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Has anyone here heard 'Storia Di Una Donna' (1970)?

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Some not so optimistic news from Mr. James Fitzpatrick at FSM forum:

 

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Mr Williams has refused anyone touching this title apart from himself .... I did try ...but

 

 

I'm not so sure if that means he doesn't want a rerecording of the score because he would like to have the supervision of the original released, or if he doesn't want it to be released ever (like The Sugarland Express).

If it's the latter, it's very strange because there are far ""worse"" scores of his released from his 60s output.

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Yeah, it was disheartening to read that. I'd love to get some info on who he contacted, what the exact response was etc., but I'm not going to push him on the matter. Instead -- providing what he says is true -- we need to think of strategies to convince Williams of this!

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54 minutes ago, filmmusic said:

or if he doesn't want it to be released ever (like The Sugarland Express).

 

I've seen other people make a similar statement about Sugarland.  Is Williams on record somewhere that he literally never wants that music released in any form, ever?

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The source is an interview with Roger Feigelson by our own @EhTar!

 

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Did you ever release scores in order to please the composer, even if you would not do it without him asking for it? Did the contrary ever happen, a composer asking you not to release a score?

 
Yes to both. We’ve done things for composers and studios as a favor because we like to support their efforts. And yes, John Williams was adamant about there not being a release of Sugarland Express.

 

http://www.underscores.fr/rencontres/interviews-vo/2009/04/interviews-roger-feigelson-vo/

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Both in the case of STORIA and SUGARLAND, the quote obviously comes from a second-hand source (perhaps even third-source). No reason to think they're not telling the truth, of course, but it would be interesting to know WHO inside Williams' entourage gave the response, and what the exact words were. But I doubt we're ever going to get them, which is understandable (private conversations etc.).

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Well if the Maestro believes neither of those represents his best efforts well enough to warrent a release of any more that is already out there then I'm perfectly happy and don't require any "behind the scenes" knowledge.

 

It's absolutely the right of any artist to not release something he has created. I would expect you of all people to be sympathetic to that concept, Thor.

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I'm intrigued that Williams doesn't want some of his earliest score not to be made available or at least addressed by some one else either in album release or an actual recording. The only early score of his that was represented in are-recording was THE RARE BREED that came up on the Silva Screen compilation album as a short suite. Not a very great performance  but still enjoyable. 

 

Maybe Williams himself would like to revisit this score and do a suite himself or unless he is waiting for the actual tapes to turn up.It could be anything. Williams was not able to conduct of the original recording and this may be very close and personal to him. (I think it was from a time when he was married to his first wife before she passed away in 1974) 

 

Nevertheless, the score is lovely and after repeated listenings I'am with @Thor !I want this to happen.

 

 

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9 hours ago, Stefancos said:

Well if the Maestro believes neither of those represents his best efforts well enough to warrent a release of any more that is already out there then I'm perfectly happy and don't require any "behind the scenes" knowledge.

 

It's absolutely the right of any artist to not release something he has created. I would expect you of all people to be sympathetic to that concept, Thor.

 

Does that mean that he thinks higher of ....ehh.. let's say Nightwatch (1965) that is released on cd? Or John Goldfarb?

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I have no way of knowing. Why do you ask?

 

All we know that we have two instances where Williams has apparently nixed the idea of having his work released.  

 

We don't have personal confirmation of this, or an explanation as to why. But the sources are reliable and I have no reason to distrust either.

 

As for Sugarland. Feigelson's comments were many years ago now, and Williams seems to have taken a more relaxed stance towards recent complete and chronological rereleases of his work. So perhaps Mike Matessino will oneday be able to release that. Who knows?

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10 hours ago, Jay said:

You're just realizing now Thor can be hypocritical, Steef?

 

What's hypocritical about it?

 

Just because I want a composer personally involved in the creation of a listener-friendly album, does that also mean one HAS to accept his or her decision to not release the music at all?

 

I see it as two very different things.

 

2 hours ago, filmmusic said:

 

Does that mean that he thinks higher of ....ehh.. let's say Nightwatch (1965) that is released on cd? Or John Goldfarb?

 

Exactly. I doubt Williams had much say in cases like that. Perhaps they need some approval, perhaps not. But my guess is these projects started without his approval, and that was something they got later on, as a formality. Or none at all. Sometimes, the rights don't reside with Williams, but with the studio etc.

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7 minutes ago, Thor said:

What's hypocritical about it?

 

Just because I want a composer personally involved in the creation of a listener-friendly album, does that also mean one HAS to accept his or her decision to not release the music at all?

 

I see it as two very different things.

 

You don't think an artist has the right to not see some of his work released? 

 

If for whatever reason Williams doesn't want something released then as his fan I do HAVE to accept, and respect that.

 

To do otherwise would be fanboy entitlement.

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I accept that that is his decision, of course, but that doesn't mean that I have to agree with it or stop desiring it. It's not like we're living in a dictatorship (well....perhaps Americans do at this point, but that's a different discussion).

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16 hours ago, filmmusic said:

I'm not so sure if that means he doesn't want a rerecording of the score because he would like to have the supervision of the original released, or if he doesn't want it to be released ever (like The Sugarland Express).

If it's the latter, it's very strange because there are far ""worse"" scores of his released from his 60s output.

 

I am sure Fitzpatrick got some stock answers that are usually sent out by press agents in cases like this and do not warrant all this feverish speculation. Like some unrevised concert work, Williams might say 'i don't give a damn about revisiting it but won't tarnish my reputation by letting it go out unchecked'.

 

In 'Sugarland's case he rightly may have concluded that it's hardly worth to have 30 minutes of bluegrass shuffling released just to include 3 minutes of a lovely main theme.

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1 hour ago, Stefancos said:

I have no way of knowing. Why do you ask?

 

All we know that we have two instances where Williams has apparently nixed the idea of having his work released.  

 

We don't have personal confirmation of this, or an explanation as to why. But the sources are reliable and I have no reason to distrust either.

 

As for Sugarland. Feigelson's comments were many years ago now, and Williams seems to have taken a more relaxed stance towards recent complete and chronological rereleases of his work. So perhaps Mike Matessino will oneday be able to release that. Who knows?

 

I also remember around the time Varese did the JAWS recording with RSNO, and it was known that Williams did not want to have original score recording out. And after a while this changed when suddenly the Decca label released their first ever release of that score. 

 

So its plausible to summarise that perhaps Williams may also be wary of the quality of those tapes and and would not want to visit these old scores for these reasons alone. or perhaps the team is giving generic ideas based upon Williams old status quo on these titles ;)

 

 

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5 minutes ago, publicist said:

Going by recent elaborations of the JP box release, Williams still my think that old LP releases are the Status quo. Maybe even on vinyl. I wonder if JW uses a cd player...

 

I don't think he listens to much music in the first place. But I really dig his philosophy on the scores that ARE out there, even if he -- in my opinion -- underestimates the quality of those that are NOT. But even he is no magician, so if the master tapes to STORIA are lost, they are lost. It can only be 'saved' by a re-recording.

 

 

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Many who chose a career in music end uo not listening to it so much anymore when they aren't working. And when they do it's often a very different genre to that which they work in.

 

Privatly Williams probably listens to jazz, and some classical. But not film scores.

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I think I read some interview awhile back that he doesn't listen to much music at all, because -- as you say -- many professional musicians don't feel like using their sparetime on music too. But he obviously has all the references whenever he talks about music and composers, so I'm sure he's listened to quite a bit throughout his life and career.

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Williams has stated a few times that he doesn't listen to recordings. But in the late 90's or early 00's he told to the British magazine Classical CD, that while not a regular listener of CDs, he loved the Baremboim recording of the Beethoven sonatas on DG.

He also mentioned more than once, that his listening habits were related to attending concerts rather than listening to recordings.

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On 11/16/2016 at 11:14 AM, Thor said:

I'm guessing it's no more or less expensive than other re-recordings, but I'm just very curious about the cost involved in such projects. I doubt that James or other people from Tadlow are going to devulge that information, though.

You can guestimate that the all in cost to record in eastern Europe or Russia is $1,000 US per finished minute of music.  So if the soundtrack is 70 minutes long, the recording cost is approximately 70,000 US.  This would include the studio, conductor, contractor, recording engineer, librarian, and mixing.  This assumes the sheet music is extant and available.  For Tadlow, that is usually not the case so they have to reconstruct the score as well.

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On 1/24/2017 at 7:11 AM, Thor said:

I think I read some interview awhile back that he doesn't listen to much music at all, because -- as you say -- many professional musicians don't feel like using their sparetime on music too. But he obviously has all the references whenever he talks about music and composers, so I'm sure he's listened to quite a bit throughout his life and career.

 

@Stefancos

 

https://artsbeat.blogs.nytimes.com/2011/08/19/john-williams-lets-his-muses-carry-him-along/

 

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I don’t listen a lot, because I’m working all the time on something and listening to music is not a particular help. It’s difficult to go to concerts and often one is listening to music that is better than one’s own and that isn’t particularly encouraging either. My work, particularly the film work, puts me into a particular setting, and it isn’t helpful to be jarred out of that. Also, people will put music on when they have a dinner party, and I can’t do that. Or listen to music in the car. Because I start listening into the music. I think that D could be a little more sharp, or it’s a little flat or whatever, and before you know it, I’ve lost the dinner table conversation entirely. Or I’m risking driving off the road. If you were to ask me what would I hear just for pleasure, I’d probably say Haydn. Even more than Mozart in my case.

 

This is just a great interview all around too. 

 

I can sympathize when Williams when he says he can't multi-task while listening to music -- basically the same with me! 

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On 1/25/2017 at 8:45 PM, Will said:
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If you were to ask me what would I hear just for pleasure, I’d probably say Haydn. 

 

https://artsbeat.blogs.nytimes.com/2011/08/19/john-williams-lets-his-muses-carry-him-along/

 

 

And I just now watched this fantastic video of Williams conducting Haydn back in the day.  Bet he particularly relished that one!

 

 

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That's nice, Disco Stu. We often think of Marsalis as a jazz guy (well, at least I do), so it's unusual to hear him perform the more stringent and less free-form Haydn, but he obviously has all the classical chops as well.

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9 hours ago, Disco Stu said:

 

And I just now watched this fantastic video of Williams conducting Haydn back in the day.  Bet he particularly relished that one!

 

 

 

Interesting, I'll have to watch that later.

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4 hours ago, Thor said:

That's nice, Disco Stu. We often think of Marsalis as a jazz guy (well, at least I do), so it's unusual to hear him perform the more stringent and less free-form Haydn, but he obviously has all the classical chops as well.

 

He's certainly more associated with being a key figure in transitioning jazz from night clubs to the halls of academia, funded by grants and such.  Something that was kind of necessary as the popularity of jazz waned starting in the 70s.  But he also was very much a promoter of classical music appreciation from the beginning of his career as well.

 

This was one of my earliest classical albums I fell in love with as a kid.  He won a Grammy for it!

R-1909873-1251812939.jpeg.jpg

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I'm not familiar with his classical material at all. Something I  need to remedy, I guess.

 

It just occured to me -- who would know that, a few years after the above concert was held, Marsalis would be rejected from a film score in favour of the guy on the podium.

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15 minutes ago, Thor said:

It just occured to me -- who would know that, a few years after the above concert was held, Marsalis would be rejected from a film score in favour of the guy on the podium.

 

Well it was over a decade after but yeah that is kinda funny.  And actually the album he released of his Rosewood score, Reeltime, is one of my favorite Marsalis albums!  Great music that would've fit the film wonderfully if it had been used.

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Bibbi Andersson, Swedish actress legend and star of this film, passed away today, age 83. :(

 

As I may have mentioned earlier in this thread, I tried to contact Andersson several years ago in my search for the film, but never got through (this was also before her stroke in 2009, I think). She was one of the last remaining cast and crew members from STORIA. Now John Williams is the last man standing, at least as far as the 'main people' are concerned.

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