Harry Potter and the Sorcerer's (Philosopher's) Stone

[Gruesome Son of a Bitch 6,488]

Too bad about the OST. I also agree that most DVD sourced audio sounds terrible. Or you get some kind of alternate source that also sounds terrible, like Hook and Last Crusade. The rare exceptions for unofficially released music are Family Plot (which is just okay), THIS and a somewhat awful, but necessary, recording of the Botanicus music from the line for E.T. Adventure. Anything else I have little desire to seek out.

1. I agree that Fighting the Troll was definitely temp tracked with To the Plaza, Presto from Home Alone 2.

2. The suite is amazing complete and on its own outside the context of the album.

3. I never noticed that the cool heroic music when Hermione saves Harry in COS Quidditch scene was from the Devil's Snare scene in #1. You hear a giant magic explosion/death sound over the music.

4. Was Xmas Music Box intended to play under Cast a Xmas Spell?

[Datameister 2,043]

This set has perfect sound and the missing section isn't important enough to ruin with background noise.

I just don't get how good music with a little noise is less fun to listen to than silence...

[Richard Penna 3,690]

Depends whether it's interesting music. The section in question is okay, but hardly a score highlight. There are a few unused and alternate cues from the sessions that I haven't kept because I don't find them interesting or essential to the listening experience.

I'll say again, had a more crucial scene been truncated, I probably would be resorting to a DVD rip.

I have other sessions that bizarrely lack odd cues, which I've substituted for DVD rips. It simply depends on how important the individual cue is. Sometimes the reduced quality and background buzz, and the transition from the cleaner studio sound, just isn't worth it.

[Luke Skywalker 1,795]

4. Was Xmas Music Box intended to play under Cast a Xmas Spell?

I dont know, but i tried to mix them and they are not in sync.

The ost has it overlayed in christmas morning an the library scene, bt i think that is a deliberate creative decision.

Question: i dont know what to do, putting WB logo after or before the prologue.

Does the prologue ends with music that could be for the harry potter title, and both logos be rescores when they decided to put it in the front of the film?

[Datameister 2,043]

I never thought "Christmas Music Box" and "Cast a Christmas Spell" were supposed to be overlaid. I figured they were just alternate source cues so that the filmmakers would have options - and of course, they ended up using little bits of both. And yes, I would assume the OST presentation (mixing "Hagrid's Christmas Tree" with "Cast a Christmas Spell" and then "Christmas Morning") was just a choice they made to unify the different Christmas-related cues together.

I don't know what the scoop with the logo cue numbers is, but I suspect the 1M2 thing in the sessions is incorrect. According to Bill Wrobel's breakdown, they got the cue number for "Hagrid Plays the Flute" wrong, too. And the likelihood of the Warner Bros. logo coming AFTER part of the film is slim to none. But who knows...

[Luke Skywalker 1,795]

and the title 'HP & PS' where does that appear in the movie?

[Datameister 2,043]

The logo for the film's title comes in at the end of "The Prologue" - the big horn statement of Hedwig's theme was written for that.

[Gruesome Son of a Bitch 6,488]

Hedwig's Theme trailer version was the first indication that Harry Potter was destined to become a JW classic.

Potter Logo Lead-in Version 2 sealed the deal within the first 10-15 seconds of the WB logo. I still remember.

[fommes 153]

EDIT: And also, "The Sorcerer's Stone" is just "Three Note Loop." Williams never wrote a separate concert suite for that theme, with the exception of "Voldemort."

Wait: do you mean that "The Sorcerer's Stone" from the "Suite for Orchestra" is exactly the same as "Three Note Loop"?

Also: "Hedwig's Theme" from the "Suite for Orchestra", is that the short version or the longer? (I suppose that Nimbus 2000 is the same as the Children's Suite and Harry's Wondrous World is the one with the COS ending?)

[Datameister 2,043]

Wait: do you mean that "The Sorcerer's Stone" from the "Suite for Orchestra" is exactly the same as "Three Note Loop"?

That's correct. There are very slight differences in the instrumentation, as is always the case with published music (even signature editions), but the structure and content are exactly identical.

"Hedwig's Theme" from the "Suite for Orchestra", is that the short version or the longer?

That's the long version. And then the Children's Suite has the short version, of course.

I suppose that Nimbus 2000 is the same as the Children's Suite and Harry's Wondrous World is the one with the COS ending?

Also correct.

[Demondm810 399]

I think what I like most about the score, is that there is a tangible sense of excitement from the music. You can really tell the maestro was loving it and really gave it his all.

[King Mark 3,631]

the reduced quality and background buzz, and the transition from the cleaner studio sound, just isn't worth it.

Exactly

[fommes 153]

Excellent, I hadn't realized till now that we now have the Suite for Orchestra complete as well!

[Gruesome Son of a Bitch 6,488]

The section of Filch's Fond Remembrance when they walk to Hagrid's--I have no idea where Williams gets this stuff.

I wish the prequels had come out as good.

[steb74 53]

Thankfully they did.

[Jacob 0]

This might be getting confusing for the guy who asked the question, so, for all clarity:

Just import whatever you have into Audacity (no need to convert it first. Audacity can also read FLAC), and then export it as FLAC or WAV. That way, no quality loss in comparison with the original file.

(But of course, if the original source is MP3, it will still be lossy material, but just not lossier than the original MP3.)

Thanks. I do have some experience with Audacity and audio editing.

Just wasn't sure how to go about editing a lossy file while maintaining maximum quality.

It's moot in this case anyway now...

[Gruesome Son of a Bitch 6,488]

Thankfully they did.

I suppose you're right. I meant not as great.

[GoodMusician 56]

Well, if you rip the front channels as i mentioned, and if you use blu ray rip and do some slight playing around it's nearly seamless... I'm ok with it heh

[Jay 37,364]

Well well well. I got away for 4 days and look what happens. lol!

Thanks for respecting the rules of the board, everybody.

Happy editing!

[Datameister 2,043]

Excellent, I hadn't realized till now that we now have the Suite for Orchestra complete as well!

Yep! I made a playlist for that, as well.

BTW, all this Potter talk has inspired me to try to master the main celeste solo, the one that's based on the chord progression of the so-called Nimbus 2000 theme and has all the ascending and descending arpeggios. It's not quite so difficult that it's totally out of my reach, but it's definitely a significant challenge for me. It blows me away that keyboardists like Randy Kerber can play this stuff with such accuracy and expressiveness.

[King Mark 3,631]

Jay you need to empty you PM inbox

[Datameister 2,043]

I have no idea where Williams gets this stuff.

This is a thought that occurs to me pretty much every day. Of course there's education and technique and practice and whatnot...but these things only get you so far. There's something really fundamentally, beautifully different about the way Williams' neurons are wired.

"Gryffindor Wins"

[Incanus 5,715]

I have no idea where Williams gets this stuff.

This is a thought that occurs to me pretty much every day. Of course there's education and technique and practice and whatnot...but these things only get you so far. There's something really fundamentally, beautifully different about the way Williams' neurons are wired.

"Gryffindor Wins"

Well duh!

[Luke Skywalker 1,795]

Jay you need to empty you PM inbox

bribing the moderator with goodies?

[Luke Skywalker 1,795]

About 'three note loop', if i put is in chronological (7m3) order and call it 'the philosopher's stone' does it make sense?

if not what would you name the 7m3 scene?

[Gruesome Son of a Bitch 6,488]

I just labeled it Three-Note Loop. I sequence it after the forest scene and before Hagrid flute. It's not clear what it was composed for and it was only used in COS.

[King Mark 3,631]

I think it's for when they go into the Gringault's Vault . Kind of a concert version of that moment

[GoodMusician 56]

Its used as Hermione talks about how safe harry is as long as dumbledore is there. And as the kds walk to hagrid an harry metions his scar is burning..

As i mentioned, if you sync it up, it almost works in a way for this sequence with the dramatic climax when hagrid says fluffy will be put to sleep by music.

"I shouldnt have said that. I should not have said that."

It loosly fits. Williamsnhas a good relationship with chris columbus and id bet he wrote it as a sort of cue to source whenever the three note motif was needed with various instrumentations and volumes.

[Datameister 2,043]

I agree, that seems like the most likely reason. They definitely had some idea it was going to go into that scene, though, judging by its cue number.

[Jay 37,364]

Jay you need to empty you PM inbox

All set

Sorry, it got full right before I left for NYC, and then HPSS happened and I had no slots for anyone. Should be good for a while now.

[Admiral Holdo 16]

Quick question: how exactly does one combine 1m5 and 2m1? Track times and precise instructions if possible, please.

[Datameister 2,043]

That's a question whose answer will most likely remain a mystery, I'm afraid. The way I see it, there are two ways you can do it:

* Line up the second note of 2m1 with the very end of the ascending run that concludes 1m5. If you do it right, the final pizzicato "thump" at the very end of 1m5 will line up with the entrance of the low strings near the beginning of 2m1.

* This one especially requires a good musical ear. The final note of 1m5 is the first beat of a bar in 3/8. Treat the first note of 2m1 (an eighth note in the horns) as the third beat of that same bar, so there's exactly one beat of silence between the two cues.

It is extremely likely that one of these two options was the intended segue. Both make musical sense, and both are in line with segues Williams has done in other scores. But the thing is...Williams scored an earlier cut of the film. Neither of these options allows the music to line up with the final cut of the film. So unless there's something I'm missing, we really have no way of knowing. One way we could find out is by studying Williams' original sketch of 1m5 - he always makes note of how the cues will segue into each other. But to my knowledge, none of the SS sketches have leaked, only the orchestrators' manuscripts, and those contain no such indications. One thing to notice, though, is that the final note of 1m5 is marked as "optional."

[GoodMusician 56]

I'dll try to upload my edit to youtube so you can hear it. You have to remove the last pizz and create a fade out (the pizz is optional in the written score) and then layer the horn.

[Datameister 2,043]

I'm definitely curious to hear your edit, GoodMusician. Do post that link when you can. I edited it both ways I mentioned above, but I ended up just leaving them separate in the end. Until we know for certain what Williams intended, they work quite well as totally separate tracks.

EDIT: Also...wow. I'd never heard "To the Plaza, Presto" till now, but yes, it is very similar to "Fighting the Troll." That's rather disappointing. Oh well...I think I still like "Fighting the Troll" better, from what I've heard...

[Admiral Holdo 16]

Right, GM mentioned a cello 'bullet' that, once chopped off, would make layering the two tracks easy... I guess. At first, I thought he meant overlaying 2m1 onto 1m5 around 1:03 (after the chunk of silence in the beginning is taken out); that's the only thing I could think of that matched his directions, but that's a tricky fade to pull off. I'll try your suggestions, tho!

[Demondm810 399]

I'm definitely curious to hear your edit, GoodMusician. Do post that link when you can. I edited it both ways I mentioned above, but I ended up just leaving them separate in the end. Until we know for certain what Williams intended, they work quite well as totally separate tracks.

EDIT: Also...wow. I'd never heard "To the Plaza, Presto" till now, but yes, it is very similar to "Fighting the Troll." That's rather disappointing. Oh well...I think I still like "Fighting the Troll" better, from what I've heard...

I think it must have been on purpose, like other have mentioned probably temp tracked. The rest of the score is too original for him to get sloppy here. I like to imagine Chris Columbus begging Williams to make it sound similar because he liked it so much in Home Alone 2.

[Datameister 2,043]

It's certainly a strong possibility.

[Incanus 5,715]

It's certainly a strong possibility.

My first thought was that Columbus has a mild case of temp-trackitis when he asked JW to score Fighting the Troll scene. And the piece is as much a nod to the Home Alone 2 as it is to Tchaikovsky.

[Luke Skywalker 1,795]

Its used as Hermione talks about how safe harry is as long as dumbledore is there. And as the kds walk to hagrid an harry metions his scar is burning..

As i mentioned, if you sync it up, it almost works in a way for this sequence with the dramatic climax when hagrid says fluffy will be put to sleep by music.

"I shouldnt have said that. I should not have said that."

It loosly fits. Williamsnhas a good relationship with chris columbus and id bet he wrote it as a sort of cue to source whenever the three note motif was needed with various instrumentations and volumes.

so 'Philosopher stone' is wrong as 7m3...

but three note loop sounds to weird as track title...

[Datameister 2,043]

Well, you have to decide whether you want to commit to Williams' original cue titles or take some artistic license. My current preference is to use original cue titles whenever available, even if that means including silly things like "Three Note Loop" and "The Blue Forest" and "Potter Logo Lead-In Version 2."

[fommes 153]

I'll replace the cue title by "The Sorcerer's Stone (Suite for Orchestra)".

[Richard Penna 3,690]

I have no problem renaming cues, even on OSTs. I've kept with Williams' titles for maybe 2/3 of the sessions. The rest are generally because I think I can give a more suitable description for what's happening in a given scene.

I haven't included any inserts/source cues (well, except the music box, but if memory serves I think a little bit is used as score when we first see morning) or alternates. This is one score where I want to hear what I heard in the film (including tracked material) so I've recreated the film versions of 'Lonely Night' and 'Diagon Alley' (complete with a cymbal crash) as well as Halloween, which is just nice to have to build the right mood for the troll scene. I'm the polar opposite of Thor (no more debates btw, I'm, just making a constructive comparison) in that I strongly attach music to images and find it easy to visualise the film when listening, so changes and alternates wind me up a fair bit.

I also seem to be one of few not going crazy about this whole 'Children's Suite' thing. I don't like brass bands, so I guess renditions of every theme from the score just using brass isn't my cup of coffee.

[Incanus 5,715]

I also seem to be one of few not going crazy about this whole 'Children's Suite' thing. I don't like brass bands, so I guess renditions of every theme from the score just using brass isn't my cup of coffee.

To each his own I guess. I love the suite. And Hogwarts Forever and Quidditch are the two brass only pieces in the suite. The whole idea of the suite is to introduce different instrument families and combinations to children, a sort of a new Young Person's Guide to an Orchestra with the Harry's Wondrous World as the finale that utilizes the whole orchestra and some of the themes heard in the suite.

[Richard Penna 3,690]

Ah right, I didn't know it was like that. I'll give it another listen.

[Koray Savas 2,251]

I have a feeling mine isn't the same as everybody else's. I definitely don't have all the teaser/trailer music that's at the end of the track list.

[GoodMusician 56]

As far as 1m5 and 2m1 goes, I keep trying but youtube is pulling the audio.

I had to use photobucket but its in mono:

[link removed]

I've noticed that there is a wind flourish around [01:18] but in the film, it doesn't seem to accent anything. But moments later, the board over the door's mail slot breaks... i'm wondering if they recut the sequence (re-ordered the shots at least) and the music no longer quite fits as intended. But I will say, the way i edited it fits perfectly.

[Jacck 23]

Are you trying to edit these recording sessions to conform to the film's edits? Why on earth would you bother with such a pointless task?

[GoodMusician 56]

Are you asking me this? No. I've only done that with two tracks by request: "Petrified Longbottom" and the film version of "Diagon Alley"

All i was saying is that i noticed these things when editing the music. I knew 1m5 and 2m1 needed to be layered so i was checking against the film to see if it had any hints as to the best way to do it and the way i layered them can be layered over the film.

[Jay 37,364]

Ah right, I didn't know it was like that. I'll give it another listen.

Yea the children's suite is cool, I like how each piece is played by a different section of the orchestra. Williams was good at matching up instruments with theme arrangements

As far as 1m5 and 2m1 goes, I keep trying but youtube is pulling the audio.

I had to use photobucket but its in mono:

[link removed]

I've noticed that there is a wind flourish around [01:18] but in the film, it doesn't seem to accent anything. But moments later, the board over the door's mail slot breaks... i'm wondering if they recut the sequence (re-ordered the shots at least) and the music no longer quite fits as intended. But I will say, the way i edited it fits perfectly.

Please use PMs for the actual sending of stuff like this, thanks!

[Jacck 23]

I don't see why they would need to be layered. They're two independent cues that stand on their own. Just because the final pizz. in 1M5 is marked as optional doesn't mean anything. Maybe Williams knew the end of 1M5 would be very close to the beginning of 2M1 so decided to mark it as such to make the editing job a bit easier (maybe).

It doesn't seem musical for them to segue, anyway. The tempi are different (2M1 is slower), and 2M1's horns start with a leading note into the melody that, to me, means it makes even less sense for the two cues to segue.