The Hobbit Film Trilogy Thread

[Brónach 1,302]

But doesn't Rhosgobel get attacked by spiders? Which are in Mirkwood?

[Jay 37,372]

Hmm. Maybe Gandalf takes an Eagle to Rhosgobel

Where does this supposed "spider-attack" rumor come from?

[BloodBoal 7,538]

[Jay 37,372]

Hmmm, guess I missed that.

BTW, here's a link to the old story of the comic-con footage, discussing both Gandalf in Dol Guldur and Gandalf meeting Radagast by the "Ringwraith Tombs".

http://newboards.theonering.net/forum/gforum/perl/gforum.cgi?do=post_view_threaded;post=440598;sb=post_time;so=DESC;guest=12914338

Still curious there's no ringwraith theme on the OST. Maybe it will be part of the re-scored cues they recorded after the OSTs were locked

[BloodBoal 7,538]

[Jay 37,372]

So when you said the second trailer shows the spiders attacking Rhosgobel, you were referring to the single shot of something entering Radagast's roof, which does indeed look like a spider leg? The shot that appears at 3:54 of the combined trailer posted on this page?

Hmm. Then maybe you are right and the film just shifts over to Radagast, and he gets attacked and flees on his bunny sled, and somehow meets up with Gandalf when he leaves the party for the first time, they have a conversation, and he races back to the company to save them from the trolls.

Though, why does the trailer show Radagast talking about the evil returning out loud in his house if Gandalf is not there? Is he just talking to himself?

Still doesn't completely explain the placement of the Dol Guldur tracks on the OST, and don't forget Radagast's theme also appears in The Hill of Sorcery on the OST.

[BloodBoal 7,538]

[Jay 37,372]

I wonder what reason the film will have for suddenly showing a brand new character alone in his house (talking to himself no less) soon after the company leaves the Shire. Maybe they will be walking and Gandalf will start to tell them about his "cousin" Radagast and then it will transfer. Actually, that makes a lot of sense based on how the OST track starts off, with the Journey theme and all - that's probably for footage of them walking while Gandalf is talking. So your original idea was right!

But since the "Radagast The Brown" track appears after the "An Ancient Enemy" track, I guess Gandald does tell the Dol Guldur story in two halves like I thought, once there before we transfer to Radagast, and again after everyone is reunited (in "The Hill Of Sorcery" track). Since Radagast's Theme is in the "Hill of Sorcery" track, I guess Gandalf meets him in Dol Guldur (like how the comic con audience said the footage showed them bumping into each other near the Nazgul tombs).

I wonder if Radagast actually journeys back to the company with Gandalf and helps free them from the trolls, and he leaves the company for good when they get attacked by wargs and then we never see him again.

[BloodBoal 7,538]

[Brónach 1,302]

The Prologue as scored October-ish doesn't seem to have anything related to Dol Guldur. It also would be kind of weird to put anything there.

[KK 3,307]

There are other moments in the film though where there could be Dol Guldur flashback material: the prologue, Rivendell (probably during the White Council scene, and let's not forget the The Defiler track!). One thing seems certain, though: there won't be any Dol Guldur-related material after they leave Rivendell.

And yet there's still plenty of Mordor Descending Third after the Rivendell scenes in the music. Of course that could mean a lot of things...

But since the "Radagast The Brown" track appears after the "An Ancient Enemy" track, I guess Gandald does tell the Dol Guldur story in two halves like I thought, once there before we transfer to Radagast, and again after everyone is reunited (in "The Hill Of Sorcery" track). Since Radagast's Theme is in the "Hill of Sorcery" track, I guess Gandalf meets him in Dol Guldur (like how the comic con audience said the footage showed them bumping into each other near the Nazgul tombs).

Early on, "An Ancient Enemy", Gandalf is probably exploring Dol Goldur alone (this was his first expedition and will be told in flashback form to the dwarves). Later, we are introduced to Radagast in "Radagast the Brown". In this scene, he gets attacked by the spiders. Radagast is now attempting to track down where this "evil" is coming from. Later Gandalf's left the company and bumps into Radagast close to Dol Goldur and then they do some exploring together. This is when the "Hill of Sorcery" plays.

The initial exploration and discovery of the map and the key will be told in flashback to the company of dwarves on some night camp (as BB suggested). Later, Gandalf goes exploring again and that's when he bumps into Radagast (Hill of Sorcery). The whole story isn't told here though (it'll show what's happening but maybe not everything they saw). The story is then told in Rivendell during "White Council" where he either dictates what he found or is told again in flasback mode (due to the extensive statements of Sauron's Theme).

Hopefully that makes some sense.

[gkgyver 1,645]

This movie is going to have almost the exact shape of Fellowship.

Prologue to set up the film.

Gandalf arrives at Bag End.

A magic item is revealed (the map and the key instead of the Ring)

A company sets out.

Gandalf journeys to find evil (Dol Guldur instead of Saruman)

They bump into trolls (not ringwraiths)

They bump into them again, are rescued by elves (Arwen).

They arrive in Rivendell, a council takes place (White Council, not Elrond's)

The company sets out again.

Is forced to hide in the mountain by stone giants (instead of Caradhras)

Is meeting a horde of orcs under the mountain and fleeing from it (Moria).

[Jay 37,372]

And yet there's still plenty of Mordor Descending Third after the Rivendell scenes in the music. Of course that could mean a lot of things...

I think its clear the film's Misty Mountains orcs (goblins) will be under the control/will of Sauron.

Early on, "An Ancient Enemy", Gandalf is probably exploring Dol Goldur alone (this was his first expedition and will be told in flashback form to the dwarves). Later, we are introduced to Radagast in "Radagast the Brown". In this scene, he gets attacked by the spiders. Radagast is now attempting to track down where this "evil" is coming from. Later Gandalf's left the company and bumps into Radagast close to Dol Goldur and then they do some exploring together. This is when the "Hill of Sorcery" plays.

Nah that doesn't work because Gandalf doesn't leave the company again after returning to save them from the trolls until after Rivendell. In fact he doesn't leave them until after Beorn.

The initial exploration and discovery of the map and the key will be told in flashback to the company of dwarves on some night camp (as BB suggested). Later, Gandalf goes exploring again and that's when he bumps into Radagast (Hill of Sorcery). The whole story isn't told here though (it'll show what's happening but maybe not everything they saw). The story is then told in Rivendell during "White Council" where he either dictates what he found or is told again in flasback mode (due to the extensive statements of Sauron's Theme).

Hopefully that makes some sense.

Nah that doesn't work because as I said Gandalf doesn't leave again until way later during Film 2. Plus Gandalf doesn't need to explore Dol Guldur again since he knew 100 years before The Hobbit that the Necromancer was Sauron. But Saruman had convinced them to do nothing for 100 years. But by the time of the White Council shown in the film he will finally agree to expunge Sauron from there.

[Incanus 5,715]

I still can't fathom how the hell will Gandalf suddenly take off for Dol Guldur, which is at the southern end of Mirkwood (Rhosgobel is somewhere in the Anduin Vale, close to Mirkwood in the narrows of the forest (a bit south of the middle parts of Mirkwood). Geographically such a turn just doesn't make any sense because Gandalf just can't travel there in day or two. And as mentioned by me and many other people Gandalf already knew Sauron was at Dol Guldur during the time of the Hobbit. It took those 100 years to persuade the White Council to act, which I think we will see in the film now. Could be that they have really altered the events so that Gandalf goes to Dol Guldur to give him some more to do and unravel a mystery but it feels rather odd to conincide it with the Quest. I am hoping for flashbacks and then again Radagast as a messenger, who just brings dark tidings of the growing power of Sauron, which prompts Gandalf to push for attack on Dol Guldur in the council.

A on the map is the most probable place for Rhosgobel based on Tolkien's writings. B is another suggested site. And Mirkwood is on the other side of the Misty Mountains. I think Bunnies of Doom could make the journey in a day or two but not Gandalf.

[BloodBoal 7,538]

[Incanus 5,715]

I'll just wait for the movie and won't have to worry about it no more.

[BloodBoal 7,538]

[Incanus 5,715]

Oh what counsels we take in this thread! I always think to myself: I am off to JWFan for some heavy thinking!

[BloodBoal 7,538]

[Incanus 5,715]

Indeed. These halls of Ricard Befan amid the voids of internet are perfect, whether you liked food, or sleep, or work, or story-telling, or singing, or just sitting and thinking best, or a pleasant mixture of them all. Evil things did not come on that website (until recently).

[BloodBoal 7,538]

[KK 3,307]

Early on, "An Ancient Enemy", Gandalf is probably exploring Dol Goldur alone (this was his first expedition and will be told in flashback form to the dwarves). Later, we are introduced to Radagast in "Radagast the Brown". In this scene, he gets attacked by the spiders. Radagast is now attempting to track down where this "evil" is coming from. Later Gandalf's left the company and bumps into Radagast close to Dol Goldur and then they do some exploring together. This is when the "Hill of Sorcery" plays.

Nah that doesn't work because Gandalf doesn't leave the company again after returning to save them from the trolls until after Rivendell. In fact he doesn't leave them until after Beorn.

But thats what I'm saying. The first expedition takes place long before the Hobbit and is shown as a flashback. The 2nd expedition will happen before he returns to save the company from the dwarves. The 1st trip is what gets him the map and the key, the 2nd is where he would discover Sauron because as BloodBoal said, they wouldn't make so Gandalf knows about the Necromancer from the beginning of the film.

[Incanus 5,715]

Early on, "An Ancient Enemy", Gandalf is probably exploring Dol Goldur alone (this was his first expedition and will be told in flashback form to the dwarves). Later, we are introduced to Radagast in "Radagast the Brown". In this scene, he gets attacked by the spiders. Radagast is now attempting to track down where this "evil" is coming from. Later Gandalf's left the company and bumps into Radagast close to Dol Goldur and then they do some exploring together. This is when the "Hill of Sorcery" plays.

Nah that doesn't work because Gandalf doesn't leave the company again after returning to save them from the trolls until after Rivendell. In fact he doesn't leave them until after Beorn.

But thats what I'm saying. The first expedition takes place long before the Hobbit and is shown as a flashback. The 2nd expedition will happen before he returns to save the company from the dwarves. The 1st trip is what gets him the map and the key, the 2nd is where he would discover Sauron because as BloodBoal said, they wouldn't make so Gandalf knows about the Necromancer from the beginning of the film.

I fail to see the purpose of the White Council's gathering if they are just coming to say each other a hello in Rivendell when the Dwarves arrive. I thought they were deciding on their actions against Sauron there and then. I can't fathom how Gandalf can gallop to Mirkwood somewhere in between but I guess it has to happen that way.

[Jonesy 55]

BREAKING NEWS! The info below (from Brian Sibley's book, as always) gives us a good idea about what kind of humor to expect from the film.

Apparently, the Goblin King's throne will be a... toilet-throne. Hahahaha...

P.S.: the info was mentioned on TORN forum. I do not have the book, so please do not ask me to send you a copy/scan of it. I don't do illegal things like that, except if you're willing to pay a big price for it.

This video might confirm it:

[BloodBoal 7,538]

[crumbs 14,318]

So Saruman is in the first film and the third film? OR?

[BloodBoal 7,538]

He is in the first film for sure. We don't know yet if he will appear in Film 2 and/or 3 or not.

[Jay 37,372]

Oh I assume he will for sure be in Film 2, as I expect Gandalf, Saruman, possibly Radagast, and possibly Elrond and Galadriel are all involved in going to Dol Guldur to expunge Sauron.

I think all the Sauron business will be over with by the end of Film 2 and Film 3 will mostly just focus on the Battle of Five Armies.... unless of course the rumors are true that The Necromancer will appear at the Battle of Five Armies

[Quintus 5,399]

Haha imagine that!

Jacko is gonna bum rape so many fans with this, I'm tensing up down there just at the thought!

[Brónach 1,302]

I think McCoy said he hadn't shot any scene with Christopher Lee.

[Jay 37,372]

Maybe Gandalf uses Legolas and Tauriel to expunge Sauron from Dol Guldur

[crocodile 8,018]

Jacko is gonna bum rape so many fans with this, I'm tensing up down there just at the thought!

I think at this point it seems reasonable just to relax and loosen up. You know it will happen, why make it hurt?

Karol

[Once 605]

I think McCoy said he hadn't shot any scene with Christopher Lee.

Well, nobody did, did they? I mean, Christopher Lee shot his scenes in England on green screen, right?

[Quintus 5,399]

Jacko is gonna bum rape so many fans with this, I'm tensing up down there just at the thought!

I think at this point it seems reasonable just to relax and loosen up. You know it will happen, why make it hurt?

Karol

Pro tip?

[crocodile 8,018]

I was listening to the track called Remembering Willie when I read your post.

Karol

[Quintus 5,399]

It must be difficult to forget him since by all accounts he left quite the 'impression'.

[crocodile 8,018]

Peter Jackson was always more talented than George Lucas.

Karol

[KK 3,307]

Oh I assume he will for sure be in Film 2, as I expect Gandalf, Saruman, possibly Radagast, and possibly Elrond and Galadriel are all involved in going to Dol Guldur to expunge Sauron.

Elrond will probably be there since we've seen posters with him clad in full armour.

I think all the Sauron business will be over with by the end of Film 2 and Film 3 will mostly just focus on the Battle of Five Armies.... unless of course the rumors are true that The Necromancer will appear at the Battle of Five Armies

They got so close with RotK. I wouldn't be surprised if he decides to go through with it this time...

Maybe Gandalf uses Legolas and Turiel to expunge Sauron from Dol Guldur

It's Tauriel, T-A-U-R-I-E-L.

[Jay 37,372]

Damn, I keep doing that

Listening to the Hobbit OST again, I am now pretty sure "An Ancient Enemy" is for a scene where the film transfers over to Dol Guldur and we see The Necromancer talking to Bolg or something, telling him or other minions to attack Radagast and/or the Gandalf/dwarf company. And I think "Radagast The Brown" starts with the company traveling (Journey theme statement), then it transfers over to Radagast in his house talking to himself, then the action material is for the spider chase plus maybe something else after. (Does Gandalf arrive just in time to save him?).

"The Hill Of Sorcery" only really features Radagast's theme in the beginning then its mostly quiet, like Gandalf and Radagast meet up then explore the creepy tombs together for a while as the music builds to the reveal of... something. This is followed by the boldest statement of Sauron's theme on the OST, so I guess this is when they discover Necromancer = Sauron. Hmmm.

I can't figure out when Gandalf meeting Thrain and getting the key/map will be shown, or why the White Council OST track is SOO long. Seems like so much Dol Guldur material is covered before they get to Rivendell, what is left to be shown while there? Unless only PART of The White Council track covers the White Council, and the rest is for a conversation with the dwarves and Elrond and whoever else, and the Thrain/key/map story is told there. Hmm.

[BloodBoal 7,538]

[Jay 37,372]

You're right. It's gonna be Gandalf, Legolas, and Tauriel

[Faleel 5,359]

No, it will be Legolas, Tauriel and Fili.

(BTW Jay, another STTOS Disc tracklist was posted on FSM, you might want to quote it in the right thread.)

[BloodBoal 7,538]

[Brónach 1,302]

This film is an interesting exercise in fan fiction.

[BloodBoal 7,538]

[KK 3,307]

Damn, I keep doing that

Listening to the Hobbit OST again, I am now pretty sure "An Ancient Enemy" is for a scene where the film transfers over to Dol Guldur and we see The Necromancer talking to Bolg or something, telling him or other minions to attack Radagast and/or the Gandalf/dwarf company.

That can't be it. The track has several statements of Thorin's theme (or Thorin's Company theme...whatever you'd like to call it). Consider the many echoes it has of the Dwarven Moria material, my guess is that this is some flashback that Thorin is telling in story form. Maybe something to do with the capture of Thrain. Either that or its a scene with Gandalf's first exploration and the "Thorin theme" is really one for the dwarves in general. The former is more likely. But it can't just be the Necromancer giving some commands.

And I think "Radagast The Brown" starts with the company traveling (Journey theme statement), then it transfers over to Radagast in his house talking to himself, then the action material is for the spider chase plus maybe something else after. (Does Gandalf arrive just in time to save him?).

No. I doubt Gandalf does any saving. Radagast will likely be clever enough to survive and escape on his own (thus the glimpse of the epic Bunny of Doom chase we see in film). They're not going to make him completely pathetic. Gandalf and Radagast will share a separate scene. But the "Radagast the Brown" cue is likely only for Radagast's intro.

[Jay 37,372]

But then why is the track called An Ancient Enemy? Sauron has nothing to do with Thorin or the Erebor situation. Unless the Ancient Enemy refers to someone else....

[Faleel 5,359]

Smaug?

He is a dragon, as in 1st/2nd Age + Morgoth = Ancalagon/Glaurung

[Brónach 1,302]

I don't want to see a sudden scene of the Necromancer giving orders. That belongs in a Star Wars film, but here?

[Faleel 5,359]

I don't want to see a sudden scene of the Necromancer giving orders. That belongs in a Star Wars film, but here?

MARCH TO *INSERT* LEAVE..NONE..ALIVE!