#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10254 Posted May 5, 2016 Share Posted May 5, 2016 How did JJ Abrams become famous? I mean he is a big name director, the kind the general public knows. Up there with Nolan, Tarantino, Peter Jackson, Camereon etc when it comes to "brand recognition". But those directors have made film that really were massive hits. And are beloved by both the audience and critics alike. Up until The Force Awakens JJ has never had a huge blockbuster hit. Most of his films have done very well. But not exceptionally so. Every single film he has directed is a derivative of a already existing "product". The third Mission Impossible film, two Star Treks, an 80's Amblin love fest, and of course Star Wars. There's no sense of auteur-ship there, like there is with other popular name directors. I guess i heard the name first time in association with a TV show called Alias, which was apparently the best thing since sliced bread (never watched it). Then it was Lost and that Godzilla homage. One which he only directed the pilot for, the other he only produced. Yet it was quite big news when JJ Abrams was announced as the director of Mission Impossible 3. Of course now JJ really is a big shot. But I'm struggling to see where the genesis of that fame lies. One of his great talents, moreso then his actual skill as a film maker is his ability to market a product. Create a hype. Get the people talking about something. This is undoubtedly one of the reasons Lucasfilm and Disney wanted him to direct their first new Star Wars movie. Since the reputation of that franchise was not good at all. It certainly looks like he succeeded in making Star wars seems attractive again. But his biggest coup does seem to be how he marketed himself to the top of Hollywood by way of a collection of decent, but ultimately average films. Or am I missing something? Ricard 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay 31058 Posted May 5, 2016 Share Posted May 5, 2016 5 minutes ago, Stefancos said: How did JJ Abrams become famous? ALIAS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10254 Posted May 5, 2016 Author Share Posted May 5, 2016 But was ALIAS really a great show? Or was the marketing of it just really well done? I mean Breaking Bad is a properly brilliant show, and Vince isnt anywhere near as famous as JJ was even in the Cloverfield days. Just checked. Apparently even at it's peak Alias only had half the amount of viewers (in the US) that a real zeitgeist show like The X-files had during it's peak. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay 31058 Posted May 5, 2016 Share Posted May 5, 2016 ALIAS was great, then lost its way as the seasons went on. You'd like it, especially the first season and a half. Jennifer Garner in her prime, too! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ricard 1996 Posted May 5, 2016 Share Posted May 5, 2016 54 minutes ago, Stefancos said: his biggest coup does seem to be how he marketed himself to the top of Hollywood by way of a collection of decent, but ultimately average films. This. And the exact same thing could be said about a well-known collaborator of his. JoeinAR 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10254 Posted May 5, 2016 Author Share Posted May 5, 2016 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mstrox 5681 Posted May 5, 2016 Share Posted May 5, 2016 I think Alias was a very good show, especially the early seasons when JJ was involved - although it was a product of its time (episodic network TV, and an action spy show, so not exactly a "prestige drama"). Oddly, I think JJ Abrams became a household name with LOST, which was a smash hit, even though he only directed the pilot movie. His name has been attached to numerous other TV shows and movies that he's had little to do with since then - Fringe and Person of Interest, as well as some less popular shows like Alcatraz. Getting his name in lights as a TV producer is really the impetus for his success, or at least the starting point. I don't think we've ever seen anything else like it - the closest would be Vince Gilligan, and as you mentioned it's not even close. So great marketing on JJ's part, or good luck on JJ's part w/ good marketing from ABC. I loved Star Trek and The Force Awakens, and especially Super 8. I liked his other two well enough. I agree that there's not much of an auteur mark, but I don't think there needs to be. If his movies are good, his direction paid off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quintus 5394 Posted May 5, 2016 Share Posted May 5, 2016 A combination of pot luck, timing and a new generation of undemanding audiences who have crap taste. Bilbo and Ricard 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AC1 3807 Posted May 5, 2016 Share Posted May 5, 2016 Alias is good but still common TV, Steef. I bought the DVD boxes really cheap in a second-hand shop, enjoyed them well enough at the time, but I was never really a big fan. Somehow the studio treated Abrams as a Wunderkind, the new Spielberg. I guess he's very reliable in the eyes of the suits. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10254 Posted May 5, 2016 Author Share Posted May 5, 2016 I'm sure he is. I doubt JJ will ever make a truly bad film. But I'm not sure he will ever make a truly great one either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quintus 5394 Posted May 5, 2016 Share Posted May 5, 2016 He makes solid movies, big wow I thought. Except people go fucking crazy over them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dixon Hill 4232 Posted May 5, 2016 Share Posted May 5, 2016 I've wondered about this too. He really does seem to have "made it" by being involved, to relatively small degrees, with a lot of different things that got a lot of attention. Alias kick-started it I guess, and that was a solid program. Lost of course I think cemented the Abrams name as a recognizable one, and though his contribution is usually written off as directing the pilot only, he definitely shaped the core ideas of the story as well and I'm sure wasn't totally removed from the production thenceforth (as an aside, I ascribe much of the greatness of that show more so to others like Cuse and Jack Bender than to Abrams and Lindelof - Cuse was definitely the force that held it all together). Yeah, it's curious. For a while now, I've wanted him to make a real J.J. Abrams film, something not franchised or nostalgia-laced. I bet it could be something really good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AC1 3807 Posted May 5, 2016 Share Posted May 5, 2016 Because Abrams is synonymous with 'box-office format', I don't think he will ever be really good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dixon Hill 4232 Posted May 5, 2016 Share Posted May 5, 2016 You don't think Abrams unchained/unleashed, paired with a great writer, could be something special? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AC1 3807 Posted May 5, 2016 Share Posted May 5, 2016 Abrams special? That sounds odd. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10254 Posted May 5, 2016 Author Share Posted May 5, 2016 Why do you think he wants to be "unchained"? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AC1 3807 Posted May 5, 2016 Share Posted May 5, 2016 I think he's doing what he does best. He's not going to step out of the box ever. Nolan ... on the other hand ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crocodile 6867 Posted May 5, 2016 Share Posted May 5, 2016 18 minutes ago, Quintus said: A combination of pot luck, timing and a new generation of undemanding audiences who have crap taste. Didn't they same the same thing about the original Star Wars? Karol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dixon Hill 4232 Posted May 5, 2016 Share Posted May 5, 2016 2 minutes ago, Stefancos said: Why do you think he wants to be "unchained"? You're right, I never want to be either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Romão 2067 Posted May 5, 2016 Share Posted May 5, 2016 Well, at least he is quite capable when it comes to casting. He was sound, safe choice for re-introducing Star Wars. He did his job well. But I wouldn't want him to direct the next two episodes of the trilogy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
publicist 4635 Posted May 5, 2016 Share Posted May 5, 2016 Here's a filmmaker who was feeded on movies all his life and it shows: all he ever does is impersonating stuff he's learned from them. I never saw an original thought or anything resembling an interesting vision of humanity or a way of life. Just a rich guy from Bel Air making escapist movies. His first sold scripts were 'Regarding Henry' and 'Forever Young'. Nuff said... Bilbo 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AC1 3807 Posted May 5, 2016 Share Posted May 5, 2016 Yep, well said, crocs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mstrox 5681 Posted May 5, 2016 Share Posted May 5, 2016 I guess I don't see what's wrong with escapism. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
publicist 4635 Posted May 5, 2016 Share Posted May 5, 2016 Or why some things are just more worthy than others. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mstrox 5681 Posted May 5, 2016 Share Posted May 5, 2016 Worthy of what? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
publicist 4635 Posted May 5, 2016 Share Posted May 5, 2016 Look, what do you - in the context of this thread - really want to contribute? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mstrox 5681 Posted May 5, 2016 Share Posted May 5, 2016 "More worthy" means nothing without an object to be worthy of. I just wanted to understand what you meant Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
publicist 4635 Posted May 5, 2016 Share Posted May 5, 2016 No that's not what you meant, your first post indicates a misunderstanding why people are lukewarm on JJ Abrams and i think it has something to do with the fact that he isn't someone with any original POV but just a craftsman without any distinguishing features. Escapism without distinguishing features is by its nature less noteworthy than escapism with (i.e. Hitchcock). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10254 Posted May 5, 2016 Author Share Posted May 5, 2016 23 minutes ago, publicist said: Here's a filmmaker who was feeded on movies all his life and it shows: all he ever does is impersonating stuff he's learned from them. I never saw an original thought or anything resembling an interesting vision of humanity or a way of life. Just a rich guy from Bel Air making escapist movies. Yeah, he seems to live and breathe Hollywood. I wouldnt expect him to ever make a movie about anything resembling "real life". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mstrox 5681 Posted May 5, 2016 Share Posted May 5, 2016 7 minutes ago, publicist said: No that's not what you meant, your first post indicates a misunderstanding why people are lukewarm on JJ Abrams and i think it has something to do with the fact that he isn't someone with any original POV but just a craftsman without any distinguishing features. Escapism without distinguishing features is by its nature less noteworthy than escapism with (i.e. Hitchcock). That's exactly what I meant, and it's literally exactly what my response ("worthy of what?") said. My first post was a separate thought, just expressing my opinion on Abrams. That post also indicated that a lot of Abrams' success hinged on luck and marketing - while I like his work, I wouldn't call myself an Abrams apologist. TBH Star Trek Into Darkness had given me great fears about Star Wars before he pulled it off so well Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
publicist 4635 Posted May 5, 2016 Share Posted May 5, 2016 It's not that. ST ID is bad due to a bad script. Not so much Abrams' direction. It's just that he doesn't contribute more than polished technique. Nothing of note. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mstrox 5681 Posted May 5, 2016 Share Posted May 5, 2016 I just want to know what the dang guy is worthy of! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
publicist 4635 Posted May 5, 2016 Share Posted May 5, 2016 The guy is not important. The group he belongs to is the culprit here. Real artists have something - sometimes more intangible, sometimes very obvious - that makes their work stand out. They don't just deliver product on time, but there is a certain trait to it, maybe a common theme, maybe a view of life and so on. Abrams is a filmmaker who just technically directs well stories he gets and maybe polishes for movie efficiency. Nothing beyond, or at least not substantially. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Not Mr. Big 4049 Posted May 5, 2016 Share Posted May 5, 2016 I think the "lens flares" controversy really elevated him in the public conscious. Even some of the more "casual" movie-goers started noticing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeinAR 1853 Posted May 5, 2016 Share Posted May 5, 2016 Abrams' skills were well suited to what turned out to be a well written film. His Star Trek junk were neither well written or we'll directed. The did have the benefit of being well cast and acted except for Simon Pegg who is all wrong for Mr. Scott. And I'll be damned if they didn't give him a set of keys to the car. And it's amazing how much a better director he seems once he got a competent film composer on board. Bilbo 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quintus 5394 Posted May 5, 2016 Share Posted May 5, 2016 4 hours ago, crocodile said: Didn't they same the same thing about the original Star Wars? Karol People brought up on seventies cinema (some say it's THE decade for film) had crap taste? They had been conditioned to expect less?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unlucky Bastard 7770 Posted May 6, 2016 Share Posted May 6, 2016 A while back, I thought Alias was a Joss Whedon show. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sharkissimo 1971 Posted May 6, 2016 Share Posted May 6, 2016 They all blend into one for me... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corellian2019 335 Posted May 6, 2016 Share Posted May 6, 2016 Nepotism had something to do with J.J.'s ascent in the business. His parents were TV producers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AC1 3807 Posted May 6, 2016 Share Posted May 6, 2016 3 hours ago, Drax said: A while back, I thought Alias was a Joss Whedon show. What an odd thought. Alias doesn't have any Whedon trademarks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unlucky Bastard 7770 Posted May 6, 2016 Share Posted May 6, 2016 Yeah but that was before I learned his trademarks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KK 3251 Posted May 6, 2016 Share Posted May 6, 2016 18 hours ago, TheGreyPilgrim said: You don't think Abrams unchained/unleashed, paired with a great writer, could be something special? I don't think an "unchained" Abrams is going to offer anything different. If it were something "special", that credit should probably go to the writers and team. Pub is spot on. This is someone who is good at getting Hollywood flicks out the door, but with very little of his own to say artistically. He would have fit right in with any of the no-name directors of the studio system of the 40s-50s. That he's achieved the brand he has is due to connections, the right projects and chance. Certainly not by any sense of "auteurism". publicist 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
publicist 4635 Posted May 6, 2016 Share Posted May 6, 2016 6 hours ago, Quintus said: People brought up on seventies cinema (some say it's THE decade for film) had crap taste? They had been conditioned to expect less?? They were tired of all the downbeat dramas. And finally had their generation's 'Gunga Din' or 'King Kong'. I never much minded the first Abrams 'Star Trek'. It was good enough. The big problem with these movies now is the studio expectation - dictation, really - how they have to be built, with a set amount of action sequences and so on. In the few blockbusters i've seen over the last years you could practically see the seams come off whenever a needless action sequence brought the story to a halt. Nolan is an exception in that regard as his huge hits usually are (or seem) better constructed so that the stuff flows more organically. Whenever there's a troll fight in something like 'Snow White' etc. it runs 6 minutes and you can see people get restless - the awful Metropolis battlle in MOS was my personal negative highlight of this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bilbo 3623 Posted May 6, 2016 Share Posted May 6, 2016 I laugh every time I see the words "visionary director" on the back of the TFA case. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay 31058 Posted May 8, 2016 Share Posted May 8, 2016 Last night I had a dream that I got to interview JJ Abrams, and I showed up to interview him in my pajamas. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unlucky Bastard 7770 Posted May 8, 2016 Share Posted May 8, 2016 Your Spock pyjamas? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AC1 3807 Posted May 8, 2016 Share Posted May 8, 2016 We dream want we long for in real life. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unlucky Bastard 7770 Posted May 8, 2016 Share Posted May 8, 2016 I've always figured that dreams are answers to questions we haven't figured out how to ask yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AC1 3807 Posted May 8, 2016 Share Posted May 8, 2016 Well, you figured wrong, Drax. Fear and longing are dealt with in our dreams. It's the reason why we don't lose our mind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unlucky Bastard 7770 Posted May 8, 2016 Share Posted May 8, 2016 Any figures to back that up? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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