Flipping pages, creaking chairs and all that :)

[crocodile 8,017]

I've been just listening to the Lost: The Last Episodes album and I realized how I enjoy hearing all this noise. Like on the old SW album. It gives such a human quality to the recording. I miss these "errors" in modern recordings.

How about you?

Karol

[Taikomochi 1,136]

I kind of prefer it also. Though, it's almost offensively present in the Lost Season 3 album. I've really only noticed this in Giacchino's soundtracks. Does he do something different when recording his music?

[Datameister 2,044]

I have mixed feelings about it. It does give a more human quality to the music...makes you feel more like you're actually there. But it does sort of distract from the ideas of the music itself...I dunno. Guess it doesn't matter to me that much either way, as long as it's not too obtrusive.

[Trent B 337]

I don't mind hearing them in scores every once in a while. As you pointed out Karol it gives the score a more of a human quality.

[Gruesome Son of a Bitch 6,488]

Sometimes it's just annoying, like the creaking at the beginning of E.T. End Credits (film version).

[mrbellamy 6,287]

Yeah, I love it. It's like a little glimpse into the recording studio, and I've never found it particularly intrusive to my overall listening experience. If anything, it adds to it. Finding something in the recording is no less exciting than finding something in the music itself, for me.

My personal favorite sound would be those deep, sharp intakes of breath from a wind player during a solo

[Quintus 5,399]

I created exactly the same thread as this about three years ago

If I could be bothered I'd dig it up.

[crocodile 8,017]

Well, at least it isn't Jerry Goldsmith vs. John Williams poll.

Karol

[Melange 446]

I quite like this kind of thing audible on recordings.

You can hear it on the recording of Horner's Brainstorm.

[Gruesome Son of a Bitch 6,488]

At the end of one track from Sabrina, you hear Williams start to talk.

[gkgyver 1,645]

What totally put me off recently was the heavy breath of the flute player who performed Kara's Theme on the Living Daylights soundtrack.

It sounds like he's suffocating.

[Marian Schedenig 8,202]

I kind of prefer it also. Though, it's almost offensively present in the Lost Season 3 album. I've really only noticed this in Giacchino's soundtracks. Does he do something different when recording his music?

My understanding is they usually edit it out. I don't see why.

My personal favorite sound would be those deep, sharp intakes of breath from a wind player during a solo

Yes!

[Taikomochi 1,136]

I kind of prefer it also. Though, it's almost offensively present in the Lost Season 3 album. I've really only noticed this in Giacchino's soundtracks. Does he do something different when recording his music?

My understanding is they usually edit it out. I don't see why.

Maybe he doesn't? It's really audible in Let Me In, too.

At the end of one track from Sabrina, you hear Williams start to talk.

Which one?

[Faleel 5,356]

in "In The Idol's Temple" at 4:22 what sounds like a breath sound

[Koray Savas 2,251]

Giacchino's recordings in general are very good. I hate all the background noise though. It's very prominent in the LOST scores, but compare that to Season 1 which has none, and it sounds more flat. I don't know what he does, but they sound very full and acoustic. You can hear each and every pluck so well.

Sometimes it's too obtrusive, like with Howard's Duplicity. That one is almost unlistenable. You can hear the string soloist dying of oxygen loss.

[Gruesome Son of a Bitch 6,488]

At the end of one track from Sabrina, you hear Williams start to talk.

Which one?

Sabrina's Return to Paris.

[John Crichton 4]

Giacchino's recordings in general are very good. I hate all the background noise though. It's very prominent in the LOST scores, but compare that to Season 1 which has none, and it sounds more flat. I don't know what he does, but they sound very full and acoustic. You can hear each and every pluck so well.

Giacchino still records analogue rather than digital IIRC. Could be wrong there.

[Trent B 337]

I created exactly the same thread as this about three years ago

If I could be bothered I'd dig it up.

I thought this thread seemed familiar in some way.

[A24 4,340]

What I do mind is when you hear the nails of the pianist or the breathing of the classical guitarist. Those CDs are practically worthless to me.

Alex

[BurgaFlippinMan 7]

I dont like them. Get em outta there!

[Gruesome Son of a Bitch 6,488]

At the beginning of Cast a Christmas Spell vocal, you can hear someone whistling.

[Ollie 1,059]

I created exactly the same thread as this about three years ago

If I could be bothered I'd dig it up.

And I think it's been done one or two times since then.

But I don't mind them and I think several people, no one from here, who complain over at FSM and Intrada about "clicks" are mistaking sounds for them.

Some that comes to mind is the Tuba player inhaling during Jabba's theme on ROTJ, The sneeze at the end of The Asteroid Field, The creaking of chairs and instruments during a few cues on Akira Ifukube's score to Godzilla.

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

At the beginning of Cast a Christmas Spell vocal, you can hear someone whistling.

Can it be heard on the OST?

[Ollie 1,059]

I still can't hear Goldsmith humming during the theme to Rudy.

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

Isn't that an urban myth?

[John Crichton 4]

The biggest one for me has always been the page turn toward the end of Spock's Arrival in TMP.

[Taikomochi 1,136]

At the end of one track from Sabrina, you hear Williams start to talk.

Which one?

Sabrina's Return to Paris.

I can totally hear it. That's what they get for putting like 10 seconds of silence at the end.

[BTR1701 59]

Sometimes it's too obtrusive, like with Howard's Duplicity. That one is almost unlistenable. You can hear the string soloist dying of oxygen loss.

Why would a string player be starved for air? Their instruments don't require it.

[Koray Savas 2,251]

Don't ask me, ask the guy. Sounds like he's hyperventilating.

[A24 4,340]

I know some midi composers add ambience noises to their artificial orchestras to make it sound more real.

[Josh500 1,615]

I'd rather NOT have that... duh!

If a piece needs to have background noises and whatnot in order to have a "human quality," then something must not be right with the piece! I want to be able to immerse myself fully in the piece, without distractions.

However, I don't go batty over them when they happen.

[GoodMusician 56]

The final note of "Journey to the Island" from Jurassic Park has a cello chair creeking for quite some time lol... and in one of the Sorcerer's stone cues you hear someone sneeze. I remember i had a boston pops cd and in it you could hear someones stand completely go over and the music just flying across the stage and it baffled me why they just didn't re-record it lol... it was a great performance but a LOT of noise.

[Andy 4,138]

I almost never notice any of these. And if I do, I don't give it much thought. But I think it's kinda cool that a little graffiti has been left on the walls of these historic recordings.

[GoodMusician 56]

Oh! And my favourite, the transition in Episode I from Amidala saying she's going back to Naboo with a close up of Palpatine to then cut to the Jedi temple at night where they say Anakin will not be trained, that take of the cue used in the film was never released becuase this lady has a massive cough right on the first beat! If you listen to the UE it's a different take lol

[John Crichton 4]

I wish that guy would stop hyperventilating and moaning over so many cues in Images. Very distracting.

[Koray Savas 2,251]

I wish that guy would stop hyperventilating and moaning over so many cues in Images. Very distracting.

HAHAHAHA!!

[BTR1701 59]

The final note of "Journey to the Island" from Jurassic Park has a cello chair creeking for quite some time

How can you possibly know whose chair is creaking?

[Datameister 2,044]

I wish that guy would stop hyperventilating and moaning over so many cues in Images. Very distracting.

How can you possibly know whose chair is creaking?

I was wondering the same thing. I always hear the chair creak at the end of the track, but how in the world would one determine that it was one of the cellists?

[BLUMENKOHL 1,068]

I still can't hear Goldsmith humming during the theme to Rudy.

You're joking?

It's very easy to hear.

Play "Main Title" around ~3:05...the note from the last statement is being held...and then when the theme starts ascending again ( "da Da DA DAAA") you can literally hear Jerry.

[GoodMusician 56]

How can you possibly know whose chair is creaking?

I was wondering the same thing. I always hear the chair creak at the end of the track, but how in the world would one determine that it was one of the cellists?

You can tell because it comes from that section. It may be a viola though but its in that area. The only people playing are Cellos and it sounds like someone leaning back into the chair and hearing it creak, then leaning forward as to stop it from creaking but its right there in the right channel center where the cello's are. Its not too far back so it can't be anything else except cello, maybe viola heh

[Datameister 2,044]

Its not too far back so it can't be anything else except cello, maybe viola heh

"Not too far back"? If you've got binaural recordings of the score, hook me up, man!

[GoodMusician 56]

lol... am i the only one who can tell depth by recordings? lol... It's maybe... maybe.. the 2-3rd stand of violas... They had just finished playing so one of the instrumentalists probably leaned back to relax as the cello's played their last note only to find out his/her chair had to make a statement lol...It could be no more than 8-10 feet form the stage right recording mic.

[Datameister 2,044]

I'm sorry, but based on my (somewhat limited) knowledge of how recordings work, I don't see how it would be possible to gather that from the audio. Left/right information is there, obviously, and if you're just recording something with a single microphone, you can determine relative distances by the intensity of the sound. But with a setup involving 100 players and lots of mics, how would it be possible to extract this information?

[Ollie 1,059]

I still can't hear Goldsmith humming during the theme to Rudy.

You're joking?

It's very easy to hear.

Play "Main Title" around ~3:05...the note from the last statement is being held...and then when the theme starts ascending again ( "da Da DA DAAA") you can literally hear Jerry.

All I can hear is the choir. No Jerry.

[GoodMusician 56]

I'm sorry, but based on my (somewhat limited) knowledge of how recordings work, I don't see how it would be possible to gather that from the audio. Left/right information is there, obviously, and if you're just recording something with a single microphone, you can determine relative distances by the intensity of the sound. But with a setup involving 100 players and lots of mics, how would it be possible to extract this information?

Well, you can tell based on reverb, based on room sound, based on the ratio of the actual source to the reflections. Its not too hard to tell...

[Datameister 2,044]

That would just provide you with a rough idea of how far the source was from whatever microphones are responsible for the sound you're hearing at that moment. How would you know exactly where the microphones were set up and which ones you're measuring the distance from? And then how would you be able to get it precise down to a few feet?

(I hope I'm not wording all this too strongly...if there's a new skill to be learned here, I'm eager to learn it! It's just that I'm generally a very perceptive listener, and all I hear is a chair creaking in a recording studio, not too close to the microphones. I'm rather skeptical that anything more can be divined from the sound waves, at least without exact measurements of the space and sophisticated computer algorithms.)

[GoodMusician 56]

Well, unless they changed the micing for every cue in JP, i'd say it stayed pretty consistent. As for that, the way i edit music, i listen for these things... stage noises and where instruments are, especially when mixing media from several sources. like when i did my star wars edits, i had to listen to where the winds were and the brass or when i did my complete Temple of Doom edit, i had to phase invert the channels in order to fix the mixing errors of the most recent box set because they flipped the mixing of the winds and percussion around but not the strings (ie: moving the left justification of the winds and flutes out to the farthest regions and keeping the violins more narrow. Simply phase inverting the left and right channels flips this mess around and puts the flutes near the center and the strings out wider as they should be.

I dunno if it's neither here nor there but even with 20/20 vision, i have this weird fascination with sound and how blind people sense/hear the room. I always say that if i had to choose which sense to loose, it would be sight. Place me in a room and i can hear the couch based on the ambient sound. It changes based on the proximity to large objects and their positions in rooms.

Granted, there isn't anything so bold as a large couch in these recordings, but JP was recorded VERY live. The winds have definite placements and if you listen to the recording, who's playing...strings... I was never certain if it was Violas (who just finished playing) or the cellos (who are playing and are closer to the mic) but its one of the two. There is a great deal of definition in a lot of Williams recordings and its one of the reasons i love them. Its what i strive for when i mix or edit music.

Zimmer doesn't have it. Horner is closer. Modern Williams is being mixed less and less like this. Take IJ4 for example. It's mixed in a very awkward way. Too narrow for my tastes. Where as JP is very live and wide and brilliant. Star Wars Episode I has some brilliant mixing (most 90's williams scores do). AI is another one that utilizes the sound of the room to exceptional quality and to a lesser extent minority Report.

If that makes any sense... granted, when i joined this forum i couldn't do this... but the more i listened and edited, the more sensitive to it i became...

[ETMusic 1]

I've seen good music engineers hear ridiculous things (even on stereo recordings). I know one who did blind tests with three different premium microphone cables (ONLY the cable was different) and one of the participants was able to name which mic cable was which. I've even heard stories of one engineer who was able to hear the difference between different batteries (no idea how that's even humanly possible though).

[Datameister 2,044]

Those things strike me as extremely difficult, but not utterly impossible. Without knowing too much about how the electronics work, I would imagine that changing the cable or the battery could produce extremely subtle but consistent changes in the sound quality, and someone with a tremendous amount of experience could pick up on those. (Granted, I do wonder how scientific these listening tests were...I mean, to be really sure, you'd need to do a lot of trials, always double-blind and in totally random order.) But being able to hear which stand a creak came from? I don't understand how that information would even be encoded in the wave signal.

And regarding this specific creak, I actually hear two different locations - a very central creak that leads right into a louder, higher-pitched one toward the right. A moment later, there's another creak from that second location, and then another a short while later. Is this consistent with what you hear, GoodMusician?

when i did my complete Temple of Doom edit, i had to phase invert the channels in order to fix the mixing errors of the most recent box set because they flipped the mixing of the winds and percussion around but not the strings (ie: moving the left justification of the winds and flutes out to the farthest regions and keeping the violins more narrow. Simply phase inverting the left and right channels flips this mess around and puts the flutes near the center and the strings out wider as they should be.

Could you please explain what you mean by "phase inverting the channels"? I wasn't aware of any techniques that could allow you to move single sections of instruments in a stereo recording while keeping others the same.

I always say that if i had to choose which sense to loose, it would be sight. Place me in a room and i can hear the couch based on the ambient sound. It changes based on the proximity to large objects and their positions in rooms.

Nah...pick taste! Vision allows such a wide range of beautiful experiences, hearing is obviously crucial for speech and music, touch is VERY important for preventing the accumulation of injuries, and smell allows us to distinguish between thousands of different chemical compounds. Taste is by far the least complex and useful sense these days - it only has five simple dimensions (sweet, sour, salty, bitter, umami), and a big part of food's flavor just comes from the chemicals wafting up into your nasal cavity.

[GoodMusician 56]

And regarding this specific creak, I actually hear two different locations - a very central creak that leads right into a louder, higher-pitched one toward the right. A moment later, there's another creak from that second location, and then another a short while later. Is this consistent with what you hear, GoodMusician?

I hear what you mean, but it's only a slight push to the right consistent with leaning back in a chair. The person leaned back after having played their final note, the chair creaked and then the back of the chair put out the higher pitch, the person stopped moving, then tried to move back slightly again (click click) and then forward in hopes that the chair wouldn't make further noise. The noise is so close to the mic though... I still almost wonder if its cellos, but a cello player playing wouldn't be leaning back.

I amend what i said and correct it to be that it's a viola who had just finished playing.