Potterdom Film/Score Series Thread

[fommes 154]

I can see where you're coming from. There's a lot more to it in the book.

But despite that, Order of the Phoenix (and Half-Blood Prince as well actually) made me forget about the book and just go with it as a story told through the medium of film.

With Deathly Hallows, you're back to just watching scene after scene from the book transferred directly to the screen, which is what made watching Philosopher's Stone and Chamber of Secrets in particular such tedious experiences.

As a fan of the book, it's nice to see all this stuff make it to the big screen. As a fan of good storytelling and movies, the way Deathly Hallows part 2 turned out is just disappointing.

Well, don't misunderstand me: I'm a big supporter of adaptation which takes into account the specificities of the medium. I have big problems with the first two as well, being as faithful as they are. In hindsight I appreciate very much how solid they are as films - directorially it's good craftmanship. But in the end they transferred the book almost literally, without doing anything with it.

All the eight films very nice to see on the big screen as stories seen through the film medium (the set design, the actors, etc., are all awesome), but in the end we're left with only one excellent film, of which you can say that it's actually great cinema as well as that it stands alone as a story (you didn't need to have read the book) - in fact, the third film is far more accomplished as a film than the book is as a book. I had such high hopes after Cuaron's film; that's why I was so disappointed none of the following films transcend their status as illustrations.

In my case - I never go in with the book on my mind (in fact, I haven't read them again since I first read them to leave as much time between book and film adaptation as possible). A slight nuance here: I don't think the film should make you forget the book: the film should make you not try and remember the book - which none of them succeeded in. And if you've got people with you that haven't read the books, I assure you the amount of questions tripled with each film.

I guess I wanted too much: they've given us nice and enjoyable films (give me these film series over 95% of everything else in recent fantasy cinema), but after Prisoner of Azkaban, I wanted another great film.

[JoeinAR 1,949]

again bull frommes, sorry but POA isn't the great cinema you suggest it is. Good film but not a great adaption, and it's not stand alone. In fact much of it doesn't make sense to people who haven't read the book.

Order of the Phoenix is undoubtedly Yates's best effort, but there are still a great many things wrong with it; but summing it up would be just rehashing my review of the latest film - the screenplay not standing on its own, the direction being a bit bland (all the 'original' stuff is even taken straight from Cuaron). They left out why Voldemort wanted to kill Harry in the first place; why Voldemort was after the prophecy; lost the Snape subplot (even though the pay-off is in the last film!); all rather significant plot elements. To boot, personally I also thought all the really interesting stuff was left out: how Harry was marked by choice not by fate; and they had the one chance to have Dumbledore actually not fail at something (rounding up all the Deatheaters - which is the first time in all the books where we really see the power and greatness of the wizard Dumbledore. Now he's in the duel which ends in a tie - after building this guy up for a few films, that's a problem).

that's your opinion, and not one I agree with, in fact just about nothing you say I find to be agreeable to.

Deathly Hallows 1 and 2 are his best efforts. IMHO.

[Demondm810 399]

Forgot to mention...I didn't really like harry cracking the wand in half and tossing it. Should have brought it back to the tomb.

[gkgyver 1,646]

Yeah, seeing the rotten corpse of Dumbledore again ... there's a feel-good moment to end the movie!

I don't get the love for Order of the Phoenix. I find it a very very dull movie. Yates' best is IMO Half-Blood Prince, followed by Deathly Hallows part 2.

The most heartbreaking omission is Dumbledore's backstory. I mean, make the movie 5 minutes longer and have it told by Aberforth, where is the harm in that?

After all the set up in film 1, with the mentioning of Grindelwald and the suggestion that Dumbledore's life was not all that Harry wanted, that was the least I expected.

There are a great number of things in part 2 that feel like a deus ex machina, the finding of the last Horcruxes not least of all.

[fommes 154]

After all the set up in film 1, with the mentioning of Grindelwald and the suggestion that Dumbledore's life was not all that Harry wanted, that was the least I expected.

There are a great number of things in part 2 that feel like a deus ex machina, the finding of the last Horcruxes not least of all.

Indeed.

And come to think of it, isn't that one of the most amateurish aspects of the last few films; namely the imbalance between set-up and pay-off (there's often one of them without the other). I mean, that's Screenwriting 101, right: setting up something that's paid off later on. Kloves must have been thinking "neither can live while the other survives".

[MSM 126]

Already posted this in the Potter thread, but I thought it belonged better here.

DH 2 score:

- Alexandre Desplat is no John Williams. Not technically, but also not regarding the flow of music. Yet this is one of his best scores to date. The music is much better than Part 1. Desplat at moments even imitated Williams in style, e.g. in the vault scene and during some of the battle scenes. Also there is much more music, more underscore, which felt good. The main problem is that Desplat lets the tension go too quickly, e.g. after the dragon escape, but most obviously after the pensieve scene when Harry is contemplating. Music here was absolutely necessary.

- JW's theme is used properly and although I am a hardcore JW fan, and to my own surprise, I felt more of it wasn't needed. I do think however that because of its use, this film finally felt like a HP movie again.

[Jay 37,417]

That's why Dobby's death did not work as a dramatic climax for the first film. I mean a character from COS who's a bit annoying gets stabbed, so what?

Actually if you read this you can spoil these films for yourslef even further.

Karol

[indy4 155]

Also the title of the film, Deathly Hallows barely features in it, like Goblet Of Fire and Half Blood-Prince.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aA8OOJjjvjU

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

I'll catch it on blu.

[fommes 154]

So... What is the last film you watched?

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

Jason has OCD!

Yes, this whole plot point was left out of the films. We never do learn the cup taken from Bellatrix's vault did in fact belong to Helga Hufflepuff.

Obviously because in a film featuring oppression by a nazi-like overlord, teenage angst, people eaten by huge snakes for teaching equality, death, self-sacrifice and other dark subject matter you just can't use a name like Hufflepuff...

It's fine in the first two films, but not after they decide to get serious.

That's why Dobby in DH1 felt jarring, like putting Jar Jar Binks in The Dark Knight Returns.

[Wojo 2,453]

That's why Dobby in DH1 felt jarring, like putting Jar Jar Binks in The Dark Knight Returns.

But that was in the book! Just another deus ex machina moment in the long history of deus ex machinas in the Harry Potter franchise.

[MSM 126]

putting Jar Jar Binks in The Dark Knight.

Would have helped the movie.

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

Some 25 minutes into Goblet of Fire now.

A lot of people complain that Doyle score is too loud and bombastic. But it's because the film is very bombastic. Dumbledore is screaming, Moody is screaming, everything is very loud and in your face.

What exactly does David Tennant think he's doing?

[MSM 126]

Some 25 minutes into Goblet of Fire now.

A lot of people complain that Doyle score is too loud and bombastic. But it's because the film is very bombastic. Dumbledore is screaming, Moody is screaming, everything is very loud and in your face.

What exactly does David Tennant think he's doing?

Yeah I think this is my least fav Potter movie. The Waltzes are nice, but it is realy the Graveyard scene that saves this movie.

[gkgyver 1,646]

While we are on the subject of Goblet Of Fire, Harry's and Voldemort's duel is so much stronger there than in Deathly Hallows. Music too.

I watched DH part 2 again.

Voldemort actually throws the killing curse at Harry earlier in their duel, on the staircase. It should have killed Voldemort right there.

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

About halfway into GOF. Very bombastic indeed, everything is turned up to 11, even the acting.

But.

I'm really liking the scenes that have little to do with the tri-wizard thing. There is a lot of humor in this film. It really feels like these kids are in a school, going through puberty. Ron dancing with McGonnagal is priceless. Snape trying to get Ron and Harry to stop talking about the Yule ball and focus on their books...

Hermione's giggle when Krum catches her arm at the ball, rather brilliant.

[indy4 155]

Voldemort actually throws the killing curse at Harry earlier in their duel, on the staircase. It should have killed Voldemort right there.

Maybe his horcrux prevented him from dying? Or Harry blocked it?

EDIT: Oh wait, nevermind. If his horcrux prevented it, then he would've pulled a Godric's Hollow and lost his body.

[gkgyver 1,646]

The point is that Voldemort shouldn't even be able to throw the Avada kedavra at Harry, so the whole "spell vs spell" wand sparkling is kind of wrong.

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

1 hour and 35 minutes into GOF. Still no plot to report....

[Demondm810 399]

About halfway into GOF. Very bombastic indeed, everything is turned up to 11, even the acting.

But.

I'm really liking the scenes that have little to do with the tri-wizard thing. There is a lot of humor in this film. It really feels like these kids are in a school, going through puberty. Ron dancing with McGonnagal is priceless. Snape trying to get Ron and Harry to stop talking about the Yule ball and focus on their books...

Hermione's giggle when Krum catches her arm at the ball, rather brilliant.

Oh God, the scene with Snape is one of my favorites.

Mike Newell really nailed the adolescent humor in this.

Chemistry is pitch-perfect.

[King Mark 3,631]

Why is the thread about the DH part 1 score locked?

[gkgyver 1,646]

Because this thread was created.

[King Mark 3,631]

ah

[indy4 155]

Nope, this is the reason (from the Quick Questions thread):

I temporarily locked it because MSM kept re-posting a paragraph about the Deathly Hallows Part 2 score he had already posted in the Potterdom score to that thread, even though everyone else is discussing the DHp2 score in the Potterdom thread. And as a result, a post from January in that thread got replied to. It was weird.

[Matt C 455]

The point is that Voldemort shouldn't even be able to throw the Avada kedavra at Harry, so the whole "spell vs spell" wand sparkling is kind of wrong.

Voldemort and Dumbledore had that in OOTP, and I didn't see many people complain about that. The Priori Incantatem is a better spell to convey wand-battling on screen, although the rapid-fire spells used when Harry and Voldemort duke it out on the staircase in DH2 is so much better.

And while we're on topic with OOTP, I have to say Michael Goldenberg did a much better job with adapting the book than what Kloves would've done. He got the essence of the story down smoothly, and there were some beautifully-written scenes. It's a shame Kloves didn't step down permanently, his work on HBP and DH ranged from okay to pretty good. I would've liked to see how Goldenberg adapted HBP and DH.

[Mr. Breathmask 555]

Voldemort actually throws the killing curse at Harry earlier in their duel, on the staircase. It should have killed Voldemort right there.

Weren't they just random green spells? There's a lot of green things flying from wands in this movie and I can't quite believe it's always a killing curse. Besides, it's established in GoF you can't block Avada Kedavra. Harry blocks multiple green spells on the staircase.

[MSM 126]

Voldemort actually throws the killing curse at Harry earlier in their duel, on the staircase. It should have killed Voldemort right there.

Weren't they just random green spells? There's a lot of green things flying from wands in this movie and I can't quite believe it's always a killing curse. Besides, it's established in GoF you can't block Avada Kedavra. Harry blocks multiple green spells on the staircase.

Ah, I never coupled a certain spell to a certain color. I thought the color was as random as the color of the lightsaber of a Jedi.

[Mr. Breathmask 555]

In the book, it's mentioned multiple times Avada Kedavra produces a bright green light. There's not much said about the other spells (except that Expelliarmus is red, I think), so we don't know much about those, but I always intepreted it as the bright green being unique to the killing curse. In the films, not so much.

[indy4 155]

I think all three Unforgivable Curses are green, since that's the color associated with evil, but I could be wrong.

[Docteur Qui 1,544]

Nah, Imperius in the last film is a green and orange mist, while Crucio (in OotP at least) is bright red.

[Unlucky Bastard 7,782]

Looked like random laser blasts to me.

[gkgyver 1,646]

The point is that Voldemort shouldn't even be able to throw the Avada kedavra at Harry, so the whole "spell vs spell" wand sparkling is kind of wrong.

Voldemort and Dumbledore had that in OOTP, and I didn't see many people complain about that. The Priori Incantatem is a better spell to convey wand-battling on screen, although the rapid-fire spells used when Harry and Voldemort duke it out on the staircase in DH2 is so much better.

Voldemort actually throws the killing curse at Harry earlier in their duel, on the staircase. It should have killed Voldemort right there.

Weren't they just random green spells? There's a lot of green things flying from wands in this movie and I can't quite believe it's always a killing curse. Besides, it's established in GoF you can't block Avada Kedavra. Harry blocks multiple green spells on the staircase.

I don't think you're all getting the point.

Voldemort didn't use the Elder Wand in OotP. Voldemort uses the Elder Wand in DH, and Harry is the master of the Elder Wand. The wand does not kill its master, it backfires. No wand combat, no lightsaber show.

In the book, Voldemort dies because he fires Avada Kedavra at Harry, and the wand fires back.

Why would Voldemort fire any spell at Harry but the Killing Curse?

It doesn't make sense at all. It looks as if Harry overpowers Voldemort because he's weak. Which isn't right.

[Muad'Dib 1,802]

I posted this on the reviews section, but what hell...

I just watched it yesterday and to be honest, I left the theatre with a sensation of emptyness. On the good side, I really enjoyed the Snape flashback scene (Alan Rickman was brilliant during the whole movie) and the Epilogue. Those were the only moments that I truly enjoyed from the movie. I would have enjoyed the Dragon Flight scene if it wouldn't have been so.. short. Just when the music was pumping the scene up, it ended.

The duel between Voldemort and Harry was, at least to me, terribly overdone. And what was up with that shot of Harry and Voldy falling and "combining" their faces?? Was this the film's attempt to be artsy??

In fact that's another point: The film seemed to me mediocrily directed, like Yates didn't care what the fuck he was doing... "Hey, let's just make the camera turn around the characters with no apparent reason. That would make it look cool, dude!!!"

The trio itself didn't bring anything new to the acting side, but the rest of the older cast was bloody brilliant. Maggie Smith was spectacular, Gambon brought the Dumbledore from POA back, and as I said Rickman stole the whole film. Ralph Fiennes was great, considering the terrible material he had to do. I mean, Voldemort laughs and points at people like a bully. What the hell???

And something that struck me in an extreme way: In the book, Draco's mother says that Harry is dead when he's not. She's just trying to help him and trick Voldemort. That was something that, if I hadn't read the book, I wouldn't have a clue about it!! Just a simple exchange of looks would have done the trick, but no... Here they just went along with it, and the viewer was left clueless.

And what was up with trying to make the war realistic? This is a freaking movie about wizards and magic! Realism is not the way to go. Why not take advantage of this world and use it in its full potential? For example, the Dragon is completely wasted in the opening. Why not make it come back?

Now that I have watched the film, I'm really glad Johnny didn't score this one. It would have been a total waste, like it was with Desplat. If you want a modern score, that's fine. But hire a composer that's known for that instead of having a classicaly trained composer waste his whole talent in something as mediocre as this was. Thank God for the Epilogue, though...

[Wojo 2,453]

By that logic, gkgyber, Harry should have been able to stand in place, hands in his pocket, and Voldemort cast Avada Kedavra at him all day long using the Elder Wand, and Harry just takes it without blinking, because the Elder Wand in the usage of Voldemort cannot kill Harry, its master. Correct? Voldemort would get better results from a bullet.

Indeed, that happens in the book. Voldemort uses the spell on Harry, and it seems to kill Harry and even stuns Voldemort. All it did was kill the horcrux inside Harry, who then gets a visit from Dumbledore, and plays dead until the very end of the battle.

[gkgyver 1,646]

By that logic, gkgyber, Harry should have been able to stand in place, hands in his pocket, and Voldemort cast Avada Kedavra at him all day long using the Elder Wand, and Harry just takes it without blinking, because the Elder Wand in the usage of Voldemort cannot kill Harry, its master. Correct? Voldemort would get better results from a bullet.

Indeed, that happens in the book. Voldemort uses the spell on Harry, and it seems to kill Harry and even stuns Voldemort. All it did was kill the horcrux inside Harry, who then gets a visit from Dumbledore, and plays dead until the very end of the battle.

Once the Horcrux is gone, Harry's soul is a whole again, and the wand can't kill him. It could, but it won't. It's the wand that kills Voldemort, not Harry or the horcrux. I don't think the film shows that.

[publicist 4,643]

I have to confess that i forgot about what happpened in the books, so i sat there in confusion throughout some parts of the movie.

The sometimes extreme reactions ('Yates cannot direct traffic!') are of course the usual hyperbolic bullshit but i agree that some shots were idiotic (like when they stand at the lake after the dragon scene and the camera swirls around like some guy with a nervous disorder). On the other hand, Yates has a good eye for contrasts, i. e. wide shots vs. close-ups like in the Voldemort/Harry chase in the castle. The snake looked like shit, though, although that's hardly Yates fault.

Fiennes came off a bit feeble at times, Rickman's face and voice belong in acting classes all over the world to study, dear Maggie Smith can raise an eyebrow and hold the audience stunned. The adolescents were alright, although i always found Radcliffe's face too well-rounded to believe him all the stress and suffering.

The score sadly couldn't contribute much apart from 'Lily's Theme' and the little flute interlude from 'Severus and Lily'. Worst part was that basic RCP ostinato in 'Statues' which was the basis for most battle material.

The epilogue was sweet, but as it was expected most people snickered and made snide comments...ahh, the memories of the RETURN OF THE KING finale came alive again.

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

People don't want sweet, they want an epilogue with Harry 19 years later bloated and filthy, lying in an alley dying from an overdose of crack, because he never got past the events of the Battle of Hogwarts.

[publicist 4,643]

People don't want sweet, they want an epilogue with Harry 19 years later bloated and filthy, lying in an alley dying from an overdose of crack, because he never got past the events of the Battle of Hogwarts.

At least they could have added a nice Heineken belly, a tonsur and some face warts to our heroes. They just looked a bit too polished for people to supend disbelief. Everyone knows how parents look like in real life...

[Muad'Dib 1,802]

People don't want sweet, they want an epilogue with Harry 19 years later bloated and filthy, lying in an alley dying from an overdose of crack, because he never got past the events of the Battle of Hogwarts.

The question is... Why do they want that?

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

Why did ancient Romans wanted to see people eaten by tigers?

[Wojo 2,453]

Because everyone enjoys a good train wreck, and the monotheists of the time made such easy targets?

[Brónach 1,302]

And the slaves, and war prisoners, and criminals, and politheists not assimilated by the Roman culture, and...

I think Rowling is a good writer, but she slowly dropped the Potter ball through the series.

[Datameister 2,049]

I think she's an okay writer but an amazing storyteller. And while the fifth and sixth books started to drag for me, I was very satisfied with the book DH.

[Wojo 2,453]

Someday this saga will be remade into a mini-series on television, with Daniel Radcliffe guest starring as Dumbledore or somebody else, provided these novels stand the test of time like The Lord of the Rings or Dune.

Ok, maybe not Dune. Those last few got weird, and I don't know how you'd film it and its five sequels in such a way that Duncan Idaho wouldn't age, since he really wouldn't.

[Brónach 1,302]

Other than the stillsuits and the worms and the water thing, Dune gets on my nerves.

[Marian Schedenig 8,218]

I'm really liking the scenes that have little to do with the tri-wizard thing. There is a lot of humor in this film. It really feels like these kids are in a school, going through puberty. Ron dancing with McGonnagal is priceless. Snape trying to get Ron and Harry to stop talking about the Yule ball and focus on their books...

Hermione's giggle when Krum catches her arm at the ball, rather brilliant.

The character moments in this are brilliant. But the film as a whole is crap.

[MSM 126]

People don't want sweet, they want an epilogue with Harry 19 years later bloated and filthy, lying in an alley dying from an overdose of crack, because he never got past the events of the Battle of Hogwarts.

The question is... Why do they want that?

In Holland that's common.

[indy4 155]

Why would Voldemort fire any spell at Harry but the Killing Curse?

Because Voldemort likes to make his murders theatrical and showy. He likes to preach to his victim or anybody who may be watching, or at least take the time to enjoy the murder. Especially for a death as important as Harry.

[Mr. Breathmask 555]

In the book, Voldemort dies because he fires Avada Kedavra at Harry, and the wand fires back.

And in the movie, the wand doesn't backfire. This whole idea of the wand backfiring because it's being used against Harry is never once mentioned in the movie. So it's not part of the film universe. Now what's your point, exactly?