Falstaft

Here’s a question, it’s seems like people feel like the two main sections of Han’s theme are melodically different enough to be separate ideas, but what about the third section? To my untrained ears, it sound like a halfway point between the two - like it could be a B section to either theme.
 
So what’s the analysis of the third section from people who understand music composition?

It sounds like an outgrowth of the B with its acciaccatura-like melodic detail and falling interval (that doesn't resolve at the bottom like the A), but it could also be shown to derive from the A. It indirectly demonstrates how closely A (Lehman's "Heroic") and B ("Searching") are related in design. It also has the rising fourth pickup like Luke A / The Force, and falls back to its initial note like the Force, a sort of "do or do not" bit.

We can call it two themes, but even Lehman, although he mentions the criteria of a leitmotif not being subsidiary to something else, designates Luke's A as a principal leitmotif and not Luke's B. We can say Luke has two themes and they're both Luke's theme, collectively or individually.
 
Yes, although I wouldn't privilege a musicological point of view over other ways of engaging with the music. Williams himself, although he is the composer with over half a century of creating his own style, speaks in a more general way about his work, not going into technical terms (style words like processional or cantilena aside).

Haha! I absolutely love this kind of thing. More Skywalker family resemblances (or reflections) to add to Luke, Across the Stars, etc. I sometimes wonder if Williams is conscious of this kind of thing or not. I mean, Kylo's main motif is clearly lifted almost verbatim from the end of the Emperor's theme, but I have my doubts he did that on purpose; rather his mind just operates on a fiercely permutational level, e.g. "composing backwards."

Yeah, but according to Williams:1
 
 
I used to think he was misremembering (the interview is 16 years removed from Return of the Jedi) but re-reading it, I now get the opposite impression, which is apt because he was probably still conducting these pieces on the concert hall ad nauseam, not to mention gearing up for Episode I.
 
I'm certainly not saying this approach should be applied to every theme in the Star Wars catalog: rather, only where Williams intended for it, either explictly or in a way that can be easily deduced from the music, album arrangement, etc...
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1  Craig L. Byrd, Star Wars 20th Anniversary: Interview with John Williams, in: Film Score Monthly (1998).

So where do we end up on the "is it two themes or two parts of one theme" debate now that we've all heard it?
 
I'm no expert, but from what I hear there is a first distinct melody (the "heroic" one), then another (the "searching"), then finally a third (which is more clearly a counter melody to the "searching"). The fact that the searching theme seems to have it's own B section makes me think that it's two themes, but then again the searching theme itself feels like a B section to the heroic theme. I don't know, I really don't know much about this stuff. All I know is that Rey's theme has like 5 different sections, so I'm inclined to say they're all just parts of one theme.

Hi Demodex, I've updated my own little thematic catalog to include notation and links for the main themes from Solo, as well as Rogue One finally. With the exception of #8, all of these new themes get *real* workouts in terms of development in this film -- more, I'd wager than most of the new stuff in TLJ!  Not sure of timings yet, and some of my metrical interpretations may be off, but it's a start...
 
1. Young Han Solo (Heroic)
2. Young Han Solo (Searching)
3. Secrets/Crimson Dawn  (Definitely derived from the "Searching" motif but treated pretty independently in terms of rhythm, orchestration, affect throughout Solo)
4. Han & Q'ira
5. Han & Chewie
6. Beckett's Gang
7 .Enfys Nest
8. L-8/Droid Uprising
 
There's some new incidental motifs in this movie too, plus plenty of references to previously established thematic materials (my favorite is the Imperial Troops reference in "Train Heist", and the obvious one that shows up during the surprise cameo at the end...) 
 
*Edited w/ change of name for #3 to reflect what Powell apparently called it.
 
 
Leitmotif Catalogue -- Frank Lehman, 2018.pdf

The original "Han and the Princess" did this with Leia's theme

Then he said: Powell baby, now go back and rewrite the entire score using my awesome new theme.

Oh that would be the "secrets" motif that Powell mentioned in several interviews. It's in the score quite a lot.
 
Karol

I think The Adventures of Han is a delightfully fresh and fun piece that achieves quite a lot of different things at once, and in subtle ways. 
 
Connective tissue and seemingly throwaway moments actually hearken back (or is that forward?) to a lot of the action writing in the OT, but just in quick glimpses/foreshadowings.
 
It's a sort of in medio res piece, and might seem less tightly constructed than it actually is, which is a rather apt way of having form serve as a kind of characterization.
 
The piece is structurally who Han is as a character: Someone who suddenly finds himself in the middle of a (mis)adventure. On the surface, it's music of impulse, whim; it's designed to feel rhapsodic, even though, as has been pointed out, it's actually a kind of rondo. 
 
On the other hand, it's Williams also showcasing his less romantic, more modern style. The motivics are more concerned with rhythmic twists than long-lined lyricism. 
It's a less heroic, more haphazardous take on the elements that constitute Luke's theme. A sort of curveball Luke in minor mode. 
 
It's clever and catchy, and bridges the old and the new in a very elegant way. 

This past August, the Boston Symphony Orchestra and the Players of the Boston Symphony and their local union, local 9-535, agreed to a three-year contract that included provisions for local radio and live streaming. Unfortunately, regional radio and on demand streaming fall under the jurisdiction of the American Federation of Musicians. Although the national agreement expired in April, negotiations for a successor contract will only begin in October. Consequently, regional broadcasts of Boston Symphony Orchestra concerts will not be available until the negotiations between the American Federation of Musicians and the Employer association have been completed. We apologize for the inconvenience."

Hi Demodex, I've updated my own little thematic catalog to include notation and links for the main themes from Solo, as well as Rogue One finally. With the exception of #8, all of these new themes get *real* workouts in terms of development in this film -- more, I'd wager than most of the new stuff in TLJ!  Not sure of timings yet, and some of my metrical interpretations may be off, but it's a start...
 
1. Young Han Solo (Heroic)
2. Young Han Solo (Searching)
3. Secrets/Crimson Dawn  (Definitely derived from the "Searching" motif but treated pretty independently in terms of rhythm, orchestration, affect throughout Solo)
4. Han & Q'ira
5. Han & Chewie
6. Beckett's Gang
7 .Enfys Nest
8. L-8/Droid Uprising
 
There's some new incidental motifs in this movie too, plus plenty of references to previously established thematic materials (my favorite is the Imperial Troops reference in "Train Heist", and the obvious one that shows up during the surprise cameo at the end...) 
 
*Edited w/ change of name for #3 to reflect what Powell apparently called it.
 
 
Leitmotif Catalogue -- Frank Lehman, 2018.pdf

Awesome!  Thanks!

Given the sloppy performance, and that Powell basically needed it to do the score, I'd say no. It's a courtesy work done in an afternoon. Next.

I didn't find anything wrong with the performance.

Hi everyone,
 
I just attended an open rehearsal of tomorrow's Boston Pops concert (with the maestro himself conducting!). It's going to feature the world premiere of "The Adventures of Han," as well as Pops premieres of "Rebellion is Reborn" and the new "Han Solo & the Princess" arrangement.
 
I've got a lot to say about the new Solo piece, which I'm sure we'll all be poring over soon enough. But I thought I'd just share this much -- you're going to love it. It's complex, substantial, and memorable. There's some impossibly virtuosic trumpet writing in the middle that is especially impressive, very much in the vein of "Rey's Journey" from TLJ, only even more elaborate. In fact, the whole piece feels like a hybrid of straight-forward character themes (themes--yes, there's two) and action set-piece. I noticed some welcome shades of the ostinatos from "I Can Fly Anything" and the little recurring octatonic motif from "The Battle of Crait." 
 
If it's using this thematic material, I imagine Powell's score should be a real barn-burner!

doesn't feel forced

Just gave the track a first listen... very nice! A wonderfully exuberant and lighthearted romp. I can definitely hear bits and pieces of "The Battle of Crait" throughout the piece.

Believe me, it delivers! Williams' new theme(s) are all over the score with both tender and soaring action mode renditions. Many of them more impressive than Williams' own arrangement here.

Hi everyone,
 
I just attended an open rehearsal of tomorrow's Boston Pops concert (with the maestro himself conducting!). It's going to feature the world premiere of "The Adventures of Han," as well as Pops premieres of "Rebellion is Reborn" and the new "Han Solo & the Princess" arrangement.
 
I've got a lot to say about the new Solo piece, which I'm sure we'll all be poring over soon enough. But I thought I'd just share this much -- you're going to love it. It's complex, substantial, and memorable. There's some impossibly virtuosic trumpet writing in the middle that is especially impressive, very much in the vein of "Rey's Journey" from TLJ, only even more elaborate. In fact, the whole piece feels like a hybrid of straight-forward character themes (themes--yes, there's two) and action set-piece. I noticed some welcome shades of the ostinatos from "I Can Fly Anything" and the little recurring octatonic motif from "The Battle of Crait." 
 
If it's using this thematic material, I imagine Powell's score should be a real barn-burner!

I've heard the actual concert arrangement and can state with surety they're different themes and treated as such by Williams. They have strongly contrasting orchestration, keys, and textures, and they're internally structured such that each has a tightly-knit beginning/middle/end melodic organization of their own, the hallmark of Mark Richard's "grammatical theme" archetype. 
 
The mock-up version you're referring to does make them sound more closely related, and that may indeed be how Powell treats them. But going from the concert arrangement, it's not ambiguous that they are strongly independent ideas. I think that will be evident soon enough once everyone has a chance to hear it.
 
Oh, one other thing to look forward to. The first, comparatively dashing theme for Han occupies the same musical universe as Poe's leitmotif (down to a virtually identical harmonic progression and melodic contour in its second phrase). That, plus the similarity of the low-string ostinato in this arrangement to that in "I Can Fly Anything," makes it seem as though Dameron is the direct inheritor to Han Solo's musical character.
 
 

A wonderfully cogent point (no surprise) by Frank here … context is everything when defining what, precisely, constitutes a theme. Even extra-musical context can play a role.
 
Incidentally, the word “theme” is thrown around a lot in The Music of the Lord of the Rings because, honestly, it’s the most efficient way of relating to readers. Constantly juggling “theme,” “motif,” “motive,” etc. was exhausting in early drafts … especially as each instance then required some sort of disclaimer relating to the innate subjectivity of it all. And that was before getting into musical context, composer intent, and so on. It was word soup!
 
At some point, it’s cleaner to think of it all as “the material.” It reads horribly, but it’s much truer to most composers’ mindsets.
 
 

Oh, I'm just as excited as the next guy.
 
I find the idea of Williams continuing to "guide" the Star Wars sound and leitmotivic architecture even for spinoffs (which he is not scoring) very interesting indeed; and I quite like what I've heard of the tune.

We'll all hear it soon enough. Let's not get pedantry get in the way of my original goal, which was building hype.