Worst 5 Composers

[Koray Savas 2,251]

Usually people like to discuss the positives: the best scores, the best composers, the best movies. Well, straying away from my Top 5 series for a moment, let's all take a minute to think about the worst composers in the business.

So let's hear it, who do you think are the worst 5 composers working today? Don't forget to add why, and I don't want to see any "Hans Zimmer - self explanatory"

[Hitch 57]

This twit

Hans Zimmer - self explanatory

Correction: Every single MediaVentures composer alive

[indy4 155]

Hmmmm...

I couldn't really say, because there a plenty of composers whose CDs I don't have that I'm sure I would hate. For all the composers' CDs that I do have, I may not like them all, but I also have soundtacks of the composers' that I do like.

In other words, for every composer I have, I have at least one CD that I really like by them. So then I don't really dislike any of them.

[Koray Savas 2,251]

Tyler Bates, Brian Tyler, Randy Edelman, John Debney, the list goes beyond 5 for me...

Marco Beltrami and James Horner are midway for me, they aren't bad, but they aren't good.

Gustavo Santaolalla - self explanatory All his music can go here ->

This twit:

[Red 75]

1) MediaVentures

2) MediaVentures

3) MediaVentures

4) MediaVentures

5) MediaVentures

Because they are bland, derivative, unoriginal, have lowered the standards of modern film scoring, and are just plain bad.

However, John Powell (and Hans Zimmer) has done some great stuff.

[Hitch 57]

Tyler Bates, Brian Tyler, Randy Edelman, John Debney, the list goes beyond 5 for me...

Bates' may be confined at the moment to scoring bad horror movies but his score for "300" was effective even if it did reference Goldenthal's "Titus", Tyler's music for "Children of Dune" was one of the best TV scores in the last few years, Edelman's score to "Dragon: The Bruce Lee Story" was magnificent, Debney's score to "The Passion of the Christ" was definitely denied an Oscar and his work on comedy scoring is sterling.

Marco Beltrami and James Horner are midway for me, they aren't bad, but they aren't good.

Beltrami and Horner on their "off" days outshine Zimmer and company on their "good" days. Wait....they don't have "good" days now, do they??

Gustavo Santaolalla - self explanatory All his music can go here ->

2 Oscars and counting say otherwise.

[Wojo 2,453]

Is this the John Williams Fan Network, or the Bash Hans Zimmer Network? I think I may be at the wrong website then.

[Koray Savas 2,251]

Tyler Bates, Brian Tyler, Randy Edelman, John Debney, the list goes beyond 5 for me...

Bates' may be confined at the moment to scoring bad horror movies but his score for "300" was effective even if it did reference Goldenthal's "Titus", Tyler's music for "Children of Dune" was one of the best TV scores in the last few years, Edelman's score to "Dragon: The Bruce Lee Story" was magnificent, Debney's score to "The Passion of the Christ" was definitely denied an Oscar and his work on comedy scoring is sterling.

Marco Beltrami and James Horner are midway for me, they aren't bad, but they aren't good.

Beltrami and Horner on their "off" days outshine Zimmer and company on their "good" days. Wait....they don't have "good" days now, do they??

Gustavo Santaolalla - self explanatory All his music can go here ->

2 Oscars and counting say otherwise.

300 was garbage. O.K. so Edelman has 1 good score, I agree that Bruce Lee is good. Debney is typecast into doing every single comedy movie possible, and all are pretty much crap. The Passion Of The Christ was copied off of the Hans Zimmer sound and it stands out from every other score he's done, which means it isn't his style. Beltrami usually never has a good day, and Horner has been having one long off-day for a few years. Every day is a good day for Hans Zimmer and Friends, they enjoy what they do, and it must be working because they land like 4 projects a year.

2 Oscars means nothing. The Academy is biased and their nominations are terrible, especially in the last 2 years. Don't forget films nominated for Best Picture always get a score nomination and a lot of the times win. Brokeback Mountain and Babel fit those bills. Gustavo IS NOT a composer, he is a guitarist turned composer by Innaritu, and his music is all based upon Iguazu, nothing original. Look at me I can pluck 2 strings on a guitar every 10 minutes!!

[Pieter Boelen 740]

John Debney wrote Cutthroat Island, one of the best scores ever. Period. He can't be that bad. Lair is also pretty good.

[indy4 155]

And Elf.

[Koray Savas 2,251]

Having 1 good score does not make you a good composer.

[Hitch 57]

The Passion Of The Christ was copied off of the Hans Zimmer sound and it stands out from every other score he's done, which means it isn't his style.

I didn't think Hans Zimmer had a sound except for the loud noises he releases from his arse.

2 Oscars means nothing. The Academy is biased and their nominations are terrible, especially in the last 2 years. Don't forget films nominated for Best Picture always get a score nomination and a lot of the times win. Brokeback Mountain and Babel fit those bills.

Memoirs of a Geisha wasn't nominated for Best Picture and the scores for The Departed and Crash weren't nominated for Best Original Score so your last sentence doesn't mean twiddly-squat.

Gustavo IS NOT a composer, he is a guitarist turned composer by Innaritu, and his music is all based upon Iguazu, nothing original. Look at me I can pluck 2 strings on a guitar every 10 minutes!!

If he "IS NOT" a composer, what is he then? He doesn't write notes on a piece of paper for nothing.

Having 1 good score does not make you a good composer.

So you're saying John Williams, Bernard Herrmann, Miklos Rosza, Jerry Goldsmith, etc, aren't good composers???

[Koray Savas 2,251]

I didn't think Hans Zimmer had a sound except for the loud noises he releases from his arse.

Passion is a lot like Gladiator.

Memoirs of a Geisha wasn't nominated for Best Picture and the scores for The Departed and Crash weren't nominated for Best Original Score so your last sentence doesn't mean twiddly-squat.

I said Best Picture nominations get a Score nomination, not the other way around. And I didn't mean every Best Picture nominee gets a score nomination, it's at least 1.

If he "IS NOT" a composer, what is he then? He doesn't write notes on a piece of paper for nothing.

He IS a guitarist. He doesn't write notes, he plucks strings.

So you're saying John Williams, Bernard Herrmann, Miklos Rosza, Jerry Goldsmith, etc, aren't good composers???

What? They have several excellent scores, they are excellent composers.

[Hitch 57]

Don't forget films nominated for Best Picture always get a score nomination and a lot of the times win.

The emphasis here is on the word "always" which is not how the Academy works.

Having 1 good score does not make you a good composer.

So if John Williams only wrote "E.T.", Bernard Herrmann only wrote "Psycho", Miklos Rosza only wrote "Ben-Hur", Jerry Goldsmith only wrote "Planet of the Apes", that they wouldn't be good composers on account of the one score they wrote?

[Koray Savas 2,251]

Don't forget films nominated for Best Picture always get a score nomination and a lot of the times win.

The emphasis here is on the word "always" which is not how the Academy works.

For at least the past 10 years, a Best Picture nominee has been nominated for Score.

Having 1 good score does not make you a good composer.

So if John Williams only wrote "E.T.", Bernard Herrmann only wrote "Psycho", Miklos Rosza only wrote "Ben-Hur", Jerry Goldsmith only wrote "Planet of the Apes", that they wouldn't be good composers on account of the one score they wrote?

That is correct. 1 score cannot define a composer.

[Hitch 57]

Having 1 good score does not make you a good composer.

So if John Williams only wrote "E.T.", Bernard Herrmann only wrote "Psycho", Miklos Rosza only wrote "Ben-Hur", Jerry Goldsmith only wrote "Planet of the Apes", that they wouldn't be good composers on account of the one score they wrote?

That is correct. 1 score cannot define a composer.

I think Mozart would give you a good rollicking if he was still alive.

[Koray Savas 2,251]

I would also like to add that for at least the past 20 years, a Best Picture nominee has been nominated for Best Score, and more than just 1 on a lot of occasions. That is how the Academy works. I can go further back if you want, could even be at least 30 years.

EDIT: Guess what, Hitch?! It does go back to 30 years!

[mahler3 478]

I'll have to stick up for Randy Edelman to some extent, he has admittedly written some trite - but the following are great listens and ultimately work well with their respective movie so I can't say his one of the worst:

Ghostbusters 2

Kindergarten Cop

Dragon

Last of the Mohicans

While You Were Sleeping

My vote goes to Mark Mothersbaugh & Harald Kloser as I've yet to enjoy anything by them.

[Koray Savas 2,251]

Last Of The Mohicans is basically all Trevor Jones. Edelman was brought in to help and finish the score in time for the release of the film. It's a shame too, because this removed it's chances from an Oscar nomination.

[mahler3 478]

Yes I know, but Edelman's work was enjoyable - just not as themetically strong as Jones' work

[indy4 155]

The Academy Awards can be pretty screwed up at times. Nobody should base their opinions soley on how many Oscars one composer got, after all, this is a thread about personal preference, NOT a thread on the opinions of the Academy members.

[KingPin 201]

The Academy Awards can be pretty screwed up at times. Nobody should base their opinions soley on how many Oscars one composer got, after all, this is a thread about personal preference, NOT a thread on the opinions of the Academy members.

The Oscars in recent years has been nothing but an attempt by the Hollywood industry to be politically correct. By this, I mean that becomes very obvious what they are up to when, for example, two African-Americans pick up the Best Actress/Actor Award in the same year. I think there were a few other recent years where several of the major acting Oscars were handed all to people of minority. And the recipients might we perfectly deserving of the award, but it is clear that the Academy doesn't want anybody pointing the racial finger their way.

The same situation happened in 2005 when Brokeback Mountain was nominated multiple times ad won some mainly because it showed that the Academy was being sensitive to gays being represented in the media. Several other gay/lesbian/trans-gender related films were nominated, including Capote and Transamerica. Many saw this as the Academy protecting itself from backlash from the gay/lesbian community in case the film(s) didn't receive any awards. I have not seen any of these films, so I cannot personally judge their cinematic merit. Although, I do know some people who very much disliked Brokeback, and not because of the subject matter, but because they felt it was just not good storytelling at all.

Of course, in the end that year, it was Crash that picked up the Best Picture, because it dealt with inter-racial dynamics and racial sterotypes - another Academy-sensitive subject.

I think in the case of film composers, it seems (to me, at least) that the Academy voters are trying to give recognition to composers who don't have the long-standing recognition that someone such as Williams has. Santaolalla, in my opinion, was not deserving for either of his wins (based on mere excerpts that I have heard), but with Brokeback Mountain, he had a slight advantage from the film being about a gay relationship boosting his chance as well - the Academy being both politically correct and favoring the underdog.

[pixie_twinkle 48]

Brokeback was wonderful storytelling in my opinion. The score was perfect for the film, it really added to the atmosphere. Did it deserve the Oscar? No, but it was still the right score for the film.

[bondo 33]

Since this thread already has more than one ridiculous response, I'll go ahead and add to it:

John Williams

Jerry Goldsmith

Danny Elfman

James Horner

James Newton Howard

Just terrible. Their stuff is complete and utter crap.

[Unlucky Bastard 7,782]

*Zimmer farts*

This guy's a genius! He'll sell a million copies! Give him a trophy!

[Hitch 57]

Since this thread already has more than one ridiculous response, I'll go ahead and add to it:

John Williams

Jerry Goldsmith

Danny Elfman

James Horner

James Newton Howard

Just terrible. Their stuff is complete and utter crap.

And you sir are no gentleman.

*Zimmer farts*

This guy's a genius! He'll sell a million copies! Give him a trophy!

If you bottle it, it'll sell even more.........to his fans.

[Unlucky Bastard 7,782]

Not a large enough explosive for me.

[Hitch 57]

Here... get them to swallow these laxatives, and if they have any more problems, just get them to call me.

[Unlucky Bastard 7,782]

Drilling holes in his gut isn't the answer! The bowels must be repaired! Now put away your butcher knives so I can save this man before it's too late!

[Morlock 11]

This is not a list of worst, but least favorite.

Jack Nitzche and Graeme Revell, two composers I can't stand. The last thing I liked by Revell is Dead Calm. And I can't think of anything I like by Nitzche.

Harald Kloser as well. Steve Jablonsky, certainly.

Last Of The Mohicans is basically all Trevor Jones. Edelman was brought in to help and finish the score in time for the release of the film. It's a shame too, because this removed it's chances from an Oscar nomination.

Why did it remove it's chances? It was submitted for your concideration.

[Neimoidian 14]

Steve Jablonsky

He writes decent melodies, but arrange them in the worst way possible, his underscore is a crap, his best score (Steamboy) is merely average and he gets bigger and bigger projects to work on. The fact his scores sell good is a proof that using headphones makes people deaf.

I would never include Santaolalla to this category. He writes his type of music which is all right and effective. The problem with him is that his music received too much of attention and accolade that he didn't deserve.

Regarding Zimmer - he has composed so many great scores, that's why naming him 'the worst' is simply absurd.

[Sandor 797]

Zimmer is very adequete in blending his music with visuals. That's why is so popular. He may not have the "technical, traditional" background of, let's say, James Newton Howard, but his pop-orientated scores (sadly) do the trick.

For 99% of the world, his score for Pearl Harbor worked. To 1% it is a cliched, utterly simple score devoid of any originality. That 1% is people like us. People who love the more serious, ambitious orchestral works of Jerry Goldsmith, John Williams or Ennio Morricone.

What a great time 1975-1985 was! Then Goldsmith, Williams and Morricone were the Zimmers of nowadays. Jaws, Star Wars, Star Trek TMP, Once Upon A Time In America, Alien, Superman, TESB, E.T., Poltergeist, ....

If only they could have scored films like The Transformers or Pirates Of The Carribean...

But, in defense of Zimmer: I do enjoy his music. Not as film music perse, but on another level I guess. Zimmer has a gift for melody. His themes from The Power Of One, The Lion King, Spirit, Crimson Tide or Spanglish strike a chord with me. They are often powerful, pure, long-lined and extremely catchy.

His orchestral and symphonic writing may be limited, but his talent for themes (please don't bring up Batman Begins or POTC - even Williams has had his occasional bump!) is definately there. Of course some of the most renowed directors are not stupid and do not pay Zimmer if his ability was truly as awful as some believe.

[mahler3 478]

And I can't think of anything I like by Nitzche.

Not even........takes deep breath.......bursts into song........"Love lifts us Up Where We Belong"?

[Morlock 11]

I'm talking scores here.

@Pearl Harbor: Doug Fake (a rather estimable voice in film music fandom) loves this score, I don't know why (Never really listened to it).

[QMM 4]

Graeme Revell is the only person I've seen here that I can agree with

[Ollie 1,059]

Well I'll skip the obvious answer which is Zimmer and his RC factory.

One name that has yet to be mentioned is Eric Serra.

His music is utter crap, what the producers of Goldeneye were thinking is beyond me.

[Neimoidian 14]

Well I'll skip the obvious answer which is Zimmer and his RC factory.

One name that has yet to be mentioned is Eric Serra.

His music is utter crap, what the producers of Goldeneye were thinking is beyond me.

Disagree. Listen to his Atlantis or Arthur and the Minimoys (I haven't heard Grand Blue yet). This guy is capable of writing great, rich orcherstral music. His Leon is also worth listening, though it's more similar to Goldeneye (or the other way around, to be specific).

[Morlock 11]

Arthur and The Minimoys I found to be quite uninteresting. It's orchestral...but so what? the music didn't make of a good listen.

[Quintus 5,399]

This twit

1 "Oscar and counting says otherwise"

See how worthless that response was?

I'm not agreeing with you, I'm just calling you a hypocrite.

[Neimoidian 14]

Arthur and The Minimoys I found to be quite uninteresting. It's orchestral...but so what? the music didn't make of a good listen.

The album was too long (in other words badly prepared). The music itself was well written and definitely wasn't bad. Better selection of cues would have made it better listening experience.

[Sandor 797]

Usually people like to discuss the positives: the best scores, the best composers, the best movies.

Well, not on this board. You must be a noob. :cool:

[ChuckM 1]

Not really many composers that I don't like. Gustavo Santaolalla is about the only one that immediately comes to mind. I guess another might be Clint Mansell. I love his "Lux Aeterna," but have not liked most of the other stuff I've heard of his.

[bondo 33]

Since this thread already has more than one ridiculous response, I'll go ahead and add to it:

John Williams

Jerry Goldsmith

Danny Elfman

James Horner

James Newton Howard

Just terrible. Their stuff is complete and utter crap.

:cool:

And you sir are no gentleman.

Hook, line, sinker.

Awwww what's the matter, you don't agree with my opinion?

Face it, this thread is just begging for BS responses. This is one of those threads that does nothing but piss people off. So if someone is going to just say "Zimmer is crap," then by god I'll level the playing field with "Williams is crap." Otherwise it's just hypocrisy.

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

Maurice Jarre

Gary Chang

Max Steiner

Trevor Rabin

Michel Legrand

[Quintus 5,399]

Hehe.

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

I an not joking.

[Red 75]

Face it, this thread is just begging for BS responses. This is one of those threads that does nothing but piss people off. So if someone is going to just say "Zimmer is crap," then by god I'll level the playing field with "Williams is crap." Otherwise it's just hypocrisy.

I think it's only pissed you off.

Everyone is entitled to an educated opinion.

[BLUMENKOHL 1,068]

Maurice Jarre

Gary Chang

Max Steiner

Trevor Rabin

Michel Legrand

I'll add Mike Curb to that and call the list complete.

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

That name is unknown to me.

[Ollie 1,059]

There is no right or wrong answer in this thread, it's matter of opinion. There's no BS answers, it's just than some people don't want to see their precious HZ and RC crew criticized.

If you can't handle it I suggest a visit to WWW.ILOVEALLCOMPOSERS.COM.

This is a John Williams web site, if Jerry Goldsmith can get raked over the coals what chance do you honestly think other composers will have?