Howard Shore's The Battle of the Five Armies (Hobbit Part 3)

[BloodBoal 7,538]

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

The thing is they just wrapped on BOTFA and yet I don't hear even an ounce of excitement or talk of the hobbit scores.

They signed NDA's man! NDA's!

[BloodBoal 7,538]

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

No. He is allowed to acknowledge that Shore wrote the music, and where it was recorded, and that a guy named Conrad Pope conducted it. But thats basically it.

[BloodBoal 7,538]

[SafeUnderHill 205]

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

Cool! That means the book will probably be released a lot faster than the LOTR one!

All 7 pages of it!

[BloodBoal 7,538]

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

Ariel, 16 pt font

[Faleel 5,365]

Well, you'll just to have to keep on imagining how it would sound like, because it's not going to happen!

I do. Although I am imagining Kaitlyn Lusk more. She does have a great voice and she is part of the LotR family in a sense as she has been part of these tours of the live performances.

No!

[Incanus 5,716]

Well, you'll just to have to keep on imagining how it would sound like, because it's not going to happen!

I do. Although I am imagining Kaitlyn Lusk more. She does have a great voice and she is part of the LotR family in a sense as she has been part of these tours of the live performances.

No!

Sissel?

[Faleel 5,365]

Maybe.

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

Pharrel Williams!

[BloodBoal 7,538]

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

Just makes me feel better.

[Dixon Hill 4,234]

Pharrel Williams!

Lose Yourself To Dragon-Sickness

[Kühni 485]

"The compositional theme to the destruction of Mordor took him three years and nine months to write."

Can somebody do the math for me on this statement, because it doesn't sound correct.

HS was announced in June of 2000, I believe, and I seem to remember he went down to NZ around the same time (he's seen in one of the EE documentaries to be sitting around when they were shooting the Crossroads/Fallen King scenes). He may have been in the process at bit earlier, but even so, three years nine months would put us into November or even December 2003, when the music for RotK had already been recorded ("The End of All Things"/Mount Doom was written/recorded in late September, if I recall the slate number correctly). And mind, "Fate of the Ring" (the precursor/scaled-down version of "The Destruction of the Ring") was already in T2T.

[BloodBoal 7,538]

[Kühni 485]

Sounds legit.

[gkgyver 1,646]

I always thought this was a somewhat philosophical statement. His journey lead to this piece, and it incorporates many themes from the trilogy, so I guess that's what was meant. I don't think it took him 2 1/2 years to pen the actual composition.

[KK 3,307]

Yeah whether it was meant to be taken literally or metaphorically, Shore was not working on that piece for 3 years, haha...

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

He was! Do not presume to doubt the words of Shore!

[gkgyver 1,646]

Praise the Good Shore!

[Incanus 5,716]

Thou shalt not blaspheme this sanctuary of Williams with such heresy!

And yes I think Shore was speaking rather from creative point of view meaning that his process with these scores took the nearly 3 years and that he feels that he had to learn and grown and push himself as a composer before being able to score the finale of the final film. He has said before that he felt that in 2001 in his mid-50s he was ready and had learned enough of the craft up to that point to score the LotR trilogy.

[BloodBoal 7,538]

[Barnald 365]

Final choral sessions completed:

https://twitter.com/LDNVoices

Though knowing PJ I wouldn't bet on that...

[SafeUnderHill 205]

[BloodBoal 7,538]

[SafeUnderHill 205]

[Barnald 365]

I don't know to be honest. Must be from the extras. I found it with a Thrain image search on Google.

And yes, it was time for a change, especially as both myself and SUH had Azog avatars, and he adopted his first. And this version of Thrain may soon be a relic once the DoS EE hits.

[gkgyver 1,646]

I wonder whether there were many soloists. I'm all for more choral music, so wouldn't mind if they recorded more. Who would conduct the orchestra though, now that Pope is done?

A classy orchestra knows how to conduct itself!

[Alex Shore 83]

Well, you'll just to have to keep on imagining how it would sound like, because it's not going to happen!

I do. Although I am imagining Kaitlyn Lusk more. She does have a great voice and she is part of the LotR family in a sense as she has been part of these tours of the live performances.

No!

Sissel?

Clara Sanabras! The voice of An Unexpected Journey!

[Jim Ware 526]

Also the soloist on Horner's For Greater Glory.

[SafeUnderHill 205]

[Barnald 365]

I think I can make out a 'Heroics of Bain' motif...should be spectacular!

[BloodBoal 7,538]

[SafeUnderHill 205]

[Barnald 365]

Anything revealing? I trust you realize that if they are (revealing), Doug will surely remove it. Best to make sure you've exhausted its potential first.

[SafeUnderHill 205]

[gkgyver 1,646]

Fourth stave looks like Gandalf's theme.

[Incanus 5,716]

Fourth stave looks like Gandalf's theme.

Good. These films can always use more of Gandalf's theme(s). Actually I would love a big badass choral rendition of the B-theme!

[BloodBoal 7,538]

[SafeUnderHill 205]

[Barnald 365]

It's probably more relief than feeling nice. Relief because of the hectic production schedules and changes to the orchestra yes, but also because of the huge pressure to live up to expectations, and at not having to be conscious of what has come before in terms of composition (must be hard not to repeat yourself unknowingly, especially when the music for LOTR was written some 9-11 years before). I can only imagine that must be extremely difficult for a composer. But I'm sure he's very sad at the same time...it was a huge part of his life.

As for his last sentence...I wouldn't be surprised if he soon got a phonecall from PJ in the middle of the night asking him to write more music for it!

[SafeUnderHill 205]

[Barnald 365]

Fondness and appreciation of the scores has only grown over the past decade. They are regularly voted top soundtrack in the Classic FM Hall of Fame, for example, demonstrating the widespread popularity of Shore's LOTR music. I honestly think the pressure to go back now was much greater, especially as he would have had to have gotten into that frame of mind again. I liken it to PJ making The Hobbit...would you not say the pressure on him was far greater than it was completing TTT and ROTK after the success of FOTR? Fair enough it's not quite the same since he'd filmed large chunks, but he still had to do pick-ups, edit, add the CGI and so forth...the films would have been well away from completion.

[gkgyver 1,646]

http://middleearthnews.com/2014/10/14/the-music-of-middle-earth-panel-at-new-york-comic-con/

The Hobbit trilogy came up, and Howard talked about how it has a different feel to it. The Hobbit is its own little world. He added that the stakes are different, and that is indeed true. With LOTR we didnt have anything to compare it toit was brand new. With The Hobbit, the expectations are already so high; we already have a sense of what we imagine Middle-earth to sound like. Howard said that going backwards was not easy and that now it feels nice to finish The Hobbit. He confessed that he sometimes wakes up thinking he still needs to write for it.

I find this a little sad. The Hobbit had such high expectations and I feel like it hasn't achieved such a coherent set of scores as LOTR did. The substantial differences between film and soundtrack, the change in orchestra and the dramatic shift in tone from film 1 to 2. It seems sad that Shore is glad to have finished work on it.

The final sentence though reminds me of when he finished work on ROTK. I really hope we get a stellar score for BOTFA, and for people to care about his work on this trilogy.

The shift in tone from 1 to 2 wasn't any different in the LotR trilogy.

[SafeUnderHill 205]

[gkgyver 1,646]

That's reassuring to hear. Although it does seem like a big shift from focusing on LOTR themes to moving to new ones. The themes from AUJ that return in DOS sound different which gives an impression of less consistency (variation is good, but some similar statements of themes is also useful for continuity), though perhaps this is a good thing. Any guesses that the Hobbit scores will be appreciated more as time goes on?

Funny, that gives me the impression of more variation.

The focus on LotR themes in AUJ comes from the film itself. Shore can't suddenly write new themes for Rivendell, Gollum, the Shire, the Ring ... nor do I want him to.

[Incanus 5,716]

That's reassuring to hear. Although it does seem like a big shift from focusing on LOTR themes to moving to new ones. The themes from AUJ that return in DOS sound different which gives an impression of less consistency (variation is good, but some similar statements of themes is also useful for continuity), though perhaps this is a good thing. Any guesses that the Hobbit scores will be appreciated more as time goes on?

Funny, that gives me the impression of more variation.

The focus on LotR themes in AUJ comes from the film itself. Shore can't suddenly write new themes for Rivendell, Gollum, the Shire, the Ring ... nor do I want him to.

Yes and Shore really gave his old themes a new spin for the most part in AUJ, although those versions were alas then unused. He also observed moments where the music had to be a direct reference orchestrationally like in the opening with the Shire music for the reintroduction to the world and time (the frame story taking place in FotR) or the arrival at Rivendell and then he tried to give these themes some new colour and variations elsewhere. Gollum's themes are given new interesting readings while still retaining their character as is the History of the Ring theme. What I like is that Shore took the challenge and actually composed these proto-themes for e.g. Necromancer and Azog that would feel at home in the thematic family of the Mordor themes and sound like they will evolve into the form they will have in LotR. Necromancer aka Sauron is of course as a concept immortal like the elves and his music should be his and thus Shore references the Evil of the Ring/Mordor in a very recognizable guise on the soundtrack, much of which is cut from the film though, again I assume for the purposes of not revealing too much musically to the audience.

For DoS very few themes return as it was a musical choice by the film makers (according to Mr. Adams, voiced in the Tracksounds.com interview back in 2013) to acknowledge the new and potentially dangerous part of the journey through strange lands over the edge of the Wild and to emphasize the isolation of the heroes (and to an extent the audience) in the foreign environment. It is true DoS revels more in the new material but that actually gives it character of its own, not just-previous-theme-and-variation feel. And there are great new variations on both the material from the LotR trilogy and AUJ in the score, not just a constant flow of it as Shore is busy building another part of this musical world through new ideas.

That being said I really look forward to Shore tying things up in BOFA. So many possibilities and all those themes coming into play in the final film. A martial variation on the Woodland Realm theme, Bard's theme gaining its heroism finally, Beorn possibly making musical appearance, Smaug's last moments, the dwarven battle music etc. Oh andthe Eagles, bring on the Nature's Reclamation!