The Force Awakens The Force Awakens - Complete Score Breakdown & Chronological Order (Film Spoilers Allowed)

[Not Mr. Big 4,639]

15 minutes ago, Stefancos said:

General Grievous. A rousing brass theme, with the choir shouting "Grievous Are The Deeds Of The Empire" in Sanskrit.

Doesnt have anything to do with the stupid character, but it sounds great.

I never really cared for that one.  Too over the top and even a bit generic by Williams' standards (almost sounding like "epic trailer choir" music in some places). 

[crumbs 14,317]

Anakin's Betrayal, a stunning, emotional elegy for the death of nameless characters we don't know, don't care about, but are apparently... good guys, or something. And all due to the betrayal of our... protagonist (?) who is a whiny, unlikeable tit.

[Not Mr. Big 4,639]

1 minute ago, crumbs said:

Anakin's Betrayal, a stunning, emotional elegy for the death of nameless characters we don't know, don't care about, but are apparently... good guys, or something. 

A requiem for fallen action figure designs

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

Anakin's Betrayal starts out well but kinda peters out after the first few minutes or so.

[crumbs 14,317]

3 minutes ago, Not Mr. Big said:

A requiem for fallen action figure designs

Despair not, there's always Ko Ploon Burnt Corpse action figures, complete with starfighter wreckage.

[Not Mr. Big 4,639]

I'm still not over the death of Kia-Adi Mundi.  He came with a blue lightsaber.  

5 minutes ago, Stefancos said:

Anakin's Betrayal starts out well but kinda peters out after the first few minutes or so.

 

It's a good piece but it's a bit too "Hollywood/Broadwayish" if you get what I mean.  I much prefer the rawer lamentations heard in Munich and "The Immolation Scene" from later in the score.

[crumbs 14,317]

1 minute ago, Stefancos said:

Anakin's Betrayal starts out well but kinda peters out after the first few minutes or so.

 

OST version does it no favours; microediting the soft choir as Anakin murders the younglings was a mistake.

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

I listen to Trents edit 

[crumbs 14,317]

Who's Trent?

[Muad'Dib 1,802]

The explosive (unreleased) climax of It Can't Be

 

 

 

[Will 2,215]

On 6/3/2016 at 10:26 PM, Datameister said:

I have no doubt it was for Han's death. It's too strongly melodramatic to belong anywhere else. You can even hear a bit of the preceding alternate music just before the saber ignition, too, as I recall - some of which was used in the film and FYC.

 

Interesting! I hadn't noticed that. I just went back and listened to the FYC (and thus film) version of "Torn Apart," and indeed we do hear a rather large chunk of the "dramatic Force theme" cue right before the saber ignition moment (not the Force theme itself, but the quieter stuff preceding it). 

 

In case you find it interesting, on July 29, 2015, here's what Making Star Wars was reporting happened during the parade grounds/Starkiller firing sequence (http://makingstarwars.net/2015/07/star-wars-the-force-awakens-and-the-happenings-at-kanatas-castle-part-1/):

 

Quote

• Han Solo gives one more impassioned plea to Maz. She seems reluctant.
• We then cut to the First Order parade grounds on the snow planet where General Hux is giving a powerful speech to his Stormtroopers.
• Meanwhile in space near Maz’s planet, emissary Korr Sella is aboard a Resistance ship which travels towards Maz’s castle in name of General Organa.
• On the snow planet, as General Hux finishes his speech, the Stormtroopers all turn around (seen in the second teaser). We then see engineers pulling levers and pushing buttons as they ready their Starkiller weapon to fire. As it fires we see shots from above the ground as the weapon fires from beneath the surface, altering the terrain near the weapon in the process.

• The Stormtroopers at the rally all cheer in the fervor of the firing of their weapon’s might!
• Back at Maz’s place, Finn and Rey walk in the courtyard. They look up to see something terrible in the sky.
• On the ground level of the castle, Maz is telling Han she doesn’t know much about Leia (General Organa) these days.
• In space above the green planet, Korr Sella sees a flash of light. She knows it is over for her. Her ship meets its doom from the Starkiller’s blast. A Star Destroyer that came on the scene at about that moment comes into frame and we see the silhouette of the ship as the blast lights up the darkness of space.
• In space, Kylo Ren watches the blasts from his lander as he heads for Maz’s castle.
• General Organa and her staff react to the destruction of the emissary’s ship from the Resistance war room.
• Han Solo and Maz hear the commotion and exit the castle to the courtyard and see the weapon firing as they look on in horror (note these reaction shots are likely to be intercut with one another if the delayed reaction seems confusing).
• Maz ushers the heroes inside the castle and down a staircase. On the staircase she tells them who Luke Skywalker was and why he is important. They enter an underground chamber. Maz has them all hold hands.

 

So this may have been closer to what Williams was scoring originally. Just some food for thought when debating what scenes certain cues were intended for.

[DarthDementous 1,059]

On 6/4/2016 at 0:04 PM, crumbs said:

 

Nah, meant the prequels. Lucas was so inept as a director that Williams had to do the heavy lifting in the prequels. There was no chemistry between Christensen and Portman in AOTC, so Williams had to write the most lush, epic and sprawling love theme of his career (he probably pretended he was scoring Out of Africa) to compensate for the total lack of filmmaking ability. Likewise Duel of the Fates, rightly considered the only redeeming aspect of TPM, and far better than that film deserves.

 

The difference with TFA is that a competent director who understood characters was in charge, a bit like Irvin Kershner on ESB. There's a lot of scored moments in ESB which were dialled out because the film stood on its own feet without requiring Williams' music to fill any dramatic blanks (Luke's confrontation with Vader being a good example). Han's death in TFA was always going to be tragic enough without Williams needing to write an Anakin's Betrayal-esque cue (another example of Williams compensating for Lucas).

ah right, you meant the rest of the Force Awakens that had scoring that supported the drama and that particular cue was Prequels-ish because it was trying to create it.

[crumbs 14,317]

2 hours ago, DarthDementous said:

ah right, you meant the rest of the Force Awakens that had scoring that supported the drama and that particular cue was Prequels-ish because it was trying to create it.

Yeah pretty much, but I like Williams' original intentions here. The only problem was that the film didn't really need it, so they went with something much more restrained and athematic.

[Will 2,215]

On 5/12/2016 at 2:14 AM, Datameister said:

Oh god, I didn't realize what a mess the village attack material is. Based just on comparing the OST and the FYC/film version, I'd assumed the FYC version just contained an insert and some different microedits. But based on bonus features audio, the situation is a lot more complicated than that. At this point, I'd say that between the OST and the FYC, there are at least three or four cues partially represented - and this is just for the battle music, not for the starry night cue that precedes it. Inserts upon inserts. It's possible to reconstruct them to some extent, but there's still some music missing - and this isn't even taking into account a fragment in the features that I believe to be part of a completely unused early alternate cue for this scene. What a mess! The only other Williams score I know of that even comes close to this level of rescoring is POA.

 

Could you be more specific about the times in the OST and FYC versions of "Village Attack" where you hear various cues begin and end, where you hear inserts, microedits, etc.? Also, how would you define an insert? I'm still a little unclear on what that is. 

[Datameister 2,043]

54 minutes ago, Bill said:

 

Could you be more specific about the times in the OST and FYC versions of "Village Attack" where you hear various cues begin and end, where you hear inserts, microedits, etc.? Also, how would you define an insert? I'm still a little unclear on what that is. 

 

"Insert" is the industry term for a short cue (piece) that's written and recorded specifically to replace or lengthen a passage in another cue. For instance, Williams originally wrote and recorded the ESB end credits without the second half of Yoda's theme; then he went back and separately recorded the second half so it could be edited in like you hear on the album. Or in AOTC, the big Imperial March statements in the finale were an insert that replaced a different passage with a rather different tone.

 

As far as TFA specifics go, I'll take a look in a few hours when I'm home.

[Manakin Skywalker 4,894]

I'll bet that there's like 500 cues in the TFA recording sessions, most of which are just labelled "Insert".

[crumbs 14,317]

There's that weirdly out of place insert in Attack on the Jakku Village Part 1.

[Not Mr. Big 4,639]

3 minutes ago, crumbs said:

There's that weirdly out of place insert in Attack on the Jakku Village Part 1.

Which one?  

[Datameister 2,043]

6 hours ago, Bill said:

 

Could you be more specific about the times in the OST and FYC versions of "Village Attack" where you hear various cues begin and end, where you hear inserts, microedits, etc.? Also, how would you define an insert? I'm still a little unclear on what that is. 

 

I went back and looked at my notes, and it's all pretty difficult to fully describe. The FYC and OST both give us pieces of the puzzle. Bottom line, I think there are two main attack cues heard in the OST (one starting at 3:07 and another at 3:28), but the second one has multiple edits to shorten it, including some stuff heard on the OST and some stuff only heard in the features. The FYC contains different microedits, plus two alternate passages (2:17-2:34 and 2:49-3:15) that may have been separate inserts or two parts of a longer revised cue whose middle went unused.

 

Hard to say for sure!

[Will 2,215]

10 hours ago, Datameister said:

 

The second one has multiple edits to shorten it, including some stuff heard on the OST and some stuff only heard in the features. 

 

Thank you for your detailed breakdown! I'm a little unclear on what the sentence I quoted means, though. Could you clarify? 

[Datameister 2,043]

1 hour ago, Bill said:

 

Thank you for your detailed breakdown! I'm a little unclear on what the sentence I quoted means, though. Could you clarify? 

 

Sorry for the confusion - I meant that the second cue has been cut down in several places on the OST, and some of the missing material is found on the FYC and some of it is found in the Blu-ray special features.

[Will 2,215]

51 minutes ago, Datameister said:

 

Sorry for the confusion - I meant that the second cue has been cut down in several places on the OST, and some of the missing material is found on the FYC and some of it is found in the Blu-ray special features.

 

Okay, that makes sense, thanks!

[LongTimeJWFan 11]

FWIW at this point, I'm 1 hour and 19 minutes into an isolated score edit of the film and thought I'd show a screen capture of the 13 edits I made of "14. The Abduction." To duplicate what I was hearing, I had to abandon the FYC and edit the OST. 

[Will 2,215]

Change of plans: I'm not actually going to write a TFA complete score analysis as I had previously announced. Well, I started writing a page or two, but this score is just so extraordinarily long and complex. It was an exciting project, but at the same time a very daunting one. Rather than having this massive project hanging over my head, I think I'll just continue enjoying the score. I will continue analyzing the score as I have been, but I won't be writing down everything I find as I had hoped to. 

[Jay 37,364]

Finally got motivated to edit the main post (and Google Doc) to show that "Snoke" OST track is 2 different cues (split at the 1:02 mark) and that the "Escape In The Millennium Falcon" part of "The Rathtars" track is indeed  the film version and not an alternate.  I also threw in a quick note about the new cue that popped up in the Lego game.

 

If anyone is motivated, let me know if you think anything else in the main post / google doc is in error.

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

Be more motivated!

[Faleel 5,349]

You Still Want to Kill Me and Landing at Lightspeed contained tracked material (the short Clarinet bit) from Kylo Ren Searches the Falcon.

Some of Submit Your Blaster for Inspection is tracked from Kill Them All.

[crumbs 14,317]

3 hours ago, Fennel Ka said:

You Still Want to Kill Me and Landing at Lightspeed contained tracked material (the short Clarinet bit) from Kylo Ren Searches the Falcon.

Some of Submit Your Blaster for Inspection is tracked from Kill Them All.

 

Was the music in that deleted scene definitely scored for that sequence and not tracked? I certainly don't remember hearing that great Kylo Ren theme statement anywhere else.

[Faleel 5,349]

Well it had some extra music for The Bombing Rung not on the FYC

[Will 2,215]

22 hours ago, crumbs said:

 

Was the music in that deleted scene definitely scored for that sequence and not tracked? I certainly don't remember hearing that great Kylo Ren theme statement anywhere else.

 

I too believe that deleted scene is the only place to date that we have heard that particular Ren's theme statement. I feel pretty confident that the first part of the deleted scene music (the part with Ren inside the Falcon) was intended for that scene. The few seconds at the end (when Ren steps outside) that are also heard in FYC "The Bombing Run"? Hard to say. 

[Faleel 5,349]

Well Will you can hear that there is some of the "Bombing Run" music in the Deleted Scene that was edited out of the FYC and film.

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0BxQSwI5aPja9VUlzb2F1bVQ0bXc/view?usp=sharing

The other deleted scene of the X-Wings going to Lightspeed also has music edited out of The Bombing Run.

[Faleel 5,349]

Also, the 0:52-1:07 portion of Finn's Trek is either tracked, or edited down in the film (or only the FYC?)

[Faleel 5,349]

The Memoirs-esque music that we hear before and after "Landing at Lightspeed" seem to be both part of the same cue.

The "Unreleased opening" to Kill Them All is actually the microedited end of Torn Apart!

[Faleel 5,349]

Also the music that replaces the Force Theme statement in "Torn Apart", seems to be the big tragic fanfare music from "Kill Them All" pitched down.

[TownerFan 4,983]

Short but nice analysis of Rey's theme and its relationships with other themes:

 

 

[JacksonElmore 69]

On 6/10/2016 at 10:59 AM, LongTimeJWFan said:

FWIW at this point, I'm 1 hour and 19 minutes into an isolated score edit of the film and thought I'd show a screen capture of the 13 edits I made of "14. The Abduction." To duplicate what I was hearing, I had to abandon the FYC and edit the OST. 

Wow, that looks like a lot of work! Any idea on when it will be done?

[crumbs 14,317]

On 7/4/2016 at 7:49 PM, TownerFan said:

Short but nice analysis of Rey's theme and its relationships with other themes:

 

 

 

I hadn't seen this before -- WOW!

 

As if we needed any more evidence but... John Williams is a genius.

[mrbellamy 6,287]

It's honestly just really heartening to see an orchestra taking the music seriously like that. Rather than put their conductor in a Darth Vader costume and Stormtrooper helmets on all the musicians, they instead took advantage of the audience's familiarity with Star Wars for a little motivic analysis. Beautiful.

[Will 2,215]

There is a recurring minor melodic idea in TFA that I do not believe has yet been pointed out. Here are some examples:

 

OST track 1 at 3:26

 

OST ways of the force at 0.46

 

This - https://drive.google.com/file/d/0BxQSwI5aPja9cEg3TElmWGdUdW8/view?usp=sharing - throughout the beginning. This statement was part of unused village attack music. 

 

At 0.29 here: https://drive.google.com/file/d/0BxQSwI5aPja9NXlLWWQxRVQ0WGs/view?usp=sharing. This statement was part of unused music probably intended for Hux's speech before the firing but possibly it was for Han's walk right before yelling "Ben!"

 

FYC On the Inside, several times starting at 0.23

 

(All Drive links are from Fennel Ka and were previously posted in this thread.) 

 

[Pieter Boelen 740]

Definitely the same theme. Could that be this "First Order March" that was talked about before?

It certainly seems to be quite underused. Or at least under-represented on the OST.

 

Sounds like it has the potential to be really cool, but it never gets its Imperial March treatment.

But then... neither did Kylo Ren's Theme. I suppose John Williams wanted to do something different this time around....

[Faleel 5,349]

I was not really hearing a connection.....

[Will 2,215]

1 hour ago, Pieter_Boelen said:

Definitely the same theme. Could that be this "First Order March" that was talked about before?

 

Yes, at this time my best guess is that it is a B theme for the First Order, the A theme being the one first heard in Kill Them All as the First Order vehicles return to their Star Destroyer. Interestingly, these possible A and B themes play together in the powerful, march like cue I think is an unused cue for Hux's speech (this cue can be heard in - https://drive.google.com/file/d/0BxQSwI5aPja9NXlLWWQxRVQ0WGs/view?usp=sharing -  up until we hear "Ben" in the Drive file). MSW of course originally reported the First Order had a march that played during that speech, so it makes sense. It also makes sense that one of the most powerful moments in the score would come as the First Order truly displays their might on the parade grounds. It seems the two part First Order theme (or you could say two themes) is unleashed to its fullest just as the same happens for the Order. 

 

While what I call the B theme could be interpreted to mean many things based on its usage in the film, I think it's most likely intended for the Order. It could I guess also be a general theme for anticipation/nervousness.

1 hour ago, Fennel Ka said:

I was not really hearing a connection.....

 

Listen again, it's definitely there. 

[Chewy 2,391]

I hear it too and I agree with Will to say that it's a B theme for the First Order.

Incredible that we still find new things 7 months after the release!

[Jay 37,364]

[JacksonElmore 69]

15 hours ago, Pieter_Boelen said:

 

 

Sounds like it has the potential to be really cool, but it never gets its Imperial March treatment.

But then... neither did Kylo Ren's Theme. I suppose John Williams wanted to do something different this time around....

Or he's just setting stems for bigger ideas in the next few films. Like in a new hope, Vader had a very minor theme, and in esb he had a bigger one. I sense that the little themes for po and Finn and Kylo  will all grow into bigger themes. As the characters develop, they will musically as well. I hope. 

[Jay 37,364]

I think JW is going to have really cool new variations of Rey's Theme in the next film for sure!

[Will 2,215]

I just watched the Starkiller Base parade grounds scene, and I am now certain that the cue heard here - https://drive.google.com/file/d/0BxQSwI5aPja9MWZLV1p2anN0RVE/view - was intended for that scene. The debate had been whether the cue was for that scene or the moments right before Han's yell of "Ben!"

 

I watched the relevant scenes in the film again, and two things sealed the deal. First, the Han scene just doesn't fit with the cue. Why would there be a powerful march blaring as Han quietly creeps forward in the dark oscillator room? 

 

Secondly, and more tantalizingly, I noticed for the first time (even though I've seen the film many times) that the very beginning of the parade grounds scene is scored in the final film! As we see the Starkiller from space to open the scene, we hear the coda of the previous cue. But then we hear another cue begin. We hear low strings for just a few seconds, and then there's no more music until "The Starkiller" begins. But you know what those few seconds sound very similar to? The opening of the music in the Drive file. So I'm certain those few seconds are part of the same cue as the one heard in the Drive file (none of the few seconds of music heard in the film is in the file, btw). Additionally, while the cue as heard on the file runs longer than the scene in the final film, I'm guessing Williams must have seen a longer version of the scene at some point that he scored. The cue seems to fit the mood of Hux's speech very well so it makes sense if it's for that scene. And as I've noted in the past MSW reported around the start of the recording sessions that the speech scene was scored with a march -- and I'd consider the cue in question a march.

 

The evidence is overwhelming.

[Faleel 5,349]

The drive file is edited down.

[JacksonElmore 69]

17 minutes ago, Will said:

 

 

I noticed for the first time (even though I've seen the film many times) that the very beginning of the parade grounds scene is scored in the final film! As we see the Starkiller from space to open the scene, we hear the coda of the previous cue. But then we hear another cue begin. We hear low strings for just a few seconds, and then there's no more music until "The Starkiller" begins. But you know what those few seconds sound very similar to? The opening of the music in the Drive file. So I think what's in the Drive file may have been the unused rest of the cue, with only the very beginning heard in the final film. 

Yeah it wouldn't have made any sense with the Han scene. Good observation though, I don't think I ever realized that there was any music whatsoever In that sequence until starkiller. Weird that they would still have the music come in at the hit point of the cue and then fade out of it instead of just deleting the cue entirely. 

[Will 2,215]

25 minutes ago, Fennel Ka said:

The drive file is edited down.

 

Yes, even after you spliced in some not so good quality music that was edited out of the cue when we originally heard it, we do still seem to be missing parts of the cue.