Richard Penna

Sorry, my post was not a response to yours, yours came in while I was typing mine up and I didn't see it until after
 
But yes, JTW's posts about her in this thread were completely out of line thread derailments.

You'd think KK had credited William Ross with composing the score to provoke that.

Or... saying an impromptu soundbite about how few notes a great theme needs to announce itself. Jeez.
 
Not a fan of that featurette myself - why did JW not talk about the themes he'd created or the overall sound of the score? It's just a backslapping puff piece that adds nothing whatsoever to our understanding of the score.

You guys are hilarious 

I disagree with your basic notion that it's a good thing for members of a club to have access to music that the regular public can't access.
 
Even if some label were to put out elaborate session releases, you still wouldn't need to prevent the general public from purchasing. You'd just focus your marketing to the people who will most likely want it.

I disagree as you'd therefore be restricting the availability of a score in an age where the Internet makes that unneeded.
 
The current practice of putting exclusive tracks on non-soundtrack releases for different countries doesn't make sense to me because people can just buy (or will just 'obtain') those tracks anyway.

I disagree with your basic notion that it's a good thing for members of a club to have access to music that the regular public can't access.
 
Even if some label were to put out elaborate session releases, you still wouldn't need to prevent the general public from purchasing. You'd just focus your marketing to the people who will most likely want it.

I appear to have Sphere in lossless, although whether it actually is I neither know nor care (fake transcodes being fashionable) - it sounds fine to me. I'd obviously buy it.
 
I seem to remember on viewing a clip of part of the final battle in The 13th Warrior that something sounded different from the OST track so there may be a 'film version' of that, but otherwise I think the extra material struck me as just 'nice to have'. I'm a little more interested in the remastering aspect of a DE.
 
Ice Age would be another one that has some very nice extra material.

I disagree with your basic notion that it's a good thing for members of a club to have access to music that the regular public can't access.
 
Even if some label were to put out elaborate session releases, you still wouldn't need to prevent the general public from purchasing. You'd just focus your marketing to the people who will most likely want it.

I disagree as you'd therefore be restricting the availability of a score in an age where the Internet makes that unneeded.
 
The current practice of putting exclusive tracks on non-soundtrack releases for different countries doesn't make sense to me because people can just buy (or will just 'obtain') those tracks anyway.

Did you maybe consider not sending that disgusting message in the first place? The fact that it's revealed you for the character you really are is no one's fault but your own.
 
(btw, either you think that was a suitable message, in which case that's sick, or you're angry because you know it wasn't in this case... you got what you deserved.)

https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/constructive_criticism
 
 
The fact that this needs to be pointed out is pathetic. As soon as you start attacking the composer personally you've lost the argument.

Sycophants? There's a difference between having a positive place of discussion, including 'oh, that's not the best one he's done, actually', and wanting to minimise discussion from those who only want to denigrate the composer.
 
If I were to post some negative thoughts I have on Star Wars, I wouldn't do it in an appreciation thread because although I feel my comments are just as valid, I know they aren't in keeping with those who want to discuss positively. I've put them elsewhere.

Not this shit again...
 
It's not difficult - Zimmer's done some memorable scores, and also some terrible ones. It's nice to be able to discuss the better ones without constant interruptions from those who hate him and wish he'd never entered film music.
 
 
I don't think John Williams is a God of music 100% of the time. I look forward to your acceptance of this in return, then we can carry on with our lives.

Actually, it was Holst who copied Hans.

I'll be completely honest: I don't like this method of a score written by a huge number of people while the person that actually gets the "Music By" credit is just an umbrella term. In fact, I hate it.
 
It's not specifically to Zimmer - I hate when other composers do it too, including the man in my profile pic. I loved JNH's score to A Hidden Life, but I was extremely disappointed to know that someone got credited as additional composer. It's a 40-minute score, couldn't you write it on your own? 
 
John Williams scored 9 Star Wars, 5 Indiana Jones and lots of other Spielberg classics all on his own, Howard Shore did 6 Middle Earth epics, but you aren't capable of writing a 40 minute score without asking some dude that just left Musical college to write, what, half of it? A quarter? A third? All?
 
I love John Powell, his music makes me so good. But I genuinely hate that part of it (how much? Nobody knows or wants to tell) was written by other people. Which parts? The best ones? The not so good ones? Did you only have a supervising role, listening to their cues and saying "yeah, that's good enough" or "no, it needs more drama, put more horns into it"? Do you even deserve that "Music By" credit?
 
I think Corellia Chase from Solo is one of Powell's best action cues. But is it really? Or are we in fact listening to Batu Sener's masterpiece?
 
I know Zimmer or younger (born after 1960) composers aren't the only ones doing it though. According to some accounts, James Horner did it too. And it is so disappointing to me. How many Horner cues I loved since I was a teenager weren't written by him? Is the classic "The Launch" cue from Apollo 13 ghostwritten by some unknown? The Ludlows from Legends of the Fall? The love theme from Braveheart?
 
So much of the music I loved may not have been written by who I think wrote them, and this thought just drives me insane.
 
If these people were open about that and specifically tell "I never wrote anything, I just supervised" or "I wrote this, this and this cue, while my partner handled this and this cue", then I'd feel a lot better. Seriously, I was supper happy when the cue list for Kung Fu Panda (a score credited to Zimmer and Powell) more or less revealed which parts belonged to each composer. It made me appreciate that score a lot more now that I sort of know who did what.
 
Another positive example: the 2012 LLL expansion of Goldsmith's Star Trek: The Motion Picture reveals which cues were written by Fred Steiner. It made so much easier to appreciate what Goldsmith really did and what exactly were Steiner contributions. I don't blame Goldsmith for using help (it was a famously troubled production and recording), but rather I admire Steiner for writing a moving finale for the movie (A Good Start) and LLL for revealing that he was the responsible for this great cue.
 
It's just... maddening. At least since that disturbing Vanity Fair article was published the big ones started being more open about it (the Xander guy was credited for most of the Willow episodes instead of just JNH). But what about past scores? Really, can someone tell me which music I can credit to JNH, Horner, Powell, HGW, Zimmer and which to Xander, Balfe, Badelt, and all the others? Why be so secretive about it?
 
Why does every track in The Dark Knight's OST is credited to both Zimmer and JNH, even the ones that were clearly written by just one of them (the Joker and Harvey Dent themes)? It's ridiculous: two of JNH's most listened tracks on Spotify are just Batman themes that weren't written by him!
 
This is just a rant. And yeah, it stems more from my OCD of actually wanting to know the responsible for the music I like than anything. I could never be one of these "I don't care who the composer/s is/are as long as the music is good". I just... can't.
 

Sycophants? There's a difference between having a positive place of discussion, including 'oh, that's not the best one he's done, actually', and wanting to minimise discussion from those who only want to denigrate the composer.
 
If I were to post some negative thoughts I have on Star Wars, I wouldn't do it in an appreciation thread because although I feel my comments are just as valid, I know they aren't in keeping with those who want to discuss positively. I've put them elsewhere.

Sycophants? There's a difference between having a positive place of discussion, including 'oh, that's not the best one he's done, actually', and wanting to minimise discussion from those who only want to denigrate the composer.
 
If I were to post some negative thoughts I have on Star Wars, I wouldn't do it in an appreciation thread because although I feel my comments are just as valid, I know they aren't in keeping with those who want to discuss positively. I've put them elsewhere.

Not this shit again...
 
It's not difficult - Zimmer's done some memorable scores, and also some terrible ones. It's nice to be able to discuss the better ones without constant interruptions from those who hate him and wish he'd never entered film music.
 
 
I don't think John Williams is a God of music 100% of the time. I look forward to your acceptance of this in return, then we can carry on with our lives.

WTF? Maleficent's action music are nothing similar to this. Maybe Hunger Games (both THG and SW&TH are from the same year, when JNH was going through his Remote Control phase, whether he chose or producers forced him to). But in Maleficent and later FB he returned to a more traditionally orchestral approach, more similar with his early 2000s fantasy movies than his gritty scores of the early 2010s.
 
This is the Snow White cue we're talking about btw. Listen to it and look how it's more akin to Salt than Maleficent:
 
 

What's being ignored here is that these appreciation threads don't ban posting of stuff like that... just put it somewhere else.
 
Like a thread discussing the best themes in RoP (pretty sure we had one of those) and someone barges in and says they're all crap and McCreary is a hack. Their comments are welcome on the forum, but no one could surely suggest that's the right time and place, considering the spirit of the thread.
 
And to provide what I feel is a non-positive, but appreciation-appropriate example comment: Inferno was extremely disappointing (less diplomatic: rubbish) after the wonderful Da Vinci  and A&D, with an overuse on electronics and harsh rhythms. However, I hated the film too, so I can only imagine that Howard's direction to Zimmer and the material wasn't what we hoped it might be.

What's being ignored here is that these appreciation threads don't ban posting of stuff like that... just put it somewhere else.
 
Like a thread discussing the best themes in RoP (pretty sure we had one of those) and someone barges in and says they're all crap and McCreary is a hack. Their comments are welcome on the forum, but no one could surely suggest that's the right time and place, considering the spirit of the thread.
 
And to provide what I feel is a non-positive, but appreciation-appropriate example comment: Inferno was extremely disappointing (less diplomatic: rubbish) after the wonderful Da Vinci  and A&D, with an overuse on electronics and harsh rhythms. However, I hated the film too, so I can only imagine that Howard's direction to Zimmer and the material wasn't what we hoped it might be.

Sycophants? There's a difference between having a positive place of discussion, including 'oh, that's not the best one he's done, actually', and wanting to minimise discussion from those who only want to denigrate the composer.
 
If I were to post some negative thoughts I have on Star Wars, I wouldn't do it in an appreciation thread because although I feel my comments are just as valid, I know they aren't in keeping with those who want to discuss positively. I've put them elsewhere.

Sycophants? There's a difference between having a positive place of discussion, including 'oh, that's not the best one he's done, actually', and wanting to minimise discussion from those who only want to denigrate the composer.
 
If I were to post some negative thoughts I have on Star Wars, I wouldn't do it in an appreciation thread because although I feel my comments are just as valid, I know they aren't in keeping with those who want to discuss positively. I've put them elsewhere.