Personal favorite Indy McGuffin theme

[WampaRat 1,105]

Sure. The Ark theme set the bar pretty high and is probably the most iconic. But what’s your favorite?

 

Im going with The Holy Grail.

I love the medieval/liturgical/religious feel of this theme. A nice nod to something Rozsa could have written for “King of Kings”. I think it really stands apart from the other McGuffin themes which (to me) attempt recapture Ark theme. I will say, it’s odd the grail theme never receives a full choral statement like the prior two Indy McGuffin themes before it. Especially for such an overtly Christian relic, there’s an odd lack of choir in Last Crusade. ( Is that a real choir at 1:22 into “The Penitent Man Will Pass” ? Odd/expensive if they were hired for just one note! Lol)

 

 

 

 

 

Can’t wait to hear what the Maestro cooked up for Indy V’s McGuffin!

 

[Brando 1,864]

I think I have to go with the Grails theme as well. The bells in its introductory cue are so heavenly. Sucks that the film rip of it isn't the best quality, it sure makes on yearn for an expansion.

 

[Luke Skywalker 1,796]

I have a soft spot for coronado’s. But grail theme gets my vote.

 

was there a musical identity for nurashi’s urn?

[Brando 1,864]

9 minutes ago, Luke Skywalker said:

I have a soft spot for coronado’s. But grail theme gets my vote.

 

was there a musical identity for nurashi’s urn?

There's a lovely little note as its placed on the table. I really love the Eastern influences heard in the trilogy, they're very nice.

[WampaRat 1,105]

4 hours ago, Brando said:

I think I have to go with the Grails theme as well. The bells in its introductory cue are so heavenly. Sucks that the film rip of it isn't the best quality, it sure makes on yearn for an expansion.

 

I was about to post this (and tag you to thank you lol). Yeah. All sorts of feels from this theme (and movie!) My favorite in the series.

 

The climactic moment in “Wrong Choice Right Choice” is just sublime as well.

[bollemanneke 3,352]

Holy grail. No competition at all.

[Richard Penna 3,695]

No thinking needed - holy grail.

 

FWIW, no think needed either for the worst - crystal skull.

[Brando 1,864]

4 minutes ago, Richard Penna said:

No thinking needed - holy grail.

 

FWIW, no think needed either for the worst - crystal skull.

I do love the mystical feeling the Skull theme gives off. I hate best/worst polls because I think each theme really stands on its own and supports the specific macguffin.

[Richard Penna 3,695]

I usually don't like best/worst either because usually the field is too wide, like the Oscars.

 

I just think it's an easy choice in this case. The skull theme just bores me.

[ThePenitentMan1 744]

I initially voted for the Medallion theme just to be a bit different, but immediately switched it to the Ark theme after I saw how few the votes for it were.

[GerateWohl 4,373]

Ark of the covenant is my personal favourite. Originally burried in this The Well of the Souls edit from the OST it has always been a beloved highlight of the score for me.

[WampaRat 1,105]

I was torn to include the “Medallion theme” as I initially thought it was sort of a B-theme for the Ark. Which it still might be?

 

What we might consider to be the “Main” Ark theme (ala The Map Room: Dawn) could be used to represent the awesome power of the ark. And the “medallion theme” seems to be used more as a “Legacy/History of the Ark” theme after the medallion is no longer needed…

 

Or perhaps Spielberg just said “why not use both?”

[Amer 2,117]

I think the Ark of The Covenant and The Medallion are basically part of each other.   We hear them in the final opening of the Ark sequence of course.

[Faleel 5,360]

Sankara stones, especially the big French Horn climax in Stealing the Stones

 

 

There is a motif/identity for the Diamond BTW. Its the Horn flourishes in Once in a Vial, it's really obvious in my Iso Score video

 

Slave Children count?

 

I actually really like the oboe writing in the Skull suite.

12 hours ago, WampaRat said:

( Is that a real choir at 1:22 into “The Penitent Man Will Pass” ? Odd/expensive if they were hired for just one note! Lol)

 

 

I think it's a mellotron, which is essentially a tape recording of a real choir, triggered by a piano key.

[artguy360 1,844]

I love the Ark theme so much, but the way the holy Grail theme pairs so perfectly with the father/family music to make the emotional heart of the score is special to me. It's some of JW's best thematic weaving to form a rich score. That also makes it the best Indy score, even while not having the best action music! 

[Amer 2,117]

16 hours ago, WampaRat said:

I was torn to include the “Medallion theme” as I initially thought it was sort of a B-theme for the Ark. Which it still might be?

 

What we might consider to be the “Main” Ark theme (ala The Map Room: Dawn) could be used to represent the awesome power of the ark. And the “medallion theme” seems to be used more as a “Legacy/History of the Ark” theme after the medallion is no longer needed…

 

Or perhaps Spielberg just said “why not use both?”

Yeah it’s probably the same thing he wanted like the 2 Indy themes. Incidentally the Map Room cue also re-uses a motif from the Peru Idol sequence which is  like a deep intellectual archaeological excavations theme for Indy inter connecting his craft.

[WampaRat 1,105]

12 hours ago, Roll the Bones said:

On 7/10/2022 at 9:37 AM, WampaRat said:

 

I think it's a mellotron, which is essentially a tape recording of a real choir, triggered by a piano key.

Ah. So it’s like a sample essentially of a real choir? Is that what we’re seeing here in this clip? (7:05)

 

 

12 hours ago, Roll the Bones said:

 

Sankara stones, especially the big French Horn climax in Stealing the Stones

 

 

There is a motif/identity for the Diamond BTW. Its the Horn flourishes in Once in a Vial, it's really obvious in my Iso Score video

 

Slave Children count?

 

I actually really like the oboe writing in the Skull suite.

 

Yeah! “Approaching the Stones” is just terrific. Shame the theme doesn’t pop up more. Even in the climax. But I’ll take that fantastic choral arrangement of the slave Children theme any day. 
 

I was listening to “Call of the Crystal” on the way home from work yesterday. It’s a terrific homage to the 50s sci-fi/paranoia scores of that era. I think peoples perception of it is tainted from a negative experience with the film itself. At least mine was for a long time. (It also seemed to dominate 1/2 the OST lol) But I’ve come around on it.

[Faleel 5,360]

27 minutes ago, WampaRat said:

Ah. So it’s like a sample essentially of a real choir? Is that what we’re seeing here in this clip? (7:05)

 

 

Pretty much, you can hear Mellotron choir at the end of this Genesis song:

 

 

[Bellosh 3,419]

I'm genuinely surprised The Grail Theme is winning by so much here.

 

I'm going with The Ark theme.  But for context, if the Map Room cue/scene didn't exist in Raiders, I would be choosing The Grail Theme.

 

That scene and cue is too powerful and something the other films don't have.

[Fabulin 3,514]

A part of what makes The Last Crusade score amazing to me is that it does not use a choir for religious topics. It's more neoclassical and toned down, sensibly avoiding kitsch. The Grail Theme is never sung by a mystical chorus, but is always merely an instrumental suggestion, leaving the question of whether it really exists or has any powers open for interpretation until the reveal in the finale.

[Faleel 5,360]

On 07/10/2022 at 11:37 AM, WampaRat said:

Im going with The Holy Grail.

I love the medieval/liturgical/religious feel of this theme. A nice nod to something Rozsa could have written for “King of Kings”.

Funnily enough, he wrote a theme for the Grail in Knights of the Round Table.

 

 

[WampaRat 1,105]

2 hours ago, Roll the Bones said:

Funnily enough, he wrote a theme for the Grail in Knights of the Round Table.

 

 

Oooh. Very cool. Kind of a precursor to his Christ theme from Ben Hur. Love it.
 

Outside of a handful of Rozsa’s Epics (Ben Hur, King of Kings, Quo Vadis?) I admit my knowledge of Golden Age Hollywood scores is pretty scant. 

2 hours ago, Fabulin said:

A part of what makes The Last Crusade score amazing to me is that it does not use a choir for religious topics. It's more neoclassical and toned down, sensibly avoiding kitsch. The Grail Theme is never sung by a mystical chorus, but is always merely an instrumental suggestion, leaving the question of whether it really exists or has any powers open for interpretation until the reveal in the finale.

Never thought of it that way. That’s a good take. 

I feel Last Crusade came at a crossroad in Williams style too. My favorite little era before he got into his  More “rhythmically complex” period. Last Crusade seems so much more broad and pastoral(?) in places compared to the first two films. Most likely due to the story, I’m sure. I lack the musical vocabulary. But I’ve always felt “Far and Away” could be a sister score to Last Crusade if that makes sense.

[Andy 4,141]

What?  Nurhachi doesn’t count as a MacGuffin?  His theme is awesome!

 

All of you choosing the Grail over the Ark are bonkers.  (I’m kidding, love you guys ) But for real, the Ark theme is so Old Testament and seriously scary. When that book is opened and you see the illustration of the Ark, the theme sells it and tells you it is about as serious as the universe gets. Like the Ark ghosts themselves, the theme goes right through my center and chills me.  Every time. 

Edit to add:

I personally consider the Medallion to be the B theme for the Ark theme. Appropriately they are intertwined, as even the prop itself has the cherubs from the top of the Ark sculpted into the wings of the bird on the medallion.  Look carefully. And don’t forget to take back one kadam. 
 

[Brando 1,864]

58 minutes ago, Andy said:

What?  Nurhachi doesn’t count as a MacGuffin?  His theme is awesome!

 

All of you choosing the Grail over the Ark are bonkers.  (I’m kidding, love you guys ) But for real, the Ark theme is so Old Testament and seriously scary. When that book is opened and you see the illustration of the Ark, the theme sells it and tells you it is about as serious as the universe gets. Like the Ark ghosts themselves, the theme goes right through my center and chills me.  Every time. 

Edit to add:

I personally consider the Medallion to be the B theme for the Ark theme. Appropriately they are intertwined, as even the prop itself has the cherubs from the top of the Ark sculpted into the wings of the bird on the medallion.  Look carefully. And don’t forget to take back one kadam. 
 

The Book is an absolutely fantastic cue. Such a glorious introduction to the mysterious artifact.

[WampaRat 1,105]

2 hours ago, Andy said:

But for real, the Ark theme is so Old Testament and seriously scary.

Yes! I don’t know how Williams tapped into that vibe so well. It’s  so eerie played by those flutes with the choir simmering underneath it. The perfect musical embodiment to “lightening …fire…power of God or somethin’…”

Man. Woodwinds. Remember those in films scores? 

[Amer 2,117]

Williams had designed to mix the choir with the orchestra in a subtle way without overpowering the voices. This enabled the mysterious effect of the cue in Map Room. I believe he mentioned it particularly in The Making of Raiders ..book.