How did HP3 end up with such a unique score?

[artguy360 1,844]

The thread title says it all. I remember listening to the HP3 soundtrack before seeing the film and being struck by how different it sounded. The period instruments, the period sounding music, the almost diagetic sound, the lack of re-use of existing themes, HP3 sounded so different from the first two scores. 

 

Of course, the film is quite different from the first two movies as well, but in many ways the HP3 score doesn't just sound different from the first two HP scores, it sounds different than JW's usual full orchestral sound.

 

Do we know anything about how this came to be? Why such different musical decisions were made? I can't find my copy of the La La Land release to read the liner notes, does it reveal anything about the scoring process? Can anyone direct me to any interviews on the matter?

[Not Mr. Big 4,639]

Definitely a director thing.  Probably through temp track choices and maybe the director being more hands on with stylistic suggestions 

[Edmilson 7,470]

In terms of creativity and "thinking outside the box", Williams was clearly firing on all cylinders during HP3. I love how the movie being so different from the previous 2 really inspired him in a way to produce such a different score from PS and CoS.

 

In terms of the franchises he scored, this and The Lost World were the only times where he went in such a different direction from the previous movie.

[Not Mr. Big 4,639]

1 minute ago, Edmilson said:

In terms of creativity and "thinking outside the box", Williams was clearly firing on all cylinders during HP3. I love how the movie being so different from the previous 2 really inspired him in a way to produce such a different score from PS and CoS.

 

In terms of the franchises he scored, this and The Lost World were the only times where he went in such a different direction from the previous movie.

Temple of Doom counts too I think

[Pat_S 69]

22 hours ago, artguy360 said:

The thread title says it all. I remember listening to the HP3 soundtrack before seeing the film and being struck by how different it sounded. The period instruments, the period sounding music, the almost diagetic sound, the lack of re-use of existing themes, HP3 sounded so different from the first two scores. 

 

Of course, the film is quite different from the first two movies as well, but in many ways the HP3 score doesn't just sound different from the first two HP scores, it sounds different than JW's usual full orchestral sound.

 

Do we know anything about how this came to be? Why such different musical decisions were made? I can't find my copy of the La La Land release to read the liner notes, does it reveal anything about the scoring process? Can anyone direct me to any interviews on the matter?

Some quotes from the liner notes from Cuaron that may be of some use to you: 

'John composed 'Double Trouble' during the production of the film as we decided that a children's choir would be a warm welcome back to Hogwarts. The theme, a melodic, mischievous close cousin of 'Hedwig's Theme', composed around text from Shakespeare's Macbeth, became the foundation stone for the rest of the film score. Its medieval color became the musical identity of the wizarding world in this installment of Harry Potter'  

'I wanted to channel the music into a little bit of a new place and when I spoke with John about going in that direction, he was very intrigued, I believe he really loved the challenge of applying this very modern, somewhat abstract approach to Harry Potter. It was very liberating.'

'We decided not to wallpaper the film with music. And I told John that I didn't want descriptive music throughout, but instead I wanted the score to not just be a narrative device, but to capture the emotional undertone of the whole thing, almost like it's the consience of Harry Potter. When I started hearing the pieces John composed, it was incredible. For a composer who has given us so many of the most famous melodies in cinema, it's amazing how atonal and experimental he can become.'

'We wanted to capture the specific locale of Hogwarts as a timeless place in the British Highlands. So we could not just go with contemporary 20th century music - that was the emotional aspect of it. But we also saw Hogwarts as part of Harry's character, and John strongly felt we should embrace the Englishness of the place' 

 

Williams: 'Alfonso had several scenes with ... Sir Cadogan, a fully dressed noble horseman who wafted through the castle. So the perfect thing to score this, we thought, was a kind of medieval band. I contacted a group in London who specialise in music of this period, got their list of instruments and I was able to sprinkle the use of these instruments here and there with our concert orchestra'. (The group is The Dufay Collective)

 

[artguy360 1,844]

57 minutes ago, Pat_S said:

Some quotes from the liner notes from Cuaron that may be of some use to you: 

'John composed 'Double Trouble' during the production of the film as we decided that a children's choir would be a warm welcome back to Hogwarts. The theme, a melodic, mischievous close cousin of 'Hedwig's Theme', composed around text from Shakespeare's Macbeth, became the foundation stone for the rest of the film score. Its medieval color became the musical identity of the wizarding world in this installment of Harry Potter'  

'I wanted to channel the music into a little bit of a new place and when I spoke with John about going in that direction, he was very intrigued, I believe he really loved the challenge of applying this vey modern, somewhat abstract approach to Harry Potter. It was very liberating.'

'We decided not to wallpaper the film with music. And I told John that I didn't want descriptive music throughout, but instead I wanted the score to not just be a narrative device, but to capture the emotional undertone of the whole thing, almost like it's the consience of Harry Potter. When I started hearing the pieces John composed, it was incredible. For a composer who has given us so many of the most famous melodies in cinema, it's amazing how atonal and experimental he can become.'

'We wanted to capture the specific locale of Hogwarts as a timeless place in the British Highlands. So we could not just go with contemporary 20th century music - that was the emotional aspect of it. But we also saw Hogwarts as part of Harry's character, and John strongly felt we should embrace the Englishness of the place' 

 

Williams: 'Alfonso had several scenes with ... Sir Cadogan, a fully dressed noble horseman who wafted through the castle. So the perfect thing to score this, we thought, was a kind of medieval band. I contacted a group in London who specialise in music of this period, got their list of instruments and I was able to sprinkle the use of these instruments here and there with our concert orchestra'. (The group is The Dufay Collective)

 

Thank you! That is very insightful.

[Tom 4,669]

8 hours ago, Not Mr. Big said:

Temple of Doom counts too I think

I would add TESB to that list as well.  

[Naïve Old Fart 9,551]

How did HP3 end up with such a unique score?

Because it was scored by John fucking Williams!

[Tom 4,669]

39 minutes ago, Naïve Old Fart said:

How did HP3 end up with such a unique score?

Because it was scored by John fucking Williams!

After what William Ross did with CoS, POA was a breath of fresh air.  

[Edmilson 7,470]

19 hours ago, Pat_S said:

Some quotes from the liner notes from Cuaron that may be of some use to you: 

'John composed 'Double Trouble' during the production of the film as we decided that a children's choir would be a warm welcome back to Hogwarts. The theme, a melodic, mischievous close cousin of 'Hedwig's Theme', composed around text from Shakespeare's Macbeth, became the foundation stone for the rest of the film score. Its medieval color became the musical identity of the wizarding world in this installment of Harry Potter'  

'I wanted to channel the music into a little bit of a new place and when I spoke with John about going in that direction, he was very intrigued, I believe he really loved the challenge of applying this vey modern, somewhat abstract approach to Harry Potter. It was very liberating.'

'We decided not to wallpaper the film with music. And I told John that I didn't want descriptive music throughout, but instead I wanted the score to not just be a narrative device, but to capture the emotional undertone of the whole thing, almost like it's the consience of Harry Potter. When I started hearing the pieces John composed, it was incredible. For a composer who has given us so many of the most famous melodies in cinema, it's amazing how atonal and experimental he can become.'

'We wanted to capture the specific locale of Hogwarts as a timeless place in the British Highlands. So we could not just go with contemporary 20th century music - that was the emotional aspect of it. But we also saw Hogwarts as part of Harry's character, and John strongly felt we should embrace the Englishness of the place' 

 

Williams: 'Alfonso had several scenes with ... Sir Cadogan, a fully dressed noble horseman who wafted through the castle. So the perfect thing to score this, we thought, was a kind of medieval band. I contacted a group in London who specialise in music of this period, got their list of instruments and I was able to sprinkle the use of these instruments here and there with our concert orchestra'. (The group is The Dufay Collective)

 

This is awesome. I wish more directors challenged Williams like Cuarón did. JW would certainly love it.

[Muad'Dib 1,802]

I can't find the video, but there was an interview with Cuarón where he recalled that for the Knight Bus he instructed Johnny to write some acid jazz. In that interview it also came up that using parts of MacBeth was Johnny's idea, so it seems it was a really back and forth collaboration.

 

It shows in the final result.

[Holko 9,529]

2 hours ago, Muad'Dib said:

I can't find the video, but there was an interview with Cuarón where he recalled that for the Knight Bus he instructed Johnny to write some acid jazz.

In the LLL booklet Cuarón says "I showed the scene to John and he said 'I know just what to do'. [...] but on this he told me he didn't want me to hear it until they recorded it. So I arrived at the session and there was this big band and the hugest brass section I've ever seen in my life, and they started playing this funny, spooky, really bizarre piece of music."

JW about it in the same paragraph: " I thought Alfonso would tear his hair out and say 'What is this crazy thing?' But he loved it. It was a quintessential piece of silliness."

[Chen G. 3,950]

On 01/04/2023 at 7:28 AM, artguy360 said:

The thread title says it all. I remember listening to the HP3 soundtrack before seeing the film and being struck by how different it sounded. The period instruments, the period sounding music, the almost diagetic sound, the lack of re-use of existing themes, HP3 sounded so different from the first two scores. 

 

It does sound like a new soundscape for the most part.

 

There are little hints of the old sound world: "Something wicked this way comes" and the little figure that in the finished film is associated with Wormtail both remind me of the main theme from the previous two films. Otherwise, its almost completely new.

 

Must have been a decision made in tandem with Cuaron.

[Skelly 261]

For some reason Williams didn't do any press interviews for the movie..  Maybe he talked on radio but I don't have anything in print.

 

The main dramatic thrust of the movie is internal (which is why the big theme of the movie is about Harry's parents) not external, and so a lot of the "extra" scenes -- the bus, the aunt blowing up, the monster book -- come as is, with special sounds disconnected from each other.  Harry's perception of them isn't as important.  And even Hogwarts has an almost diegetic medieval sound (one scene even has a boy playing the music in the background).  In the first movie it was all about discovering this new world, and they even took the Great Hall music and pasted it over Diagon Alley so that they could keep emphasizing this sense of magical novelty.  Azkaban was different because the music is deliberately meant to be disparate except in scenes of Harry's parentage.