Incanus 5,715 Posted November 2, 2008 Share Posted November 2, 2008 there are at least 4 cues that were greatly expanded on the old OST .The film versions on the 25th anniversary Ed are completely different.PromenadeOut to SeaShark Cage FugueOne Barrel chase (Great Shark Chase)they should have been included on the 25th Anniversary Ed.For Jaws the only problem was Williams' personal resequensing of the music which can be rectified very easily. The OST is indeed a completely different and separate recording of the music (much like many score albums at that time such as Omen II and The Fury to mention just two) and as such the music should not be on the 25th Anniversary edition of the score. Well unless they would have included the whole OST as a bonus like with Goldsmiths Omen II Deluxe Edition.But you are correct in that you need to keep your OST in this and other cases of Bouzereau expanded releases but the reason is that JW included more concertized tracks and alternates on the OSTs of these scores. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest macrea Posted November 2, 2008 Share Posted November 2, 2008 That Bouzereau blurb seems even more ludicrous after a night's sleep. He claims to have 'discovered' on previous CD projects that Williams orchestrates a very specific album experience. If that's the case, then how is it that the album experiences originally put together by Williams (CE3K, Jaws, E.T.) were not only redone but basically taken off the market? The latter two were even best-selling Grammy award winning albums. I'm sorry, the Indy set will be a welcome listen for the extra music, but the blatant hypocrisy is really distasteful. You mean to tell me that dispensable filler like "Bad Dates" was on Williams' short list for what was necessary to craft his 'album experience?' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Crichton 4 Posted November 2, 2008 Share Posted November 2, 2008 Indiana Jones: The Soundtracks Collection, shakedown crew's report. I think this new set was put together by monkeys. Oh, she's got fine music, but half the cues aren't there, and guess whose job it is to make it right?! OK, that's the best Trek quote I've seen in a long while. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marian Schedenig 8,193 Posted November 2, 2008 Share Posted November 2, 2008 JW and Bouzereau made some exciting editing decisions which we just have to live with.Exciting is hardly the word I would choose.They certainly got this board excited. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ollie 1,059 Posted November 2, 2008 Share Posted November 2, 2008 there are at least 4 cues that were greatly expanded on the old OST .The film versions on the 25th anniversary Ed are completely different.PromenadeOut to SeaShark Cage FugueOne Barrel chase (Great Shark Chase)they should have been included on the 25th Anniversary Ed.The 25th is the actual score from the film. There was no need to include the album tracks since they were already available on an existing album. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Parker 3,040 Posted November 2, 2008 Share Posted November 2, 2008 Wait. If the original album was a re-recording of the actual film score ( the "25th Anniversary Edition"), what does that make the other (inferior, in my opinion) re-recording by Joel McNeely? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Incanus 5,715 Posted November 2, 2008 Share Posted November 2, 2008 Wait. If the original album was a re-recording of the actual film score ( the "25th Anniversary Edition"), what does that make the other (inferior, in my opinion) re-recording by Joel McNeely?The OST was a specifically recorded 30 minutes or so album made back in 1975 when the film came out. This album did not contain the music of the actual score recorded for the film but a separate recording. The 25th anniversary edition of Jaws score is the actual score for the film (all of it). Joel McNeely's album is just the Jaws score re-recorded (film version of course). It came out the same year as the 25th anniversary edition of the original score which meant that there was this re-recording and the actual score on the market at the same time. I hope this clarifies things so we can get back to Indy discussion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted November 2, 2008 Share Posted November 2, 2008 The McNeely recording is not inferiour! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lurker 5 Posted November 2, 2008 Share Posted November 2, 2008 For those curious, here's a video I made using "Indy Rides the Statue".Neil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
indy4 155 Posted November 2, 2008 Share Posted November 2, 2008 Somebody must have been messing around in Amazon's warehouse... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lurker 5 Posted November 2, 2008 Share Posted November 2, 2008 Neil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Valentinice 20 Posted November 2, 2008 Share Posted November 2, 2008 For those curious, here's a video I made using "Indy Rides the Statue".NeilWow - that's cool Neil. So let me see if I get this:That first part was "Indy Rides The Statue" (Which will be on the Concord set)?And the second half was "The Mummy Cave" (Will NOT be on the Concord set)?Williams also composed an alternate "Indy Rides The Statue" (which will also not be on the Concord set).The alternate featured the same "swinging" motif from "In the Idol's temple". In the film, the beginning of the alternate "Indy Rides The Statue" is used - and the end is tracked with segments of "Airplane Fight"? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie Brigden 7 Posted November 2, 2008 Share Posted November 2, 2008 For those curious, here's a video I made using "Indy Rides the Statue".NeilVery cool, sir. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fommes 153 Posted November 2, 2008 Share Posted November 2, 2008 Ow, I didn't know that was supposed to go with that scene. But weren't there two versions of that "alternate" Indy Rides the Statue then? (One of them being in the film.) Both are using that motif that's also at the Temple in the beginning. So, if I get this right, none of those two cues will be on the Concord set? I had always expected one of those to be on there... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Henry B 50 Posted November 2, 2008 Share Posted November 2, 2008 Actually, it seems from the track times that the original version of "Indy Rides the Statue" (8M3 Escape from the Pit) has been dropped in favor of the shorter alternative version (8M3 Fix), which is based on that "Idol Temple" motive. It's a good thing we've already got the original in decent quality from the leaked Raiders release. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kendal_Ozzel 36 Posted November 2, 2008 Share Posted November 2, 2008 Now given that almost all the cues I wanted from Crusade are on the set, and I'm willing to use some boot tracks, and I'm really not familiar enough with Temple to know what the hell all this '26 seconds missing' stuff is all about, I'm still relatively happy with the set.Pop in the Temple of Doom DVD and skip to the end credits. Near the beginning, when David Tomblin's name comes up, there is a part where Williams plays Short Round's Theme against the Raiders March in such a way that makes it sound as if the two were written together just so that they could do that.It's quite a moment, and I can only figure now that it's the existence of an album track that's preventing it from being released. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Mark 3,631 Posted November 2, 2008 Share Posted November 2, 2008 Actually, it seems from the track times that the original version of "Indy Rides the Statue" (8M3 Escape from the Pit) has been dropped in favor of the shorter alternative version (8M3 Fix), which is based on that "Idol Temple" motive. It's a good thing we've already got the original in decent quality from the leaked Raiders release.so ok we needDCC classics:Desert ChaseRip of DCC vinyl :Marion in the pitLeaked Concord:Indy rides the Statue original versionRPO ToD credits: to edit film versionDVD rip ToD end Credits: to edit film versionanything else? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Penna 3,692 Posted November 2, 2008 Share Posted November 2, 2008 Not sure I can be assed to do all that meddling with Temple. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Koray Savas 2,251 Posted November 2, 2008 Share Posted November 2, 2008 Leaked Concord:Indy rides the Statue original versionWait, a track on the separate Raiders release is not going to be on the box set? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red 75 Posted November 2, 2008 Share Posted November 2, 2008 Not sure I can be assed to do all that meddling with Temple.I imagine someone else will. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Valentinice 20 Posted November 2, 2008 Share Posted November 2, 2008 Leaked Concord:Indy rides the Statue original versionWait, a track on the separate Raiders release is not going to be on the box set?Apparently. The leaked "Raiders" prototype featured the Original "Indy Rides The Statue" (I think that's what Neil used on his YouTube video - right Neil?)The new one seems to include the shorter "Alternate" version.But both releases don't included "The Mummy Cave". So where did you get it, Neil? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Parker 3,040 Posted November 2, 2008 Share Posted November 2, 2008 Just when we had it all figured out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lurker 5 Posted November 2, 2008 Share Posted November 2, 2008 Leaked Concord:Indy rides the Statue original versionWait, a track on the separate Raiders release is not going to be on the box set?Apparently. The leaked "Raiders" prototype featured the Original "Indy Rides The Statue" (I think that's what Neil used on his YouTube video - right Neil?)The new one seems to include the shorter "Alternate" version.But both releases don't included "The Mummy Cave". So where did you get it, Neil? I used the leaked version for the whole thing.Neil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Mark 3,631 Posted November 2, 2008 Share Posted November 2, 2008 So the set is back up as normal at Amazon. Crysis avertedhurray for the leaked Raiders then! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ollie 1,059 Posted November 2, 2008 Share Posted November 2, 2008 Have I said Nov. 11th (or several days after the shipping time) cannot get here any faster? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Valentinice 20 Posted November 2, 2008 Share Posted November 2, 2008 Leaked Concord:Indy rides the Statue original versionWait, a track on the separate Raiders release is not going to be on the box set?Apparently. The leaked "Raiders" prototype featured the Original "Indy Rides The Statue" (I think that's what Neil used on his YouTube video - right Neil?)The new one seems to include the shorter "Alternate" version.But both releases don't included "The Mummy Cave". So where did you get it, Neil? I used the leaked version for the whole thing.NeilSo "Mummy Cave" IS on the leaked CD? And not on the final CD? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lurker 5 Posted November 2, 2008 Share Posted November 2, 2008 I guess so. I don't have the official release yet. Was this confirmed at Intrada?Neil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trent B 337 Posted November 2, 2008 Share Posted November 2, 2008 Leaked Concord:Indy rides the Statue original versionWait, a track on the separate Raiders release is not going to be on the box set?I thought Indy Rides The Statue is on the actual box set? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Valentinice 20 Posted November 3, 2008 Share Posted November 3, 2008 Leaked Concord:Indy rides the Statue original versionWait, a track on the separate Raiders release is not going to be on the box set?I thought Indy Rides The Statue is on the actual box set?Yes, but apparently the "Alternate" - not the Original version that was on the leaked prototype.Neil - the tracklist suggests that it's the 1 minute alternate, but the "Mummy Cave" is 2:05, right? So how long was it on the leaked version - 3 minutes (including "Indy Rides The Statue" and "Mummy Cave")?Sounds like someone will need to pose another question to Jeff on the Intrada boards... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trent B 337 Posted November 3, 2008 Share Posted November 3, 2008 Perhaps the boxed version will have the actual full cue...you guys seriously need to wait to get your copies to confirm things. Most of you (especially KM) are too paranoid regarding this stuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Crichton 4 Posted November 3, 2008 Share Posted November 3, 2008 Have I said Nov. 11th (or several days after the shipping time) cannot get here any faster? It can't be said enough. Though given Concord's track record with this thing from the start I'm not surprised that confusion still reigns. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Koray Savas 2,251 Posted November 3, 2008 Share Posted November 3, 2008 I'm still not going over ape poo for this thing. I bet I'll listen to Indy the same amount when the set comes out as much as I do now, which is not at all. I overdosed on film scores and have been addicted to classic rock for the past couple weeks. It was all that Jerry Goldsmith, I tell ya! I knew I should have never tried to listen to all of his scores at once. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Parker 3,040 Posted November 3, 2008 Share Posted November 3, 2008 Maybe, if we are lucky, we will receive the Box Set one day before its official retail. That is what happened to me with "Indiana Jones and the Kingdom of the Crystal Skull".EDIT: Koray, I know the feeling. I "overdosed" on John Williams not too long ago. I think these scores will renew my passion for this music, though. And I will probably like "Indiana Jones and the Kingdom of the Crystal Skull" a little less. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Crichton 4 Posted November 3, 2008 Share Posted November 3, 2008 I'm going to wait until I have it for myself to make any judgements. Legitimately, I won't be participating in any attempts to get it early. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie Brigden 7 Posted November 3, 2008 Share Posted November 3, 2008 It's going to kill me waiting an extra week for this. Is 8m3 Fix including the tracked Raiders March? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Parker 3,040 Posted November 3, 2008 Share Posted November 3, 2008 I'm going to wait until I have it for myself to make any judgements. Legitimately, I won't be participating in any attempts to get it early.I am referring to Amazon.com's usually excellent shipping. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Koray Savas 2,251 Posted November 3, 2008 Share Posted November 3, 2008 You mean relying? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Parker 3,040 Posted November 3, 2008 Share Posted November 3, 2008 Do I? Though I think I understand what you mean ( and I appreciate the grammatical advice), I am responding to Herr Crichton's comment dealing with obtaining the music through legally ambiguous methods. I apologize for any confusion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lurker 5 Posted November 3, 2008 Share Posted November 3, 2008 Neil - the tracklist suggests that it's the 1 minute alternate, but the "Mummy Cave" is 2:05, right? So how long was it on the leaked version - 3 minutes (including "Indy Rides The Statue" and "Mummy Cave")?Sounds like someone will need to pose another question to Jeff on the Intrada boards...It runs 2:09 on the leak. My video is about 1:58 since I didn't have the following chapter from the video, but from that point, it doesn't matter.I think what everyone has been calling "The Mummy Cave" is one complete cue, starting with Indy climbing the statue and then toppling it and then Marion climbing out of the rubble to be confronted by the skeletons.Neil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Crichton 4 Posted November 3, 2008 Share Posted November 3, 2008 EDIT- Never mind.I like Ike! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TownerFan 4,983 Posted November 3, 2008 Share Posted November 3, 2008 I think what everyone has been calling "The Mummy Cave" is one complete cue, starting with Indy climbing the statue and then toppling it and then Marion climbing out of the rubble to be confronted by the skeletons.Indeed. And your nicely done video confirms it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lurker 5 Posted November 3, 2008 Share Posted November 3, 2008 So really there is no "Mummy Cave". It's just "Indy Rides the Statue" and then an alternate for the opening of this cue. Now it all makes sense to me.Neil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Parker 3,040 Posted November 3, 2008 Share Posted November 3, 2008 Hm. So, if I interpreted this revelation correctly:There is one cue entitled "Indy Rides the Statue" (which we will receive on the Box Set) which is shown in Neil's video. However, in the film, there was a tracked opening to the cue, from "Airplane Fight". Is this correct? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lurker 5 Posted November 3, 2008 Share Posted November 3, 2008 Hm. So, if I interpreted this revelation correctly:There is one cue entitled "Indy Rides the Statue" (which we will receive on the Box Set) which is shown in Neil's video. However, in the film, there was a tracked opening to the cue, from "Airplane Fight". Is this correct?No. "Airplane Fight" is tracked when the statue falls over. Indy climbing the statue in the film is the alternate opening to "Indy Rides The Statue" (or whatever it's called, I'm sure Henry can provide the correct name).Neil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Parker 3,040 Posted November 3, 2008 Share Posted November 3, 2008 Oh. Thank you. That clears a lot of things up, then.EDIT: (And I am pretty sure the cue is entitled "Through the Wall", if memory serves.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TownerFan 4,983 Posted November 3, 2008 Share Posted November 3, 2008 That Bouzereau blurb seems even more ludicrous after a night's sleep. He claims to have 'discovered' on previous CD projects that Williams orchestrates a very specific album experience. If that's the case, then how is it that the album experiences originally put together by Williams (CE3K, Jaws, E.T.) were not only redone but basically taken off the market? The latter two were even best-selling Grammy award winning albums. I'm sorry, the Indy set will be a welcome listen for the extra music, but the blatant hypocrisy is really distasteful. You mean to tell me that dispensable filler like "Bad Dates" was on Williams' short list for what was necessary to craft his 'album experience?'I think some of you are taking Williams' involvement in this release a bit too far. I'm sure he was sent an outline of the boxset and that maybe he gave some little input in it and finally gave his stamp of approval, but in the end all the creative decisions (a term a lot of people here doesn't like, I know) were very likely solely taken by Bouzereau and his team. We may like it or loathe it, but in the end that's what has been done. I still found puzzling why a central cue like "Desert Chase" is presented in its truncated form, but, well, I'm grateful I have my own DCC album to keep.As I said some post above, a lot of these decisions are probably only a matter of personal preferences. Even in the most complete and exhaustive release (as the Blue Box), there will be someone who will be unhappy or annoyed about cues placements, edits, cross-fades, chronology and all that stuff.We, as John Williams' fans and listeners, of course want every single note released, especially of scores like these ones. But I think this release has been made with a wider audience in mind, not just John Williams/film music fans. I'm so happy I'll finally have so much music available to enjoy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Parker 3,040 Posted November 3, 2008 Share Posted November 3, 2008 Excellent sentiment, paisano. For anyone who might be interested in owning the original "Indiana Jones and the Temple of Doom" CD release, I saw it on EBay.com for approximately twelve American dollars. You know, for the "collector's value". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TownerFan 4,983 Posted November 3, 2008 Share Posted November 3, 2008 Paisano?? Hahaha! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Parker 3,040 Posted November 3, 2008 Share Posted November 3, 2008 If you would pardon my Spanish. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Valentinice 20 Posted November 3, 2008 Share Posted November 3, 2008 Hm. So, if I interpreted this revelation correctly:There is one cue entitled "Indy Rides the Statue" (which we will receive on the Box Set) which is shown in Neil's video. However, in the film, there was a tracked opening to the cue, from "Airplane Fight". Is this correct?No. "Airplane Fight" is tracked when the statue falls over. Indy climbing the statue in the film is the alternate opening to "Indy Rides The Statue" (or whatever it's called, I'm sure Henry can provide the correct name).NeilJust watched "Raiders". Mystery solved. Neil is correct. I'll sum it up this way:The entire cue is called "Through The Wall". It's made up of two parts: "Indy Rides The Statue" and "Mummy Cave". John Williams also recorded an alternate version of the first part, "Indy Rides The Statue".In the film, we hear the alternate version of "Indy Rides the Statue" as he climbs the statue.For the actual toppling of the statue, it's a few seconds tracked from "Airplane Fight".We then rejoin the original "Through the Wall" - at the "Mummy Cave" segment.On the concord box, we will be getting the original version of "Indy Rides The Statue", but "Mummy Cave" will be strangely absent. "Mummy Cave" can still be found on the leaked CD. But still unreleased, is the alternate version of "Indy Rides The Statue". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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