Unlucky Bastard 7,782 Posted March 21, 2021 Share Posted March 21, 2021 Imagine his shrivelled up old doodle! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chen G. 3,949 Posted March 21, 2021 Share Posted March 21, 2021 22 hours ago, Edmilson said: Even Emperor Palpatine had children. No, he didn't. Dunno what you're talking about. Alberich had Hagen, though... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edmilson 7,466 Posted March 21, 2021 Share Posted March 21, 2021 21 minutes ago, Chen G. said: No, he didn't. Dunno what you're talking about. Alberich had Hagen, though... I'd be happier too if Rise of Skywalker and Cursed Child were fanfics but not actually canon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chen G. 3,949 Posted March 21, 2021 Share Posted March 21, 2021 I'm a big believer in "make your own canon of what's available." Edmilson 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bruce marshall 1,315 Posted March 21, 2021 Share Posted March 21, 2021 Alberich from THE RING? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chen G. 3,949 Posted March 21, 2021 Share Posted March 21, 2021 Indeed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bruce marshall 1,315 Posted March 21, 2021 Share Posted March 21, 2021 19 minutes ago, Chen G. said: Indeed. I thought Israelis are supposed to shun RW?😳😄 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chen G. 3,949 Posted March 22, 2021 Share Posted March 22, 2021 His music doesn’t get played, but you can’t really ignore the man who wrote the Bridal Chorus from Lohengrin or the Ride of the Valkyries from Die Walkure. Its sad, really. Because of how history classes in Israeli high-schools go, Wagner only ever gets mentioned in giving context to antisemitism in 19th Century Europe, so one could get a sense that he was just a minor composer with a mouth bigger than his music. That could not be further from the truth. Gurkensalat 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bilbo 3,709 Posted March 22, 2021 Share Posted March 22, 2021 Cursed Child > The Sequel Trilogy Holko and bollemanneke 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SilverTrumpet 638 Posted March 22, 2021 Share Posted March 22, 2021 At least Cursed Child had the original creator's blessing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chen G. 3,949 Posted March 22, 2021 Share Posted March 22, 2021 That's really not the issue. The issue is that both "cycles" present a complete narrative without those later additions. bollemanneke 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Naïve Old Fart 9,544 Posted March 22, 2021 Share Posted March 22, 2021 18 hours ago, bruce marshall said: I thought Israelis are supposed to shun RW?😳😄 6 hours ago, Chen G. said: His music doesn’t get played, but you can’t really ignore the man who wrote the Bridal Chorus from Lohengrin or the Ride of the Valkyries from Die Walkure. Fucking savages. Don't these people ever give up? bruce marshall 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chen G. 3,949 Posted March 22, 2021 Share Posted March 22, 2021 You mean the people who insist that Wagner must not be played? I'll dare them to hear Tristan... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bruce marshall 1,315 Posted March 22, 2021 Share Posted March 22, 2021 7 hours ago, Chen G. said: His music doesn’t get played, but you can’t really ignore the man who wrote the Bridal Chorus from Lohengrin or the Ride of the Valkyries from Die Walkure. Its sad, really. Because of how history classes in Israeli high-schools go, Wagner only ever gets mentioned in giving context to antisemitism in 19th Century Europe, so one could get a sense that he was just a minor composer with a mouth bigger than his music. That could not be further from the truth. Music lovers want him played. The opposition is from those who don't attend concerts. It's a bit of a myth that he was played in the death camps. The average German was into polkas not operas. His music never reached a mass audience. But, Hitler idolized him and he certainly helped plant the seeds of Nazism. Chen G. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chen G. 3,949 Posted March 22, 2021 Share Posted March 22, 2021 1 hour ago, bruce marshall said: Music lovers want him played. The opposition is from those who don't attend concerts. There's a truth to that. I believe it was Barenboim who announced, at the end of a concert, that he'd play a Wagner piece and that those who were inclined to find it objectionable can leave beforehand. Very few people were said to have left, and the piece recieved standing ovations. But then, those people who did leave seem intent on interrupting the playing of the piece by booing from the outside, and Barenboim himself was declared persona non grata following this. Whenever I have a conversation about it, it tends to go a bit like this: "You like Wagner?!" "Yeah. Don't you?" "No, it seems wrong to listen to it." "Oh yeah? What's that wedding tune..." *Hums the Bridal Chorus* "Well, that's Wagner. Still feels wrong?" 1 hour ago, bruce marshall said: It's a bit of a myth that he was played in the death camps. The average German was into polkas not operas. I haven't researched this subject with any thoroughnes, but you seem to be correct. For one thing, music in Death Camps was usually played by a small, inmate chamber orchestra; which wouldn't have been able to play a Wagner piece. But I don't see the point, either. Say they'd have played a lot of Beethoven - would we now have to shun Bethooven's music in Israel? Seems nonsensical to me. bruce marshall and Gurkensalat 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bruce marshall 1,315 Posted March 22, 2021 Share Posted March 22, 2021 Barenboim and Zubin in Mehta both tried . TRISTAN was played as an encore Chen G. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chen G. 3,949 Posted March 22, 2021 Share Posted March 22, 2021 Right, it was the prelude to Tristan! How can someone hear THAT and not fall in love, I have no idea. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bruce marshall 1,315 Posted March 22, 2021 Share Posted March 22, 2021 My take: Music is not the possession of the composer; it belongs to the world. He isn't conducting it, he isn't recording it. If he was alive and you wanted to boycott his performances - fine. It's really silly. Chen G. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chen G. 3,949 Posted March 22, 2021 Share Posted March 22, 2021 There's also the little issue of Tristan being one of the greatest works of mankind... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bruce marshall 1,315 Posted March 22, 2021 Share Posted March 22, 2021 Isn't T.S. Elliot still taught in English lit? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bruce marshall 1,315 Posted March 22, 2021 Share Posted March 22, 2021 Most fans listen to the orchestral excerpts. The audience that knows the opera libretto is tiny. 1 hour ago, Naïve Old Fart said: Fucking savages. Don't these people ever give up? MOSSAD has been notified😜😝 Naïve Old Fart 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chen G. 3,949 Posted March 22, 2021 Share Posted March 22, 2021 Subtitles help. Orchestral excerpts do Wagner a huge disservice - his whole point is that the music exists to serve the onscreen drama. Its basically sung Shakespeare with a musical accompaniment, withTristan und Isolde being the advanced version of Romeo and Juliet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bruce marshall 1,315 Posted March 22, 2021 Share Posted March 22, 2021 Yeah but....they sing in GERMAN! 😆 Plus they're so damn long! Btw Richard Strauss who actually collaborated with the NAZIS, and composed ZARATHUSTRA somehow gets a pass! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chen G. 3,949 Posted March 22, 2021 Share Posted March 22, 2021 Yep. No qualms in Israel about playing Strauss, oddly enough. 10 minutes ago, bruce marshall said: Yeah but....they sing in GERMAN! 😆 Plus they're so damn long! Die Walkure and Siegfried are long. Tristan isn't long. Tristan just IS. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bruce marshall 1,315 Posted March 22, 2021 Share Posted March 22, 2021 I've just ordered a DVD of live RING. I've listened to the damn thing but never watched it. It's a modern staging that hopefully has been pruned. Alot of the cycle is recapitualtion I.e. " previously in SIEGFRIED". Do they shorten the music dramas these days or are the " c and c " purists in charge😵😁 4 minutes ago, Chen G. said: Yep. No qualms in Israel about playing Strauss, oddly enough. Siegfried and Walkure are long. Tristan isn't long. Tristan IS. If only he wrote in Italian! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chen G. 3,949 Posted March 22, 2021 Share Posted March 22, 2021 22 minutes ago, bruce marshall said: Alot of the cycle is recapitualtion I.e. " previously in SIEGFRIED". Not really. Those scenes usually fill us (and the characters) in on a lot of stuff that happens offstage between the evenings. They're also usually important in informing the characters on the stage. Word had reached my ears of a travesty of "The Ring in one evening." One does not "prune" Wagner. 1 hour ago, bruce marshall said: But, Hitler idolized him and he certainly helped plant the seeds of Nazism. He didn't. Wagner's antisemitism was (1) typical of the period and (2) was traditional antisemitism, as opposed to the one rooted in race-theory as propogated by the Nazis. Wagner was willing to have a Jew conduct Parsifal, provided that he converts. That alone puts him quite aside from Nazis. He was also decidedly anti-militaristic, and clearly a great believer in the power of love and compassion. Hitler also cost us the uncut version of Rienzi, the score to which was in his possesion and got buried in the bunker... 56 minutes ago, bruce marshall said: My take: Music is not the possession of the composer; it belongs to the world. He isn't conducting it, he isn't recording it. If he was alive and you wanted to boycott his performances - fine. There's also the relevant issue of whether his objectionable personal views are appearant in the dramas themselves. If the works themselves were antisemitic, there would be a strong case against staging them. Mime and Beckmesser are the usual targets for these claims, but I don't really see it. Other celebrated works - The Merchant of Venice and Oliver Twist come to mind - DO have quite blatant antisemitic caricatures, and yet people seem to be able to look past it with ease. bruce marshall 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Naïve Old Fart 9,544 Posted March 22, 2021 Share Posted March 22, 2021 On 3/22/2021, @bruce marshall said "". Relax, Bruce, I don't hear a red ball. I was making a remark, using a quote from APOCALYPSE NOW to tie-in the Wagner reference. Offence was neither meant, nor should be inferred. 1 hour ago, bruce marshall said: Isn't T.S. Elliot still taught in English lit? Of course he is, and quite rightly so. THE WASTELAND is a staggering achievement. 1 hour ago, bruce marshall said: MOSSAD has been notified MOSSAD can kiss my ass. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bruce marshall 1,315 Posted March 22, 2021 Share Posted March 22, 2021 Right on! I'm no defender of the Jewish security state. Nice APOCALYPSE reference😄 Re: German anti-semitism I said RW planted seeds that came to fruition. (American promoters of eugenics also found sympathetic ears in the NAZI movement) He certainly wasn't alone in his prejudices. But....but.....but..... He was a very famous personage and, most importantly, put forth his views In published articles and books. Books that fueled anti Jewish feelings. It wasn't a case of his ppersonal, private views. They are truly revolting and hard to reconcile with his more humanistic, compassionate views. Btw How come Jay hasn't chimed in? 😝 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unlucky Bastard 7,782 Posted March 23, 2021 Share Posted March 23, 2021 3 hours ago, bruce marshall said: How come Jay hasn't chimed in? 😝 Because he only ever picks on me because he knows who I bat for. I go around reporting remotely political posts just to see what he does and of course, he does sweet fuck all about it. Gruesome Son of a Bitch 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bruce marshall 1,315 Posted March 23, 2021 Share Posted March 23, 2021 I was referring to his claim about all my posts being " garbage". Here, I give him an intellectually challenging dialog on " high culture" and he is MIA. 😎 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gruesome Son of a Bitch 6,488 Posted March 23, 2021 Share Posted March 23, 2021 Your posts are garbage bollemanneke 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unlucky Bastard 7,782 Posted March 23, 2021 Share Posted March 23, 2021 The garbage will do! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bruce marshall 1,315 Posted March 23, 2021 Share Posted March 23, 2021 Btw I love lowbrow culture. THREE STOOGES....DUMB AND DUMBER....THE MAMAS AND THE PAPAS....etc Lest you think me a pointy headed intellectual.. 😜 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unlucky Bastard 7,782 Posted March 23, 2021 Share Posted March 23, 2021 Yeah your head does look a bit pointy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bruce marshall 1,315 Posted March 23, 2021 Share Posted March 23, 2021 50 minutes ago, The Big Man said: Yeah your head does look a bit pointy You should see Thor's!😜 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bollemanneke 3,349 Posted March 23, 2021 Share Posted March 23, 2021 17 hours ago, bruce marshall said: Isn't T.S. Elliot still taught in English lit? It was in my university, yes. Naïve Old Fart 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Naïve Old Fart 9,544 Posted March 23, 2021 Share Posted March 23, 2021 13 hours ago, The Big Man said: Yeah your head does look a bit pointy Come pointy birds, A-pointy, pointy. Anoint my head, Anointy, nointy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bilbo 3,709 Posted April 13, 2021 Share Posted April 13, 2021 New children’s novel coming in October! https://www.jkrowling.com/the-christmas-pig-is-announced/ Disco Stu 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unlucky Bastard 7,782 Posted April 13, 2021 Share Posted April 13, 2021 This sheila just writes kids books Zzzzzz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Disco Stu 15,495 Posted April 13, 2021 Share Posted April 13, 2021 43 minutes ago, Bilbo said: New children’s novel coming in October! https://www.jkrowling.com/the-christmas-pig-is-announced/ Nice, definitely gonna buy it for my daughter. Bilbo 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jurassic Shark 12,079 Posted April 13, 2021 Share Posted April 13, 2021 You're not waiting for the reviews? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bilbo 3,709 Posted June 2, 2021 Share Posted June 2, 2021 https://www.reuters.com/breakingviews/harry-potter-casts-lasting-spell-over-bloomsbury-2021-06-02 Great to see the books remain as popular as ever! Nick1Ø66 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrbellamy 6,287 Posted June 2, 2021 Share Posted June 2, 2021 I worked for a Thriftbooks warehouse in recent years and used Harry Potter books were still getting orders all day every day. Twilight too for what it's worth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edmilson 7,466 Posted January 29, 2023 Share Posted January 29, 2023 People are making fun of JK Rowling's new book about a Polish detective (or something like that) on Twitter. Once again, people on Twitter are being mean for absolutely no reason. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HunterTech 994 Posted January 29, 2023 Share Posted January 29, 2023 Even putting aside her as a person, you earnestly can't tell me someone who thought Cho Chang was a fitting Asian name doesn't have some issues with writing some foreign nationalities. Why is that considered mean to critique? Besides, after her last book had someone who legitimately gets murdered that had received online hate for their work prior, I feel like some scorn is deserved if she's no different from other famous artists that ran out of ideas post their biggest works (I personally feel owed an apology for Cursed Child existing). Unlucky Bastard 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edmilson 7,466 Posted January 29, 2023 Share Posted January 29, 2023 Yeah, now that you said so, I was remembering that the third Fantastic Beasts movie had a Brazilian character named Vicência and I can tell you that is a very uncommon name even in Portuguese. I think she was trying to get the female version of Vicente (which is much more common, primarily among older men), but still, she should've chosen something less silly and more normal, like Maria, Teresa, Rosana, etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Holko 9,529 Posted January 29, 2023 Share Posted January 29, 2023 5 hours ago, Edmilson said: a Polish detective (or something like that) So you didn't even read what's in the tweet but you're already writing it off bollemanneke 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bollemanneke 3,349 Posted January 30, 2023 Share Posted January 30, 2023 Thinking is so outdated man... You gotta, like, use your brain and stuff for that. Also, genuine question: what's wrong with Cho Chang as a name? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Mark 3,631 Posted January 30, 2023 Share Posted January 30, 2023 1 hour ago, bollemanneke said: Also, genuine question: what's wrong with Cho Chang as a name? Must be considered some kind of racist offensive stereotype by the woke police On 28/01/2023 at 8:46 PM, HunterTech said: you earnestly can't tell me someone who thought Cho Chang was a fitting Asian name doesn't have some issues with writing some foreign nationalities. I can earnestly tell you I find nothing wrong with it. bollemanneke 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Disco Stu 15,495 Posted January 30, 2023 Share Posted January 30, 2023 The Polish thing is only offensive if you think being a cleaner is a negative stereotype as opposed to a job normal people have Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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