Great film composers of today

[MSM 126]

With John Barry's passing away, what is left of the league of legendary film composers? Pretty much only John Williams and Ennio Morricone I think... Or do I overlook someone? It scares me.

[Richard Penna 3,694]

Bruce Broughton.

[Datameister 2,044]

That's all I can think of off the top of my head...I mean, there are more contemporary composers who have done some excellent, iconic work (e.g. Alan Silvestri, James Newton Howard, Danny Elfman), but they're clearly not part of the group you're talking about. I can't say that I'm a huge fan of all of the composers you're talking about, but their huge contributions to the art of film scoring are undeniable, and in today's climate of over-synthy, nondescript, by-the-numbers scoring, their artistry is truly missed.

Then again, if I'm not mistaken, there was another dark period just before these guys started to make names for themselves, so perhaps we'll see a renaissance again before too long. Film scores had a great thing going in the late 70s and 80s, with the 90s still being pretty strong on the whole. In my estimation, it wasn't till the second half of the 2000s that things started really going downhill.

Oh, right, that was when Williams stopped scoring a couple of films every year. =/

[mrbellamy 6,287]

Lalo Schifrin, maybe?

[Richard Penna 3,694]

It's definitely a sad thing that conceivably within the next 5 - 10 years, the true legends of the 70s and 80s could be beyond.

The closest person working at full capacity today I would consider to be Elfman. While I don't enjoy his superhero or 'zany' material much, his dramatic scores have something in their orchestration and overall sound that few of the others truly achieve.

Edit - I haven't heard a note of original Schifrin music. I wouldn't consider him alongside Williams & Morricone.

[Andy 4,138]

And where does Horner fall in the spectrum of silver age to modern composers?

[mrbellamy 6,287]

Agreed with your thoughts on Elfman. I don't know if I'd say he's the best who's steadily working (for me, it's Alexandre Desplat), but there is something very transporting about his dramatic stuff. "Harvey's Last Day" is one of my very favorites.

[Ollie 1,059]

As far as the the most recognized, yes Williams and Morricone are the only two left, although the latter lacks the hardware of this websites namesake.

But there are several of their peers still around, Stu Phillips, Dave Grusin, David Shire, Lalo Schifrin, Richard Rodney Bennett, Leslie Bricusse, Gerald Fried, Dominic Frontiere, Russell Garcia, Quincy Jones, Francis Lai, Michel Legrand, Johny Mandel, Andre Previn, Laurence Rosenthal, Ken Thorne, John Scott, Bill Conti and Arthur B. Rubenstein.

And just below those, as far as age goes, Bruce Broughton, James Horner, Alan Silvestri, Danny Elfman and Marvin Hamlisch.

[Nick Parker 3,040]

Lalo Schifrin has done far too much for the world of music to not be considered a giant.

[vwing 0]

I actually just posted about this on my blog. It seems to be that the new generation of film composers are, regardless of quality, extremely different from those who are passing on. Less classical training, more eclectic talents, lots of experience in rock, pop, and electronics. I don't know if it's a cycle, but it seems that rock/electronics today are what jazz was in the 60s and 70s. Because of the wide range of backgrounds in film composers, one wonders if the title will lose the already tenuous meaning that it had, and one wonders whether or not that's a bad thing.

Barry's passing had me thinking about this a lot today, glad someone else brought it up.

[mbahnmil 0]

There are still quite a few contemporaries with classical training...

[BLUMENKOHL 1,068]

Most of the bigger name composers left started in the 80s and beyond.

So yes, Morricone and Williams are really the last behemoths of that generation.

[Koray Savas 2,251]

As a couple others have said - Lalo Schifrin. Pure 70s man, and his theme for Mission Impossible is definitely as popular among non film-score fans as JW's themes.

[Thor 7,508]

Lalo Schifrin, Quincy Jones & Michel Legrand are definitely greats in the same generation as Barry (also Previn, if you include his semi-career in film music). So it's not only Williams & Morricone, no. Maurizio also mentioned several others, although none are quite in the same league.

The generation below (50-60) also has several greats, as previously noted - Horner, Elfman, Silvestri, Newman, Howard, Zimmer, Shore and so on.

The generation ABOVE has few left, though. The only noteworthy composer I can think of here is Russ Garcia (94).

[vwing 0]

Jones and Legrand are basically done scoring films though, and Schifrin is basically at one score every few years now, if that. For the generation below, I think I'd give Horner and Elfman nods as "greats", and maybe have Newman close too, but other than them, very few of the composers have had the consistency that the previous generation had. Alan Silvestri has almost gotten less interesting as a composer as he's gotten older and scores fewer films now. James Newton Howard is Jekyll and Hyde. Shore can be very boring, although he also has some greats.

We're just not getting the consistently fantastic output that we once got from orchestral composers, and it's a little scary to me.

Also, to the poster who replied to my post, of course many composers have classical educations. But there is a huge influx of composers who do not, and that dichotomy signals a huge shift in the industry. I'd say of young people who want to be film composers, most of them are actually musicians who view it as a gig to make money. That also is scary to me.

[Brónach 1,302]

Jones and Legrand are basically done scoring films though, and Schifrin is basically at one score every few years now, if that. For the generation below, I think I'd give Horner and Elfman nods as "greats", and maybe have Newman close too, but other than them, very few of the composers have had the consistency that the previous generation had. Alan Silvestri has almost gotten less interesting as a composer as he's gotten older and scores fewer films now. James Newton Howard is Jekyll and Hyde. Shore can be very boring, although he also has some greats.

What about Joe Hisaichi?

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

Film composing is the terrain of the caucasian male.

[Ollie 1,059]

He's only 59 or 60. I'd put him in the group with Horner, Broughton, Silvestri and Elfman.

Probably not as well known though to most outside of the US, unless you are a film score or Japanese cinema fan.

[Omen II 1,235]

Lalo Schifrin has done far too much for the world of music to not be considered a giant.

Well done, Nick Parker. I could not have put it any better myself (except that I might not have split my infinitive ).

[Wojo 2,453]

Root pity in thy heart, that when it grows

Thy pity may deserve to pitied be.

[Charlie Brigden 7]

Schifrin's Dirty Harry scores are genius.

[gkgyver 1,645]

And just below those, as far as age goes, Bruce Broughton, James Horner, Alan Silvestri, Danny Elfman and Marvin Hamlisch.

Marvin Hamlish? What has he done to be named in one sentence with Horner? And what has Silvestri done to be named with Elfman?

There is Morricone, JW, then there is Elfman and Horner ... and then pretty much everyone else.

Zimmer sort of is a law under himself.

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

Hamlish is more of a Broadway composer, right. Who does an occasional movie...

[Naïve Old Fart 9,534]

As far as the the most recognized, yes Williams and Morricone are the only two left, although the latter lacks the hardware of this websites namesake.

But there are several of their peers still around, Stu Phillips, Dave Grusin, David Shire, Lalo Schifrin, Richard Rodney Bennett, Leslie Bricusse, Gerald Fried, Dominic Frontiere, Russell Garcia, Quincy Jones, Francis Lai, Michel Legrand, Johny Mandel, Andre Previn, Laurence Rosenthal, Ken Thorne, John Scott, Bill Conti and Arthur B. Rubenstein.

And just below those, as far as age goes, Bruce Broughton, James Horner, Alan Silvestri, Danny Elfman and Marvin Hamlisch.

Mark, you forgot John Corigliano, Eliot Goldenthal, Michael Nyman, and Philip Glass (or perhaps you didn't )

[gkgyver 1,645]

None of them I would consider "great" in the sense of "classic".

[Wojo 2,453]

To each their own.

[Sharkissimo 1,973]

John Williams, Ennio Morricone, and perhaps Lalo Schifrin. Just about.

That's it I'm afraid.

[Ollie 1,059]

Well you all know the old saying, opinions are like assholes, everyone has one.

[Sharkissimo 1,973]

Way to state the obvious.

[ChuckM 1]

I would definately consider Elfman to be among the "greats," though he is of a different generation.

[Faleel 5,350]

I would place Silvestri among the greats, just not at the top tier

[Sharkissimo 1,973]

I would place Silvestri among the greats, just not at the top tier

They've been riding too low for long. Both have been consistently poor to mediocre in the last decade or so. With only a few occasion moments of genius (i.e. Elfman's HULK - but even then, only the Main Theme does anything for me. None of the generic percussion for the action sequences of ambient filler, which could have been easily taken from his PLANET OF THE APES score).

It's been a very, very long time since Silvestri's produced a score I liked.

[Richard Penna 3,694]

I agree about Silvestri. Very few of his recent scores have interested me - Christmas Carol, Beowulf, Polar Express.

A-List he may be, but he hasn't done anything to equal Back to the Future that shows he's a 'great' composer to me.

[Sharkissimo 1,973]

I agree about Silvestri. Very few of his recent scores have interested me - Christmas Carol, Beowulf, Polar Express.

A-List he may be, but he hasn't done anything to equal Back to the Future that shows he's a 'great' composer to me.

I actually consider Predator to be his masterpiece, even more so than Back to the Future efforts. Other than those two, I haven't really liked anything else.

Elfman's clearly a superior composer, but his scores have really been sporadic in quality.

[MSM 126]

That's all I can think of off the top of my head...I mean, there are more contemporary composers who have done some excellent, iconic work (e.g. Alan Silvestri, James Newton Howard, Danny Elfman), but they're clearly not part of the group you're talking about. I can't say that I'm a huge fan of all of the composers you're talking about, but their huge contributions to the art of film scoring are undeniable, and in today's climate of over-synthy, nondescript, by-the-numbers scoring, their artistry is truly missed.

Then again, if I'm not mistaken, there was another dark period just before these guys started to make names for themselves, so perhaps we'll see a renaissance again before too long. Film scores had a great thing going in the late 70s and 80s, with the 90s still being pretty strong on the whole. In my estimation, it wasn't till the second half of the 2000s that things started really going downhill.

Oh, right, that was when Williams stopped scoring a couple of films every year. =/

Good thoughts. Two things:

- I actually think things went downhill from the point where computers and sequencers became an inherent part of film scoring. 'Anyone' with the right equipment can now write a film score. The old days of pre-imagining the music in one's head, note it down by head are over, there's no time anymore for that too.

- Secondly, which is inherent to the former point, the old ways of composing aren't taught anymore. It's all about sequencing, effects, effectivity in the movie. The quality of music itself isn't of the utmost importance anymore. This is why I think, sadly, it is not likely there will be another revival of symphonic film music. Its best days are over. Electronics, commerce and efficiency have taken over the business.

I now see two people already mentioned the same thing about lack of classic training amonst the newcomers. I agree.

Lalo Schifrin, Quincy Jones, Michel Legrand and Francis Lai indeed I would consider belonging to the old generation, but as also stated before, they aren't as active anymore as they were.

Of Horner, Silvestri, Elfman, Newton Howard, Shore, Desplat, Zimmer, I have great respect for them all, but I don't consider any of them to be capable of the huge things the legends were. Of those ones, Horner is probably the most distinctive one as it comes to classical writing, but I consider him somewhere in between the old and the new generation.

[Sharkissimo 1,973]

This is why I think, sadly, it is not likely there will be another revival of symphonic film music. Its best days are over. Electronics, commerce and efficiency have taken over the business.

Disagree there. There WILL be tide change in the next decade or two, it's what always happens in any genre or sub-genre. Things become formulaic and stale. There's bound to radicals and reactionaries trying to move things forward and preserve the passed - and the geniuses in between who try keep the best of both worlds - The Herrmanns, Barrys, Goldsmiths, Steiners, Waxmans, Mancinis, Rozsas, Williamses, Norths, Bernsteins, Morricones, Rosenmans, Schifrins etc... You name it.

It's all cyclic. When Zimmer and co are fat recluses, living in their digital mansions, and out of fashion - These upcoming geniuses will take over. Right now they might even be in the concert field, eventually transitioning into the medium of film. Even if it's just one trailblazer at first who strikes a chord with the masses, the others will soon follow.

It is foreseen.

[MSM 126]

This is why I think, sadly, it is not likely there will be another revival of symphonic film music. Its best days are over. Electronics, commerce and efficiency have taken over the business.

Disagree there. There WILL be tide change in the next decade or two, it's what always happens in any genre or sub-genre. Things become formulaic and stale. There's bound to radicals and reactionaries trying to move things forward and preserve the passed - and the geniuses in between who try keep the best of both worlds - The Herrmanns, Barrys, Goldsmiths, Steiners, Waxmans, Mancinis, Rozsas, Williamses, Norths, Bernsteins, Morricones, Rosenmans, Schifrins etc... You name it.

It's all cyclic. When Zimmer and co are fat recluses, living in their digital mansions, and out of fashion - These upcoming geniuses will take over. Right now they might even be in the concert field, eventually transitioning into the medium of film. Even if it's just one trailblazer at first who strikes a chord with the masses, the others will soon follow.

It is foreseen.

I hope you are right, but in the end it is all about what is asked for by the industry. It all has to be fast, effective and cost-limited today. If the old school style scores aren't sought after, they won't be written.

It's the exact same thing in the illustration world. Drew Struzan, one of the best illustrators in the business, hardly had any work anymore over the last few years. Anybody who's good with photoshop can create a film poster nowadyas. For the industry it's fast and cheap. Classical art like Struzan's, like old style scores, won't be made anymore if there's no market.

Another thing is, some of the great orchestrators are gone also: Arthur Morton, Hugo Friedhofer, Alexander Courage, Herbert W. Spencer, John Neufeld has retired. But then we still have a bunch like Conrad Pope, Scott Smalley, Jack Hayes, Brad Dechter, Mark McKenzie...

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

I value both his Judge Dredd and The Mummy Returns higher then BTTF and Predator.

[Sharkissimo 1,973]

I value both his Judge Dredd and The Mummy Returns higher then BTTF and Predator.

I can't see it sorry. Both to me seems just like stock standard videogamy 00s action scores. PREDATOR had a magic, an originality and a unity to it than none of those 'big' scores have.

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

Can't listen to Predator without nodding of.

[Sharkissimo 1,973]

This is why I think, sadly, it is not likely there will be another revival of symphonic film music. Its best days are over. Electronics, commerce and efficiency have taken over the business.

Disagree there. There WILL be tide change in the next decade or two, it's what always happens in any genre or sub-genre. Things become formulaic and stale. There's bound to radicals and reactionaries trying to move things forward and preserve the passed - and the geniuses in between who try keep the best of both worlds - The Herrmanns, Barrys, Goldsmiths, Steiners, Waxmans, Mancinis, Rozsas, Williamses, Norths, Bernsteins, Morricones, Rosenmans, Schifrins etc... You name it.

It's all cyclic. When Zimmer and co are fat recluses, living in their digital mansions, and out of fashion - These upcoming geniuses will take over. Right now they might even be in the concert field, eventually transitioning into the medium of film. Even if it's just one trailblazer at first who strikes a chord with the masses, the others will soon follow.

It is foreseen.

I hope you are right, but in the end it is all about what is asked for by the industry. It all has to be fast, effective and cost-limited today. If the old school style scores aren't sought after, they won't be written.

It's the exact same thing in the illustration world. Drew Struzan, one of the best illustrators in the business, hardly had any work anymore over the last few years. Anybody who's good with photoshop can create a film poster nowadyas. For the industry it's fast and cheap. Classical art like Struzan's, like old style scores, won't be made anymore if there's no market.

I don't think this next generation of greats will come out of the big studio pictures, or under the production of slimeballs like Harvey Weinstein. There'll be scoring the local, smaller budget, and more artistically daring films. There'll be working on films with heir peers (i.e. Welles hiring his good friend Herrmann for CITIZEN KANE). For that's where you have the freedom of musical expression, not in Hollywood.

There'll become more and more popular, and Hollywood will have to shift its standards and expectations to meet the new demand.

[MSM 126]

Here's a list of whom of the greats we've lost over the past 8 years:

Michael Kamen: 1948-2003

David Raksin: 1912-2004

Elmer Bernstein: 1922-2004

Jerry Goldsmith: 1929-2004

Malcolm Arnold: 1921-2006

Alexander Courage: 1919-2008

Leonard Rosenman: 1924-2008

Maurice Jarre: 1924-2009

John Barry: 1933-2011

[crocodile 8,017]

Scary. And very depressing.

Karol

[Brónach 1,302]

Here's a list of whom of the greats we've lost over the past 8 years:

Michael Kamen: 1948-2003

David Raksin: 1912-2004

Elmer Bernstein: 1922-2004

Jerry Goldsmith: 1929-2004

Malcolm Arnold: 1921-2006

Alexander Courage: 1919-2008

Leonard Rosenman: 1924-2008

Maurice Jarre: 1924-2009

John Barry: 1933-2011

Basil Poledouris (1945-2006)

[ChuckM 1]

David Raksin: 1912-2004

Malcolm Arnold: 1921-2006

I've never heard of them before.

[Ollie 1,059]

Well it depends on how much you are familiar or knowledgeable you are about film music.

[Jay 37,368]

I value both his Judge Dredd and The Mummy Returns higher then BTTF and Predator.

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

With BTTF and Predator, for me there is precious little beyond the themes. I can enjoy the other 2 for much for then that.

[Jay 37,368]

I like Judge Dredd (though not as much as BTTF or Pred)... I'll have to give Mummy Returns another whirl someday (I think I've only listened to it once or twice)

What are your thoughts on The Abyss and Eraser?

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

I hardly know The Abyss, apart from the finale. Never heard Eraser. But I heard it was similar to his rejected Mission Impossible score, which I always sort of liked.