The 2nd OFFICIAL Indy IV Thread

[indy4 155]

And I didn't feel any rising tension in the music as Indy and Marion sunk. Okay, it doesn't have to literally represent sinking, but it shouldn't sound like a light chase scene. In fact, it sounds a lot like "Basket Chase."

Why shouldn't it sound like a "light chase scene?" One could argue that during the basket game, Indy was scared as hell and filled with desperation, as he thought he would never see Marion again. Yet it was scored with a light-hearted and fun cue, and it worked perfectly in the film. Same goes for "The Snake Pit."

In fact, the same goes for all chase scenes. I'm sure the rising tension Indy is feeling as he sinks down in quicksand is just as tension filled as what he felt when he was being chased by armed bandits on a high speed train, being shot at on motorboats, trying to stop a young kid from tumbling a long fall into a pool of lava while speeding by on a rickety mine car, or running through the streets of Cairo looking desperatley for a needle in a haystack in order to save his loved one. There's the same amount of tension...why shouldn't this scene be scored the same way as the "light chase scenes?"

Indy's annoying, pedantic dialogue. ("Actually, it's not quicksand...").

That was hilarious.

Well, I have to disagree. Nobody goes on academic rants when they're on the verge of death, especially Indiana Jones.

Nobody stops beating up a Nazi in order to smile with said Nazi at a comical event (Raiders).

Nobody comes up with witty remarks while trapped in a death defying situation, such as "There are gonna be two dead people in here if you don't hurry up!" (Temple of Doom).

Nobody would pause while being chased by angry bandits, stop running, look around, and take the time to say "Everybody's lost but me" in a way that nobody except the speaker can hear (Last Crusade).

Nobody goes on academic rants when they're on the verge of death. (Kingdom of the Crystal Skull).

[Henry B 50]

I don't really find those are comparable. Not only are those examples much shorter than Indy's quicksand monologue, but Harrison Ford stays in the action. Does he calmly and dryly quip that "there are going to be two dead people in here," then chuckle? No, he screams it at the top of his lungs with the utmost desperation.

[indy4 155]

The examples are still very similiar, and some of them are less realistic from a certain point - the reference from LC wasn't even spoken to anybody.

I just sent another e-mail to Concord (this time to press@concordmusicgroup.com and customerservice@concordmusicgroup.com), requesting expanded/complete Indy scores.

[Henry B 50]

Cool, that'll make a difference...

[Luke Skywalker 1,795]

And I didn't feel any rising tension in the music as Indy and Marion sunk. Okay, it doesn't have to literally represent sinking, but it shouldn't sound like a light chase scene. In fact, it sounds a lot like "Basket Chase."

Why shouldn't it sound like a "light chase scene?" One could argue that during the basket game, Indy was scared as hell and filled with desperation, as he thought he would never see Marion again. Yet it was scored with a light-hearted and fun cue, and it worked perfectly in the film. Same goes for "The Snake Pit."

EXACTLY.

Marion is from Indy's point of view, DEAD after the lighthearted basket chase. It makes unbelievable that she is dead for the watcher.

Same happens in the Snake pit, whose music i think is an hommage to basket chase.

One of the premises of quicksands are remain calm. Indy is doing that, and when he lectures, Marion shuts him up.

Come on its not the 1st time a comical lecture lesson in a dangerous scenario as been put on film.

[Ollie 1,059]

Spielberg could have filmed a piece of dog poo sitting on a table with CGI flies buzzing around it for 2 hours, call it Indiana Jones 4 and have John Williams play a synth blindfolded for the score and people here would still praise it.

[Luke Skywalker 1,795]

You are wrong.

anyway:

I could also say in the same vein that if Spielberg could have made Indy IV the best movie ever created and certain people would still think its was a poo with flies.

[Ollie 1,059]

Too bad he didn't make the best movie ever.

Hell, all he had to do was make a good movie, but it was not to be.

Funny that the last 2 Indy sequels have their butts kicked by a Batman film at the box office.

[Luke Skywalker 1,795]

Too bad he didn't make the best movie ever.

Hell, all he had to do was make a good movie, but it was not to be.

Funny that the last 2 Indy sequels have their butts kicked by a Batman film at the box office.

yet, it's the top grossing Indy movie...

[Ollie 1,059]

Not if you adjust for inflation and ticket sales, which is something even Lucas admitted.

[Luke Skywalker 1,795]

oops. i have to register on boxofficemojo to do that right?

[Ollie 1,059]

No you don't have to register for that.

http://www.boxofficemojo.com/alltime/adjusted.htm

[indy4 155]

You are wrong.

anyway:

I could also say in the same vein that if Spielberg could have made Indy IV the best movie ever created and certain people would still think its was a poo with flies.

I agree completely. Some people walked into the theatre determined to hate this film, maybe not knowing so.

[Quintus 5,399]

No they didn't. I'm sorry, but your statement is so obviously the assumption of a blind fanboy, its almost pitiful! I went to see Indy IV like a coyote about to dine on a recently snared Road Runner - I couldn't wait to lap that sh*t up.

It doesn't matter which way you try to spin it; I was MASSIVELY disappointed with Indy IV, for the simple reason that the movie was a complete and utter mess.

In fact, me being such the Indy fan that I am; I still prefer to look at it objectivity - I love certain bits, but I hate MOST of it. It doesn't matter, I'll block out that sh*t enough to buy the dvd, come release.

Is that the talk of an inherent hater? Don't give me that bull!

[Luke Skywalker 1,795]

Its not YOU who we are speaking about...

[Ollie 1,059]

You assume too much Luke.

And I'd rather be a bit hesitant compared to those who were ready to make love to the film as soon as it was announced.

[Delorean90 42]

For me, I went to the film three times. I went in twice knowing full well what the flaws were, and yet I enjoyed it thoroughly each time.

I think I'm beginning to see where KOTCS fits now. Raiders was the most serious. TOD was more purely like a '30s adventure film. LC was more of a companion to Raiders in its character development, had elements of a buddy movie, and was also the most urbane of the films (and I don't mean that in a derogatory way). KOTCS dabbles in '50s sci-fi elements, but is really, I think, closer to those jungle quest adventures from the '30s on through the '50s (a '50s Tarzan movie is almost the first thing that comes to mind, funnily enough). It makes it much easier to appreciate it, in my book.

[Mr. Breathmask 555]

That's one of the problems of KotCS. It wants to be a fifties sci-fi movie and get away with things like aliens and giant disc-like spaceships. It even taps into some Cold War paranoia.

But once you take that into an uninhabited jungle setting it all becomes a little... irrelevant and squeakily ill-fitting.

[Luke Skywalker 1,795]

I dont see ill-fitting when there have always been the talk about precolumbus civilisations and egyptians to have had they technology from the 'gods'.

Are we forgeting that Tin-Tin comic i dont remember its name? Did it hurt the fanchise?

And I'd rather be a bit hesitant compared to those who were ready to make love to the film as soon as it was announced.

I'll ignore that comment since i did not said anything to deserve it...

[Ollie 1,059]

Oh lighten up it wasn't directed at you personally, sheesh.

[indy4 155]

No they didn't. I'm sorry, but your statement is so obviously the assumption of a blind fanboy, its almost pitiful! I went to see Indy IV like a coyote about to dine on a recently snared Road Runner - I couldn't wait to lap that sh*t up.

It doesn't matter which way you try to spin it; I was MASSIVELY disappointed with Indy IV, for the simple reason that the movie was a complete and utter mess.

In fact, me being such the Indy fan that I am; I still prefer to look at it objectivity - I love certain bits, but I hate MOST of it. It doesn't matter, I'll block out that sh*t enough to buy the dvd, come release.

Is that the talk of an inherent hater? Don't give me that bull!

I said SOME people.

I remember you...you had a signature all decked out with Indy 4 stuff, you gave me a thumbs up when I listed all the crazy things I had done in preparation for Indy 4...you genuinely seemed excited.

There are some people who were ready to hate it.

[BurgaFlippinMan 7]

That's one of the problems of KotCS. It wants to be a fifties sci-fi movie and get away with things like aliens and giant disc-like spaceships. It even taps into some Cold War paranoia.

But once you take that into an uninhabited jungle setting it all becomes a little... irrelevant and squeakily ill-fitting.

So...did you hate it too?

[Delorean90 42]

That's one of the problems of KotCS. It wants to be a fifties sci-fi movie and get away with things like aliens and giant disc-like spaceships. It even taps into some Cold War paranoia.

But once you take that into an uninhabited jungle setting it all becomes a little... irrelevant and squeakily ill-fitting.

Well, not only is that not what I was saying, but I don't agree.

Indiana Jones and the Saucer Men From Mars wanted to be a fifties sci-fi movie. Indiana Jones and the Kingdom of the Crystal Skull merely dabbles in certain elements of that. For the vast majority of the film, though, it remains in much the same adventure/religious/archaeological idiom of the previous films, although, as I pointed out, it continues the tradition of having a different feel or purpose than each other one: I contend that it is primarily a 50s jungle quest film.

And I found the spaceship to not only work well in context, but also to have an excellent effects shot for its departure and the emergence of the lake in its place.

[QMM 4]

I went into the film with optimistic expectations and I was pretty disappointed when I came out of it, and I'm generally really positive with most movies.

[MissPadmé 17]

I went into the film with optimistic expectations and I was pretty disappointed when I came out of it, and I'm generally really positive with most movies.

Thats was axactly my reaction.. I kept ranting against the film with my friend all the way home. Its not that I didn enjoy it but we were SO thrown into the cold water out of nowhere, I just kept thinking:;

What the hell of a mess was that piece of film I have just seen??"

but then when I went a secondtime I was warned and I really enjoyed it.. a very funny modern movie

But NOW....

I start to realize what this movie could have been if Lucas wouldn be such a stubborn a** insisting on diverse elements..

Now I have the feeling that this movie, for being a pastiche of sooo many story elements (most of them fell short..) is somehow watchable

BUT THIS IS SOMETHING SHOULDNT BE SAYING ABOUT AN INDY FILM... HELL!!

I like The Phantom Menace soooo much better than this film (but I think that is a god film in general!)

[BurgaFlippinMan 7]

I went in just hoping that it wouldn't suck. And it didn't. While I did have fun the first time around, I wasn't too sure if it was what I wanted an Indy film to be. The second time, I liked it a lot more..having gotten past the odd feeling of watching an unfamiliar Indiana Jones film.

[Unlucky Bastard 7,782]

Fussy brats.

[Delorean90 42]

I went in just hoping that it wouldn't suck. And it didn't. While I did have fun the first time around, I wasn't too sure if it was what I wanted an Indy film to be. The second time, I liked it a lot more..having gotten past the odd feeling of watching an unfamiliar Indiana Jones film.

Exactly. That was something that I had going on. It's pretty disorienting to have an Indiana Jones film that you haven't been watching for years and years. That's one reason that multiple viewings help so much--for me, anyway.

[Luke Skywalker 1,795]

Oh lighten up it wasn't directed at you personally, sheesh.

Neither was mine, but since you talked like mine was aimed at you, i assumed you aimed yours at me.

This is worth the effort, let me buy you a drink

[Ollie 1,059]

Multiple viewings do not improve it.

I felt a 4th IJ film, after 19 years was a bad idea. Back in 1999 I also thought re-booting the Star Wars franchise was a bad idea. However I did something I've never done before, I avoided anything related to TPM. I didn't know anything about the film at all before I saw it with the exception of what was on the soundtrack. I knew Qui Gon died but I had no idea who he was.

Needless to say I was disappointed after watching the film.

Steven Spielberg has changed as director and given the way Lucas handled the prequels, I wasn't to excited about a 4th IJ film. Plus what I was seeing in the previews and advertisements didn't exactly please me.

So yes I went into the film a bit hesitant. I did not go into the film with a bunch of hatred and anger. Once again I was disappointed to discover my fears were true.

I also felt bad for my son, who was truly excited about seeing an Indiana Jones film on the big screen since the last one was released about 3 weeks before he was born. He was extremely disappointed in the film.

For the record I was disappointed when I first saw ROTJ in 1983 and Last Crusade in 1989. I remember walking out of the theatre then expressing some displeasure in how both films were handled.

[BurgaFlippinMan 7]

For the record I was disappointed when I first saw ROTJ in 1983 and Last Crusade in 1989. I remember walking out of the theatre then expressing some displeasure in how both films were handled.

Do you still dislike them now?

[Ollie 1,059]

I still feel the same way, perhaps more towards ROTJ.

[John Crichton 4]

I used to really like RotJ but it hasn't fared well as I've gotten older. The Luke/Vader/Emperor triangle and the space battle are about the only things worthwhile in it. I still love Last Crusade though, when I watched all the Indys on DVD when the new one came out I had so much fun with it.

For years I thought Indy 4 was a bad idea, but as we got more information and then eventually the very good IMO trailers I was sold on it. I went in expecting a good nostalga trip and a decent but 4th best Indy movie, and got exactly what I expected.

[Quintus 5,399]

No they didn't. I'm sorry, but your statement is so obviously the assumption of a blind fanboy, its almost pitiful! I went to see Indy IV like a coyote about to dine on a recently snared Road Runner - I couldn't wait to lap that sh*t up.

It doesn't matter which way you try to spin it; I was MASSIVELY disappointed with Indy IV, for the simple reason that the movie was a complete and utter mess.

In fact, me being such the Indy fan that I am; I still prefer to look at it objectivity - I love certain bits, but I hate MOST of it. It doesn't matter, I'll block out that sh*t enough to buy the dvd, come release.

Is that the talk of an inherent hater? Don't give me that bull!

I said SOME people.

I remember you...you had a signature all decked out with Indy 4 stuff, you gave me a thumbs up when I listed all the crazy things I had done in preparation for Indy 4...you genuinely seemed excited.

There are some people who were ready to hate it.

My sincerest apologies

[Mr. Breathmask 555]

That's one of the problems of KotCS. It wants to be a fifties sci-fi movie and get away with things like aliens and giant disc-like spaceships. It even taps into some Cold War paranoia.

But once you take that into an uninhabited jungle setting it all becomes a little... irrelevant and squeakily ill-fitting.

So...did you hate it too?

No. The whole thing has simply left me cold and indifferent. It's still like this movie hardly happened to me. And it's not because I've chosen to ignore or something radically negative like that. It just... didn't leave much of an impression.

[Luke Skywalker 1,795]

Yay, we can sleep calmly...for now:

Lucas says Indy is Harrison Ford and the hypotetical next movie will not be centered on Mutt.

click

[Richard Penna 3,689]

Please God don't let there be another one.

I mean I enjoyed KotCS, but I do remember coming out feeling a little disappointed.

I guess the excitement of actually being around to see an Indy movie on the big screen was really setting us all up for a disappointment unless the movie really delivered a 'wow' experience, which I would say it didn't come close to. I mean by the final scene with Irina meeting her maker, I had pretty much stopped caring. The special effects had gone beyond Spielberg's promise and the skyward shots of the spaceship made me seriously worried about what was coming up. Fears that were shortly confirmed. The end was rescued from ruin for me by the fedora business though; a nice touch.

[FattyMcButterpants 1]

http://search.musicnotes.com/?q=Indiana+Jo...id=Top&hl=n

Sheet music for those interested.

[Joe Brausam 214]

So I just purchased the new Making of Indiana Jones book and I was thumbing through it this morning, only to find something that I found quite hilarious regarding KOTCS.

"The first thing Steven said was he didn't want this to look like a slick action-adventure movie with digital backgrounds and effects or stunts that you couldn't do in reality." - Kathleen Kennedy

Ha, we all know how far THAT idea went..

[Luke Skywalker 1,795]

yet i did not saw any digital stunts.

They are used when a real stunt cannot be used or is too dangerous to make.

[Joe Brausam 214]

Well what I'M referring to in particular is the monkey/tarzan swinging scene..

And the fridge..

[BurgaFlippinMan 7]

Well what I'M referring to in particular is the monkey/tarzan swinging scene..

And the fridge..

To be fair I wouldn't count the fridge as a 'stunt'.

[Red 75]

Well what I'M referring to in particular is the monkey/tarzan swinging scene..

And the fridge..

To be fair I wouldn't count the fridge as a 'stunt'.

No, I think it's more accurate to call it a 'flaw'.

[King Mark 3,631]

Yay, we can sleep calmly...for now:

Lucas says Indy is Harrison Ford and the hypotetical next movie will not be centered on Mutt.

click

Considering how many false alerts we got about Indy beeing made,I doubt Indy 5 will see the light of day with a Williams score

[Red 75]

Yay, we can sleep calmly...for now:

Lucas says Indy is Harrison Ford and the hypotetical next movie will not be centered on Mutt.

click

Considering how many false alerts we got about Indy beeing made,I doubt Indy 5 will see the light of day with a Williams score

I'd rather not see it made at all.

[Ollie 1,059]

Yes that would be the wisest choice.

Just stop.

[Incanus 5,714]

Yes that would be the wisest choice.

Just stop.

I think that is what keeps Lucas making these films. Out of sheer spite of the desperate audiences who want to hold on to their dear memories of these franchises. He wants us to suffer for the benefit of his wallet!

[Luke Skywalker 1,795]

Just dont watch this one and spare us the badmouthing

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

I agree with Mark.

What I's rather see is Lethal Weapon 5.

[Delorean90 42]

I really wouldn't mind seeing one more--if they've really got something good and want to shoot two at a time, fine. But I think they can do one more--really, Indy V should be the "getting pulled out of retirement" story we were expecting from IV, now that Indy's married and has a son. And I enjoyed Crystal Skull enough to be open to the possibility.