? You need the Marauder's Map to find anything there. All those sub- forums with the 100 % spoiler- free titles, I wouldn't even know where to look for a complete GoF score (had I actually the urge to get ahold of one).I bet if you open a GoF score thread there, it will be moved to a place you need ages to find before you get any valuable responses.Considering a great many vistors to sites like MuggleNet and LeakCauldron fall below the age 18...I hardly doubt they have acquired complete GoF scores. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gkgyver 1,646 Posted April 4, 2006 Share Posted April 4, 2006 Even if I wanted to make a complete score, I wouldn't know how to convert the sic mono files into stereo again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Henry B 50 Posted April 4, 2006 Share Posted April 4, 2006 The end credits are 2:23:48-2:26:33. Unfortunately, GoF doesn't have a stereo mix, so you'll have to tediously mix all six surround channels into stereo.I'm running on the dodgy assumption that the CD is entirely in chronological order (except for the songs). Is this actually true? "Hogwarts Hymn" doesn't feature anywhere in the movie, so I placed it at the end of my arrangement. It might also fit into the customary concert theme Track 2 position. Still looking for the menu that features Hedwig's theme (the MP3 was cool, but I am definitely planning to rip it in WAVE format). There are probably other unreleased cues in the menus, too. Some of those were notable... I remember a pretty neat cue for the unveiling of the Goblet.Again, let me stress that this new clip of Hedwig's theme does not feature in the film. It's different - and better. It seems to be an alternative version of the music for the scene in which we see a Hogwarts tower, mail is delivered, and the Patil twins say hello. The music heard in the film is more similar to the beginning of "Foreign Visitors Arrive." In fact, it's practically the same, save for some sloppy twinkling sounds and a lower octave for the violins. The music heard in the menu is probably the original music for this sequence (toned down for the film at the director's request?). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ray Barnsbury 8 Posted April 4, 2006 Share Posted April 4, 2006 In other news, the door is able to be opened again...Ray Barnsbury - who cheated after a lot of painstaking trial and error Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gkgyver 1,646 Posted April 4, 2006 Share Posted April 4, 2006 Yes, I believe the CD is actually in chronological order. Just "Voldemort" has several cues that don't appear in the graveyard scene. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Composer_Fan 2 Posted April 4, 2006 Share Posted April 4, 2006 In other news, the door is able to be opened again...Ray Barnsbury - who cheated after a lot of painstaking trial and errorDo you get anything of worth after completing that horrible quiz?~Tyler, who quit after the first few questions.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marian Schedenig 8,211 Posted April 4, 2006 Share Posted April 4, 2006 In other news, the door is able to be opened again...How?Marian - who can't open it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Crichton 4 Posted April 4, 2006 Share Posted April 4, 2006 Too late, the Do Not Disturb sign is back up. I couldn't get it either, I could never get the rock to break the mirror. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panthera 0 Posted April 4, 2006 Share Posted April 4, 2006 I've got the end credits somewhere I think if anyone wants it. Just PM me.Did you end up finding them? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Docteur Qui 1,544 Posted April 5, 2006 Share Posted April 5, 2006 Sadly, no. I won't stop looking though. Sorry if I got your hopes up! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Henry B 50 Posted April 5, 2006 Share Posted April 5, 2006 Eh, I'll send out the credits to anyone who's interested. Drop a PM. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ray Barnsbury 8 Posted April 8, 2006 Share Posted April 8, 2006 Well, I got an "Acceptable" on my W.O.M.B.A.T. test....I forget, how good is that? Ray Barnsbury - who thought the test was ridiculously hard, and mostly just guessed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Henry B 50 Posted April 8, 2006 Share Posted April 8, 2006 Looks like there is quite a lot of unreleased music in the DVD menus. Time for an expanded track list. ^_^ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nightscape94 965 Posted April 8, 2006 Share Posted April 8, 2006 Well, I got an "Acceptable" on my W.O.M.B.A.T. test....I forget, how good is that?I think that's middle ground. Tim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Henry B 50 Posted April 8, 2006 Share Posted April 8, 2006 OK, I have a zip file to send out with five pieces of unreleased music:beauxbatons.mp3 - the entrance of the Beauxbatons girlsEnd Credits.mp3hedwig.mp3 - alternative version of the "owl post" musicportkey.mp3 - excerpt from the use of the portkey at the beginning of the filmunknown.mp3 - ?With these in consideration, that makes the entire track list:1. The Story Continues2. Frank Dies3. The Portkey (portkey.mp3)4. The Quidditch World Cup5. The Dark Mark6. Foreign Visitors Arrive7. Entrance of Beauxbatons (beauxbatons.mp3)8. Hogwarts' Hymn (this theme is heard briefly in the orientation scene, so I figured this was as good a place as any for it)9. The Goblet of Fire10. Rita Skeeter11. Sirius Fire12. Harry Sees Dragons13. Golden Egg14. Owl Post (hedwig.mp3)15. Neville's Waltz16. Harry in Winter17. Potter Waltz18. Underwater Secrets19. The Black Lake20. Hogwarts' March21. The Maze22. Voldemort23. Death of Cedric24. Another Year Ends25. End Credits (End Credits.mp3)26. Do the Hippogriff27. This Is the Night28. Magic WorksOnce somebody identifies unknown1.mp3, I will of course incorporate it into this list. PM for a download link. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts