LOTR v.s. Potter

[Jeshopk 8]

That's definitely one of the bland, regurgitated tracks. Chamber's strength lies mostly in its standalone concert works, certainly not as a film score.

Willams' own contributions to actual underscore were excellent (Dueling the Basilisk, Flying Car, Spiders, etc.) and William Ross also did such a good job extending bits from HPSS that it worked in the film almost better than it did in the original. If CoS were the first film, it would be a cohesive first Potter score, maybe moreso than the original in that it does not reuse Hedwigs theme so often.

Isn't it bad enough that I have to suffer through "The Norwegian Ridgeback" to get to "A Change Of Season"?

Does a boring piece like "Cakes For Crabbe And Goyle" now beat something like "Theoden King"?

Hmm, I quite like those pieces - no suffering needed But 'Cakes' has been established is not by Williams.

[indy4 155]

Isn't it bad enough that I have to suffer through "The Norwegian Ridgeback" to get to "A Change Of Season"?

Does a boring piece like "Cakes For Crabbe And Goyle" now beat something like "Theoden King"?

Hmm, I quite like those pieces - no suffering needed But 'Cakes' has been established is not by Williams.

This thread has too controversial of a topic and too many pages to avoid suffering - in fact, it's long overdue. Bring it on!

[Quintus 5,399]

Anyone who reckons the first three HP scores better those of LOTR is bloody blind, deaf and ignorant.

See now, to me this is more of an unabashedly fanboy-ish comment than the attitudes taken by people like KM, or others who are often called Williams fanboys. It's typical of snobby LotR fans, though.

i agree,that is just a ridiculous comment.

Thing is, I was actually being ironic and not at all serious, but never mind.

[King Mark 3,631]

It's getting hard to tell around here.

K.M.Beeing more carefull using sarcasm

[Ray Barnsbury 8]

Yeah, I wondered about that, but you've posted things like that quite seriously in the past, so the irony didn't work.

[gkgyver 1,645]

Does "The Dreams of Tree" beat "Mischief Managed!

Does Duelling The Basilisk beat Theoden Rides Forth?

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

Mischief Managed is almost nothing but cut and edited music from the rest of the score.

The Dreams Of Trees is better, frankly.

[Morlock 11]

No, it does not. But there are other cues to be found that might. Comparing tracks one on one is just totally random and irrelevent.

[John Crichton 4]

Mischief Managed is almost nothing but cut and edited music from the rest of the score.

But the part that isn't is the best cue in the whole score.

[King Mark 3,631]

LotR =TV movie quality themes and underscore played by a 200 musician orchestra,so yeah,sure it sounds opulent but that's about it.

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

Any vote against Howard Shore is a vote against Canada!

You should be ashamed of yourself, Mark!

[King Mark 3,631]

Yeah,i know,but JW still wins.

k.M.Not very patriotic

[Quintus 5,399]

Yeah, I wondered about that, but you've posted things like that quite seriously in the past,

You know that for a fact do you? Anyway forget it. Perhaps in the future my tone won't be so immediately obvious as it seems. Thus another forum personality trait joins the ever swelling vacuum. But at least this small forum clearly allows for that sort of thing

[indy4 155]

Does "The Dreams of Tree" beat "Mischief Managed!

Does Duelling The Basilisk beat Theoden Rides Forth?

Does "Rivendell" beat "The Chamber of Secrets?"

Mischief Managed is almost nothing but cut and edited music from the rest of the score.

The Dreams Of Trees is better, frankly.

Not the beggining. THe beggining has an awesome variation on Double Trouble.

But if you insist...does Dream of Trees beat Buckbeak's Flight?

[Ray Barnsbury 8]

Comparing tracks one on one is just totally random and irrelevent.

[MSM 126]

What I find disturbing,in a JW forum,is that a vote for LotR is a vote against some of Williams best music.

K.M.

I'm beginning to feel not at home here. I think this is an insult to JW on his own Fan forum. I also don't get it, LotR may be good, but anyone can hear the music is not as advanced, complex, entertaining, sophisticated and effective as is Williams'. Are people voting for LotR just to make it a close call?

[indy4 155]

Why is everybody communicating via quotes?

[gkgyver 1,645]

but anyone can hear the music is not as advanced, complex, entertaining, sophisticated and effective as is Williams'.

Anyone can see this statement won't hold up.

Does "Rivendell" beat "The Chamber of Secrets?"

Easily.

[Morlock 11]

Whether it's entertaining is purely subjective. I appreciate Shore's work more than I like or enjoy it (same thing with the films themselves).

I'm beginning to feel not at home here. I think this is an insult to JW on his own Fan forum. I also don't get it, LotR may be good, but anyone can hear the music is not as advanced, complex, entertaining, sophisticated and effective as is Williams'. Are people voting for LotR just to make it a close call?

I voted for LoTR because they are more impressive as a whole than the three Potter scores. One for one, It's a different case. But I find Shore's achievment in scoring the three films as a whole staggering. Not one of the scores alone, but as a whole. I find Williams' acheivment in the HP films staggering as well, but individually, not as a whole.

And I think that Shore's scores are thought out as intricately as Williams. I happen not to like the music as much. I am a JW fan because I believe that JW is the most impressive film composer ever. Saying that another composer is also great is hardly heresy. And, really, it is an unfair comparison ot begin with. Williams has never had the opportunity to compose three film scores that will together comprise a whole. Even what he tried to do with the prequels was torn down by Lucas.

Morlock- who doesn't think that truely loving JW means voting for him at every meaningless poll about anything and writing in red letters.

[indy4 155]

Does "Rivendell" beat "The Chamber of Secrets?"

Easily.

Let the fighting begin...

[Luke Skywalker 1,795]

Does "Rivendell" beat "The Chamber of Secrets?"

Easily.

Fun that you mention that, since the rivendell theme sounds much like The fury main theme, AOTC's mystery motif and COS' malfoy motif...

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

it does not!

[MSM 126]

Morlock- who doesn't think that truely loving JW means voting for him at every meaningless poll about anything and writing in red letters.

That was an easy one, Morlock I am not that kind of fan, but the thing I hope people are doing is voting honestly and not because of liking to be politically incorrect or trying to influence polls. I do not seriously believe JWFans here around, if they really had the choice, e.g. had to burn one of the two trilogy scores, 50% of them would throw HP into the flames. Do you?

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

We don't need no Potter let the motherf*cker burn! Burn motherf*cker burn!

[MSM 126]

We don't need no Potter let the motherf*cker burn! Burn motherf*cker burn!

Don't talk about his mother like that.

[Mr. Breathmask 555]

Egh.

Let's have another Jerry vs. John poll after this.

[gkgyver 1,645]

AOTC's mystery motif and COS' malfoy motif...

With the little difference that the Rivendell theme came before those.

[Red 75]

What I find disturbing,in a JW forum,is that a vote for LotR is a vote against some of Williams best music.

K.M.

I'm beginning to feel not at home here. I think this is an insult to JW on his own Fan forum. I also don't get it, LotR may be good, but anyone can hear the music is not as advanced, complex, entertaining, sophisticated and effective as is Williams'. Are people voting for LotR just to make it a close call?

I voted for LOTR because I really and truly think it is better than Harry Potter. Favoritism for composers has nothing to do with it. Since when is it disrespectful to John Williams when one prefers someone's else's work over his? I am not less of a JW fan because I prefer LOTR over Potter.

Rabbit--primarily a Williams fan

[gkgyver 1,645]

Are people voting for LotR just to make it a close call?

Yes, it's all one big conspiracy to annoy the rabid JW fan.

[Jacob 0]

A Conspiracy Unmasked

[gkgyver 1,645]

Are you playing the word association game?

[indy4 155]

Blame Game

[Ollie 1,059]

I guess its hard for people to fathom that there are those who love John Williams and think he's the best but can accept the fact that other composers are capable of writing music that is just as good or better at times

[indy4 155]

I, for the record, am not one of those people!

[BurgaFlippinMan 7]

2 great scores and one decent score vs 1 great score, 1 decent score and 1 very good score. HP wins.

[AI 0]

What a grotesque poll, it's like comparing a glass of dirty river water with a bottle of chilled Gatorade.

It's like comparing a bowl of rice with a Steak Sandwich.

The music of John Towner Williams is divine. Howard Shore's music is just trash.

I love you.

I love you for your brutal frankness, and for your honest truths.

Two pea's in a pod mate . We must stand together against this.

[Romão 2,274]

I do love some of Shore's material for LOTR, but I have to agree with Ray on his thoughts. And those long chords really are loooooooooong in LOTR. The HP isn't really very cohesive, something LOTR really is. And while I love Shore's dedication, aproach and effort (also, the CR are quality templates now), I still can't help but feel that Shore's "Ego paying checks your body can't cash".

For musical quality alone, Harry Potter wins. Though I can see why some of you would vote for LOTR.

[Richard Penna 3,694]

Shore's Ego?

If either of them has the bigger ego, it's JW. I will admit however, that apart from LotR, I've only liked two other scores I've heard from him - Mrs. Doubtfire and Panic Room. I'm afraid LotR might have been a one-hit wonder with the right material and the right director to make the right demands of him.

Doesn't stop it being a crowning glory though.

[Luke Skywalker 1,795]

I'm afraid LotR might have been a one-hit wonder with the right material and the right director to make the right demands of him.

It's a one hit-wonder.

AOTC's mystery motif and COS' malfoy motif...

With the little difference that the Rivendell theme came before those.

But since AOTC and COS are derivative of his Fury theme... JW wins

[Romão 2,274]

I didn't mean to say he as arrogant or that his ego was too big for its own sake, since he never comes across like that in every interview I've seen. I was just trying to squeeze in that quote from Hot Shots

[Jeshopk 8]

Shore's Ego?

If either of them has the bigger ego, it's JW. I will admit however, that apart from LotR, I've only liked two other scores I've heard from him - Mrs. Doubtfire and Panic Room. I'm afraid LotR might have been a one-hit wonder with the right material and the right director to make the right demands of him.

Doesn't stop it being a crowning glory though.

Most of Shore's music is as good as or better than LOTR. People just don't care about it because it has nothing to do with Middle Earth.

[Ollie 1,059]

Howard Shore has no ego that I'm aware of, he comes across the same way as Williams does in interviews. He seems humble and appreciative of his fans.

Howard Shore has written good music for other films. He scores completely different films than Williams does and they are the kind that don't require boommmtzzzzz.

[King Mark 3,631]

I like The Aviator.

I think H1-Racer Plane/The Way of the Future theme is better than anything in LotR

[Richard Penna 3,694]

A History of Violence, The Aviator - neither of those really had anything that inspired me, although the latter was I'm sure saturated with songs. Then again, haven't seen either of the movies.

[Morlock 11]

The Aviator is one of the finest soundtrack albums in recent years, even if it's really more of a concept album than film score representation.

[gkgyver 1,645]

I think H1-Racer Plane/The Way of the Future theme is better than anything in LotR

What do you mean "better"? It's basically just a variation on the beacon lighting music, just with castanets.

[King Mark 3,631]

Well,the beakon light music is one of the better parts of LotR .But as great as a highlight it is,I fear people are overrating LotR due to those highlights(which IMO are far and in between)..

I'm sure if HP had 4 hour scores per movie,Williams would have been more than capable to write endless underscore with his themes just like Shore did in LotR.But it would be Williams underscore,which would be much better

[gkgyver 1,645]

Which doesn't answer the question why you think the racer plane cue is better than the beacon music because they are obviously identical.

[King Mark 3,631]

I wouldn't say identical.it's more like No ticket vs Gilderoy Lockheart

I still prefer The Way of the Future.

[Morlock 11]

For me, it is better because I connected with the thought process of The Aviator album far more than the LoTR one. Yes, musically it is similar. But thought-wise, there's a whole other thing going on there. It's all about getting inside the head of the man flying the plane. 'Icarus' is the finest cue I've ever heard by Shore. Not only is it musically thrilling, but it encapsulates the concepts of the film, and of story of Icarus as a parable on the film. Music that affects me on an emotional level, and on an intellectual level (which, in turn, enhances the emotional response).

With a composer as talented as Shore, dissing something because it musically sounds like something he's written before is a moot point, since I can hear LoTR music in several of his scores before. The point is, what the music is saying each and every time is something different and unique (unlike Horner, for example, who likes to use the same music to represent the same things in any number of films).