JoeinAR 1,949 Posted October 31, 2007 Share Posted October 31, 2007 I love John Williams more than any composer, he's been my idle for 42 years, but even I must state the truth, Jerry Goldsmiths track, the Enterprise from Star Trek the Motion Picture is, IMHO, the greatest movie track of all time, greater than even the greatest track by John Williams. Granted it is only slightly better than John's greatest works, The Love Theme from Superman and Cadillac from the Skies, but yes, Enterprise is still better, even by a hairThe glory in the piece of music is beyond words. Nearly 30 years after first hearing it, I still get Jerrygasms from it. My eyes get weepy still on occassion. Its a testament to its greatness that it survives intact on the Directors cut of the film simply because the director(who felt the scene itself was too long) couldn't edit this one piece of music, its that good.No piece of music has ever survived the dark test or the car test better. I can't wait till lunch to hear it in my car. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luke Skywalker 1,796 Posted October 31, 2007 Share Posted October 31, 2007 I love John Williams more than any composer, he's been my idle for 42 years, but even I must state the truth, Jerry Goldsmiths track, the Enterprise from Star Trek the Motion Picture is, IMHO, the greatest movie track of all time, greater than even the greatest track by John Williams. Granted it is only slightly better than John's greatest works, The Love Theme from Superman and Cadillac from the Skies, but yes, Enterprise is still better, even by a hairThe glory in the piece of music is beyond words. Nearly 30 years after first hearing it, I still get Jerrygasms from it. My eyes get weepy still on occassion. Its a testament to its greatness that it survives intact on the Directors cut of the film simply because the director(who felt the scene itself was too long) couldn't edit this one piece of music, its that good.No piece of music has ever survived the dark test or the car test better. I can't wait till lunch to hear it in my car.Since your opinions are a little screwed of late, i wont take this into cosideration Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
indy4 155 Posted October 31, 2007 Share Posted October 31, 2007 It is, without a doubt, a fantastic track, the best of Jerry Goldsmith's (although I only have 2 JG CDS +one track). It is not my favorite track over all, though, I'm pretty sure that would be a JW, for me. Still a great track. So beautiful and exciting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted October 31, 2007 Share Posted October 31, 2007 Joe speaks the truth, let his worlds of wisdom be carved in stone!Though he did type idle instead of idol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Mark 3,631 Posted October 31, 2007 Share Posted October 31, 2007 It's a great track,but many JW tracks are even better Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted October 31, 2007 Share Posted October 31, 2007 Fanboy! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BurgaFlippinMan 7 Posted October 31, 2007 Share Posted October 31, 2007 i can think of a few Goldsmith tracks i like just as much... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robthehand 3 Posted October 31, 2007 Share Posted October 31, 2007 I can think of a few TMP tracks I like more. Though it's still one of the absolute best cues ever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trent B 337 Posted October 31, 2007 Share Posted October 31, 2007 I side with Joe easily on this one. The Enterprise cue is better than anything by Williams, including The Battle Of Hoth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted October 31, 2007 Share Posted October 31, 2007 If both Joe and Vosk are in agreement, then this cannot be false! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fommes 153 Posted October 31, 2007 Share Posted October 31, 2007 The Enterprise is not good enough even to kiss the feet of Baja Fuego. Now there! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted October 31, 2007 Share Posted October 31, 2007 Baja Fuego????Sounds like some Gustavo Santalalalala crap! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeinAR 1,949 Posted October 31, 2007 Author Share Posted October 31, 2007 If both Joe and Vosk are in agreement, then this cannot be false!If you and I, and Vosk all agree, calamity is at hand, yet the truth still exists, Enterprise is greater than anything, barely, that our maestro has created.right now at this very moment God's orchestra is playing Enterprise for him with Goldsmith conducting.Enterprise is simply so good that even Satan weeps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BLUMENKOHL 1,068 Posted October 31, 2007 Share Posted October 31, 2007 Here here Joey. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted October 31, 2007 Share Posted October 31, 2007 I am weaping too! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BLUMENKOHL 1,068 Posted October 31, 2007 Share Posted October 31, 2007 But you are satan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted October 31, 2007 Share Posted October 31, 2007 Does Satan arrange T-shirts for his fellow JWFans. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Delorean90 42 Posted October 31, 2007 Share Posted October 31, 2007 Man, did you ever set yourself up for that one! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ollie 1,059 Posted October 31, 2007 Share Posted October 31, 2007 While I respect Joe's opinion and agree that Goldsmith's Enterprise cue is quite possibly his best I cannot agree that it is better than anything Williams has composed.I can think of several Williams pieces that bring more "goosebumps" and emotions than that one cue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pieter Boelen 740 Posted October 31, 2007 Share Posted October 31, 2007 Its a testament to its greatness that it survives intact on the Directors cut of the film simply because the director(who felt the scene itself was too long) couldn't edit this one piece of music, its that good.Is that true? That's brilliant and indeed awesome proof of movie music done right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeinAR 1,949 Posted October 31, 2007 Author Share Posted October 31, 2007 While I respect Joe's opinion and agree that Goldsmith's Enterprise cue is quite possibly his best I cannot agree that it is better than anything Williams has composed.I can think of several Williams pieces that bring more "goosebumps" and emotions than that one cue.you're not the first to say they can name some better Williams pieces, yet no one has named any.Joe, waiting for some moron to say Across the Stars and mean it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ollie 1,059 Posted October 31, 2007 Share Posted October 31, 2007 The Battle Of Yavin, E.T.'s Adventure on Earth (Perhaps the best 15 mins of music composed by Williams), Helicopter Rescue from Superman and Desert Chase from Raiders. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trent B 337 Posted October 31, 2007 Share Posted October 31, 2007 Ya so what if Joe and I are in agreement on something? It's happened before, yes it it's a rare occasion but in this instance I definitely agree with him.I will also agree again with Joe that if someone says Across The Stars is better and means it consider yourself dead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Henry B 50 Posted October 31, 2007 Share Posted October 31, 2007 "The Enterprise" is impressive, but I don't think it's one of the best cues ever.I think it's a left/right brain kind of thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ollie 1,059 Posted October 31, 2007 Share Posted October 31, 2007 Baja Fuego????Sounds like some Gustavo Santalalalala crap!And you call yourself a Goldsmith fan...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeinAR 1,949 Posted October 31, 2007 Author Share Posted October 31, 2007 no its more of a IM right brain, your wrong brain kind of think, LOL.I do state in the intial post IMHO.I think John's best ques are the Love Theme from Superman, Cadillac from the Skies, and Adventures on Earth, he's done so many great cues, course the majority of those are from the 70's and 80's, with a few from the 90's and even fewer from the 00's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeshopk 8 Posted October 31, 2007 Share Posted October 31, 2007 It's quite a great piece of music, but I don't hold it quite as high. However, Joe has been listening to that track far longer than me, so maybe it's sunk in to his veins deeper. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morlock 11 Posted October 31, 2007 Share Posted October 31, 2007 Baja Fuego????Sounds like some Gustavo Santalalalala crap!And you call yourself a Goldsmith fan...... It's actually Bajo Fuego, you so called Mark Olivarez. And it is one of Jerry's best tracks, from one of his best scores (my favorite). Morlock- who is quite fond of the Enterprise theme, as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ollie 1,059 Posted October 31, 2007 Share Posted October 31, 2007 Huh? I don't get your post.I was criticizing Steef for mis-spelling it and comparing it to Gustavo.Or did you make a typo? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neimoidian 14 Posted October 31, 2007 Share Posted October 31, 2007 When it comes to goosebumps, we talk less about the T R U T H, but rather the sentiment, and I can understand you have a great sentiment for that track, Joe. "Enterprise" is truly fantastic, but since I haven't even watched "ST:TMP" and I have been hearing the score for only a month (really!), I have got no such sentiment. Neither does it evoke the same emotions as a piece itself. You mentioned "Love Theme" from "Superman" - for me this is IT. So are tracks like the beginning and finale of ET or particular cues from "Star Wars" and "Emipre...". While I highly appreciate and like Goldsmith's music, it's never made an impact on me that would have be comparable to the one JW has. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morlock 11 Posted October 31, 2007 Share Posted October 31, 2007 Huh? I don't get your post.I was criticizing Steef for mis-spelling it and comparing it to Gustavo.Or did you make a typo? I apologize, I thought you typed the original post (and mis-spelling), when, in fact, it was Fommes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ray Barnsbury 8 Posted October 31, 2007 Share Posted October 31, 2007 It's quite nice, but I like many, many tracks by Williams, Goldsmith, and numerous other composers better.Ray Barnsbury Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red 75 Posted October 31, 2007 Share Posted October 31, 2007 "Across the Stars" is great, the first time you hear it. After you hear it a few times, it loses its charm. It's maybe John's most overrated work (lately at least). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Crichton 4 Posted November 1, 2007 Share Posted November 1, 2007 I love Across the Stars. I'll defend Across the Stars. It's a great theme.But it's not better than The Enterprise.That aside, I'm with KM, Mark, and Ray. Superb, but some Williams cues are better. I'm surprised KM didn't bring up The Dark Side Beckons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
indy4 155 Posted November 1, 2007 Share Posted November 1, 2007 While I respect Joe's opinion and agree that Goldsmith's Enterprise cue is quite possibly his best I cannot agree that it is better than anything Williams has composed.I can think of several Williams pieces that bring more "goosebumps" and emotions than that one cue.you're not the first to say they can name some better Williams pieces, yet no one has named any.Joe, waiting for some moron to say Across the Stars and mean it.From JW, off the top of my head: Secrets of the Castle, Mischief Managed!, Swing, Swing, Swing, Prelude and Main Title March from Superman, Escape/Chase/Saying Goodbye, Remembering Childhood, Fawkes the Phoenix....From others, of the top of my head: Introduction (Edward Scissorhands), Ice Dance (Edward Scissorhands), King of Pride Rock (The Lion King), Morgan's Ride/Main Title (Cutthroat Island), Up is Down (POTC: AWE)....Like I said, a fabulous, fabulous track, I think that that and Soarin' (from Soarin' Over California) are JG's best. I love Across the Stars. I'll defend Across the Stars. It's a great theme.But it's not better than The Enterprise.That aside, I'm with KM, Mark, and Ray. Superb, but some Williams cues are better. I'm surprised KM didn't bring up The Dark Side Beckons.I agree with everything you just said. AtS is a great theme, it's not better than the Enterprise, and there are several JW tracks that are better than Enterprise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trent B 337 Posted November 1, 2007 Share Posted November 1, 2007 Just the sheer build up to the Star Trek theme in "The Enterprise" alone is what makes the whole cue the greatest cue written, if that makes sense.Speaking of which I'm gonna play the cue now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morlock 11 Posted November 1, 2007 Share Posted November 1, 2007 Sure that makes sense, to someone who loves Star Trek. I love the theme, but was never so enamored with the magic of the world to be totally captivated by six minutes of it. I love it, I love all the variations....but it doesn't build and add up to the awe inspiring cue I hear described. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marian Schedenig 8,211 Posted November 1, 2007 Share Posted November 1, 2007 Oh yes it does! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Crichton 4 Posted November 1, 2007 Share Posted November 1, 2007 I agree with Morlock to an extent. For me it's the theme, not that specific cue, that's so magical. I enjoy it as much in pretty much every statement it gets. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morlock 11 Posted November 1, 2007 Share Posted November 1, 2007 .....For me. I don't doubt the veracity of others love for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hitch 57 Posted November 1, 2007 Share Posted November 1, 2007 If both Joe and Vosk are in agreement, then this cannot be false!At least I lived long enough to read that. For the record Santaolalla is the new Goldsmith. Jerry's dead my friends. You can call him...Gusto. And as you can see, he's a lot happier. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Henry B 50 Posted November 1, 2007 Share Posted November 1, 2007 While I respect Joe's opinion and agree that Goldsmith's Enterprise cue is quite possibly his best I cannot agree that it is better than anything Williams has composed.I can think of several Williams pieces that bring more "goosebumps" and emotions than that one cue.you're not the first to say they can name some better Williams pieces, yet no one has named any.Joe, waiting for some moron to say Across the Stars and mean it.From JW, off the top of my head: Secrets of the Castle, Mischief Managed!, Swing, Swing, Swing, Prelude and Main Title March from Superman, Escape/Chase/Saying Goodbye, Remembering Childhood, Fawkes the Phoenix....From others, of the top of my head: Introduction (Edward Scissorhands), Ice Dance (Edward Scissorhands), King of Pride Rock (The Lion King), Morgan's Ride/Main Title (Cutthroat Island), Up is Down (POTC: AWE)....Like I said, a fabulous, fabulous track, I think that that and Soarin' (from Soarin' Over California) are JG's best. Wow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unlucky Bastard 7,782 Posted November 1, 2007 Share Posted November 1, 2007 This thread is too peaceful! I don't come here to watch people agreeing with each other!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hitch 57 Posted November 1, 2007 Share Posted November 1, 2007 Go back to the HornerShrine from whence you came Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unlucky Bastard 7,782 Posted November 1, 2007 Share Posted November 1, 2007 HornerShrine!? Is board forbidden!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gkgyver 1,645 Posted November 1, 2007 Share Posted November 1, 2007 From JW, off the top of my head: Secrets of the Castle, Mischief Managed!, Swing, Swing, Swing, Prelude and Main Title March from Superman, Escape/Chase/Saying Goodbye, Remembering Childhood, Fawkes the Phoenix....From others, of the top of my head: Introduction (Edward Scissorhands), Ice Dance (Edward Scissorhands), King of Pride Rock (The Lion King), Morgan's Ride/Main Title (Cutthroat Island), Up is Down (POTC: AWE)....And another one from the category "Find the one that doesn't fit".For the record, yes, The Enterprise is at least on par with anything Williams has ever written. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeinAR 1,949 Posted November 1, 2007 Author Share Posted November 1, 2007 While I respect Joe's opinion and agree that Goldsmith's Enterprise cue is quite possibly his best I cannot agree that it is better than anything Williams has composed.I can think of several Williams pieces that bring more "goosebumps" and emotions than that one cue.you're not the first to say they can name some better Williams pieces, yet no one has named any.Joe, waiting for some moron to say Across the Stars and mean it.From JW, off the top of my head: Secrets of the Castle, Mischief Managed!, Swing, Swing, Swing, Prelude and Main Title March from Superman, Escape/Chase/Saying Goodbye, Remembering Childhood, Fawkes the Phoenix....From others, of the top of my head: Introduction (Edward Scissorhands), Ice Dance (Edward Scissorhands), King of Pride Rock (The Lion King), Morgan's Ride/Main Title (Cutthroat Island), Up is Down (POTC: AWE)....Like I said, a fabulous, fabulous track, I think that that and Soarin' (from Soarin' Over California) are JG's best. I love Across the Stars. I'll defend Across the Stars. It's a great theme.But it's not better than The Enterprise.That aside, I'm with KM, Mark, and Ray. Superb, but some Williams cues are better. I'm surprised KM didn't bring up The Dark Side Beckons.I agree with everything you just said. AtS is a great theme, it's not better than the Enterprise, and there are several JW tracks that are better than Enterprise.you didn't name a single track that was better, but you couldn't have. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nightscape94 965 Posted November 1, 2007 Share Posted November 1, 2007 "The Enterprise" is, of course, a fabulous track, there's hardly any room for denying that. Since I feel John Williams is our best living composer, and certainly better than Goldsmith in general, and better than most composers overall (see his concert work for a more convincing argument if his film music doesn't sway your opinion), than I obviously disagree with the latter statement of Joe's post. Since the "who's better" argument is pointless on a message board filled with both camps of adamant supporters, than I will simply agree that "The Enterprise" is one kick ass track, and also agree that it's one of the best cues in film scoring history, even though I don't like the film.Tim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeinAR 1,949 Posted November 1, 2007 Author Share Posted November 1, 2007 well I am not saying that JG is better than JW because I don't believe that, in most instances I would pick JW's works over Jerry's, but there are a few that I think JG hit home runs on, and Enterprise is the greatest by far.btw Im still laughing at the absurdity that Hanz zimmer wrote a better piece than Enterprise, I really believe that Indy 4 is trying to amuse us, no one could believe what he actually wrote. Its bedlam. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
indy4 155 Posted November 1, 2007 Share Posted November 1, 2007 well I am not saying that JG is better than JW because I don't believe that, in most instances I would pick JW's works over Jerry's, but there are a few that I think JG hit home runs on, and Enterprise is the greatest by far.btw Im still laughing at the absurdity that Hanz zimmer wrote a better piece than Enterprise, I really believe that Indy 4 is trying to amuse us, no one could believe what he actually wrote. Its bedlam.It was not meant to amuse you, I am just not subject to the blind bashing of Zimmer that goes on around here.Jack Sparrow, Up is Down, This Land, King of Pride Rock are all better than The Enterprise.Oh, and Hand of Fate Part 1 is better than Enterprise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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