#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted April 17, 2018 Share Posted April 17, 2018 9 minutes ago, Quintus said: Nuke Town is the best part of the movie, it's legitimately good and... bizarre. I agree. The first half of that movie really isnt bad. Smaug The Iron 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quintus 5,399 Posted April 17, 2018 Share Posted April 17, 2018 Pretty much. But the trademark dry Indy wit in the dialogue is way off and stands out like a sore thumb. Those were the early warning signs. Nick1Ø66 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted April 17, 2018 Share Posted April 17, 2018 Ford sells it though. Mostly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kasey Kockroach 2,344 Posted April 17, 2018 Share Posted April 17, 2018 Ford doesn't sell it, but Carmax does. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pieter Boelen 740 Posted April 17, 2018 Share Posted April 17, 2018 1 hour ago, Iron_Giant said: I feel like I’m sticking my neck out for no real good by saying this, but I enjoyed a lot of the inventiveness or neat touches in KOTCS—Area 51, the nuclear test town, the graveyard, the man-eating ants, the way the jungle blade sliced through the jeep... yes, the alien stuff at the end was out of place and the jungle chase CGI was too obvious. But to write off the whole movie is a bit much. Especially after a decade of lather-rinse-repeat superhero shit we’ve been force-fed by MCU, I’d much sooner have Indy 5 than Avengers 6 or 7 for summer movie fun. There are good things about it for sure. Having seen the alternate story treatments, the story filmed was definitely the best of the bunch. I'm still disappointed with it, but it could easily have been SO much worse! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jurassic Shark 12,091 Posted April 17, 2018 Share Posted April 17, 2018 1 hour ago, Iron_Giant said: I’m with mstrox on this one. The flying fridge was clever and it was inventive. It was FUN to watch, not least because it was rooted somewhat in the realm of plausibility. And when the fridge finally came to a stop, it was banged-up and dirty. And when indy came tumbling out, he actually looked like he took a painful ride in a fridge, FFS. You could actually believe it happened. It was not plausible at all that Indy survived the impact with the ground. Nick1Ø66 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Chen G. 3,950 Posted April 17, 2018 Popular Post Share Posted April 17, 2018 Not to justify one wrong with another, but was Indy's escape from the plane in Temple of Doom really any better? Bayesian, Arpy and Once 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pieter Boelen 740 Posted April 17, 2018 Share Posted April 17, 2018 2 minutes ago, Jurassic Shark said: It was not plausible at all that Indy survived the impact with the ground. And then there was a gopher! 1 minute ago, Chen G. said: Not to justify one wrong with another, but was Indy's escape from the plane in Temple of Doom really any better? Yes! At least that one was plausible enough to make the Myth Busters investigate it. Jurassic Shark 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jurassic Shark 12,091 Posted April 17, 2018 Share Posted April 17, 2018 3 minutes ago, Chen G. said: Not to justify one wrong with another, but was Indy's escape from the plane in Temple of Doom really any better? There's a great difference between impossible and implausible (however unlikely). But yeah, the plane escape isn't among the good ones. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mstrox 6,651 Posted April 17, 2018 Share Posted April 17, 2018 I think it was less plausible than Indy getting dragged behind a truck relatively unscathed, but more plausible than people's faces melting off because they looked at something. Jurassic Shark and Once 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jurassic Shark 12,091 Posted April 17, 2018 Share Posted April 17, 2018 4 minutes ago, Pieter_Boelen said: And then there was a gopher! Yeah, totally fake! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chen G. 3,950 Posted April 17, 2018 Share Posted April 17, 2018 I think part of the issue with the Temple of Doom incident is that its quite an extended shot, and then they slide down the hill with it, and then they fall down the gorge. Its not impossible to include such a ridiculous beat, if your editing is such that its completely "drowned" in the energy of the film, but here its like a setpiece all by itself. Again, not trying to make a right out of two wrongs: I really don't care for Kingdom of the Crystal Skull. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jurassic Shark 12,091 Posted April 17, 2018 Share Posted April 17, 2018 Just now, mstrox said: I think it was less plausible than Indy getting dragged behind a truck relatively unscathed, but more plausible than people's faces melting off because they looked at something. When it comes to magic (or God, as some would say), everything's possible. Nick1Ø66 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Nick1Ø66 4,722 Posted April 17, 2018 Popular Post Share Posted April 17, 2018 I can't say I'm a big fan of The Hobbit films, for example, but they all have their moments, a lot of care went into making them, and I don't dislike them as much as it may seem I do. So there are some films that we pile on that really don't deserve it. Indiana Jones and the Kingdom of the Crystal Skull is not one of those films. Indiana Jones and the Kingdom of the Crystal Skull deserves every bit of scorn heaped upon it. Indiana Jones and the Kingdom of the Crystal Skull is about the most obvious kind of cynical cash grab you can get. Not that there's anything wrong with cynical cash grabs, but it's obvious that no one working on Indiana Jones and the Kingdom of the Crystal Skull had any passion for it. There's not a single moment of honesty in the whole movie (the scene where Indy laments the death of Marcus comes closest). The photography is distracting and looks nothing like Slocombe's (a superior cinematographer) beautiful, earthy work. The colours are gaudy, and direction lazy and the less said about the script the the better. Mutt and Marion were a mistake, and from the Jungle sequence to the end the movie is more or less unwatchable. The one cool bit from the film is Nuke Town and Indy standing in front of that mushroom cloud..a striking image that reminds us that we're not in the 1930's anymore. I really hope they get back to basics with the next film, and acknowledge the reality of Indy's age. Here's what I said about this a month ago... On 3/20/2018 at 7:32 PM, Nick1066 said: I didn't think the problem with the unwatchable KOTCS was Ford's age, but rather what they had him doing via the terrible script and bad supporting characters across the board. This could work, maybe, if they do it right....i.e. an Indy movie that relies more on Indy the archeologist, professor and acquirer of rare antiquities, and less the action hero. Obviously, you can have some of that, but not so much as to strain credulity. Indy will clearly need a new sidekick to handle a good deal of the action...perhaps one of his students (and they'll probably make it a woman, some kind of prodigy). ...and now this... Steven Spielberg: It May Be Time For A Female ‘Indiana Jones’ Holko, Chen G., Jurassic Shark and 2 others 4 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chen G. 3,950 Posted April 17, 2018 Share Posted April 17, 2018 8 minutes ago, Nick1066 said: I really hope they get back to basics with the next film, and acknowledge the reality of Indy's age. I'm not very hopeful. Indiana Jones as a trilogy had such a good ending in The Last Crusade. Now, you can always make another one and say "well, that was a prank ending, now here's the real one." But when that movie is Kingdom of the Crystal Skull... And now another one? Nope. I just don't need another Indy film. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pieter Boelen 740 Posted April 17, 2018 Share Posted April 17, 2018 Indiana Jones is an exquisite opportunity for a James Bond approach. The potential is nearly limitless, so why bother limiting the number of movies? Real shame that they waited so stupidly long that Ford can't do many of them anymore. Once 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mstrox 6,651 Posted April 17, 2018 Share Posted April 17, 2018 5 minutes ago, Chen G. said: I'm not very hopeful. Indiana Jones as a trilogy had such a good ending in The Last Crusade. Now, you can always make another one and say "well, that was a prank ending, now here's the real one." But when that movie is Kingdom of the Crystal Skull... How does a fourth (or fifth) movie make the end of TLC a "prank ending?" Did they not really escape the temple and ride away on horses? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick1Ø66 4,722 Posted April 17, 2018 Share Posted April 17, 2018 Just now, mstrox said: How does a fourth (or fifth) movie make the end of TLC a "prank ending?" Did they not really escape the temple and ride away on horses? There's something to be said for riding into the proverbial sunset (and staying there). Chen G. and Holko 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chen G. 3,950 Posted April 17, 2018 Share Posted April 17, 2018 Exactly. The most exact and correct statement in the history of JWFan, probably. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kasey Kockroach 2,344 Posted April 17, 2018 Share Posted April 17, 2018 If he had stayed in the sunset, he would have been burned alive! mstrox 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fancyarcher 350 Posted April 17, 2018 Share Posted April 17, 2018 I'll be an odd-man out, and say despite its problem, I quite enjoyed KOTCS. I think it's an entertaning adventure film anyway. Its biggest issue is the overreliance on CGI, and even then that doesn't bother me as much as it should. The first half is pretty solid too. I'm looking forward to the fifth film. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Quintus 5,399 Posted April 17, 2018 Popular Post Share Posted April 17, 2018 34 minutes ago, Nick1066 said: ...and now this... Steven Spielberg: It May Be Time For A Female ‘Indiana Jones’ What's the problem? Nick1Ø66, Bayesian, Jurassic Shark and 2 others 1 1 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chen G. 3,950 Posted April 17, 2018 Share Posted April 17, 2018 5 minutes ago, Fancyarcher said: Its biggest issue is the overreliance on CGI, and even then that doesn't bother me as much as it should. The first half is pretty solid too. I'm looking forward to the fifth film. I will never, never hate on a film if all that's wrong with it is just production value. Indiana Jones and the Kingdom of the Crystal Skull has plenty of narrative issues, along with production woes and is just an unnecesary movie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bayesian 1,364 Posted April 17, 2018 Share Posted April 17, 2018 Well, like with many things in life, it’s all relative. No one would survive in a flying fridge, fair enough. But if the script required you to, it helps with the suspension of disbelief if you can see some consequences from such an outrageous stunt. With Indy, we do; we always do: he always looks like he’s been put through the wringer, and that’s half the fun of watching his ridiculous adventures. I just wish filmmakers would try a little harder in other blockbuster properties to make it seem like there are consequences—whether it’s after being punched in the face or after a 40-story building comes down. I’d even settle for some dust or a few rips and tears in superman’s suit after he busts through reinforced concrete walls at 150mph. Iron Man’s suit obeys no laws of earthly physics in how it comes apart when Stark is done burning hundreds of gallons of whatever (stored who knows where) after skyrocketing 40,000 feet in the air in a blink... sorry, MCU, for dumping on you so much today, but I guess I’m realizing how checked out I am after a decade of superheroes. Because eveything is TOO fantastical, there is no point in an emotional investment in the story. There’s no satisfying payoff when someone gets their due at the end, because it was just too make-believe silly in the first place. and hence why I’m spending so much time defending KOTCS and Indy 5. Because I crave stories in the vein of the old spielberg &lucas, when you knew it was a movie, but you could still enjoy the ride because the ride was more real. (Alien crystal skulls notwithstanding.) Pieter Boelen 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fancyarcher 350 Posted April 17, 2018 Share Posted April 17, 2018 5 minutes ago, Chen G. said: I will never, never hate on a film if all that's wrong with it is just production value. Indiana Jones and the Kingdom of the Crystal Skull has plenty of narrative issues, along with production woes and is just an unnecesary movie. I don't usually mind plot problems as much. I just enjoyed KOTCS for what it was. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick1Ø66 4,722 Posted April 17, 2018 Share Posted April 17, 2018 31 minutes ago, kaseykockroach said: If he had stayed in the sunset, he would have been burned alive! Unless he found a fridge. Chen G. and Once 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kasey Kockroach 2,344 Posted April 17, 2018 Share Posted April 17, 2018 He did, but there wasn't any room for him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Naïve Old Fart 9,553 Posted April 17, 2018 Share Posted April 17, 2018 43 minutes ago, Quintus said: What's the problem? Now, that's what I call "pussy-whipped" Nick1Ø66 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pieter Boelen 740 Posted April 17, 2018 Share Posted April 17, 2018 45 minutes ago, Quintus said: What's the problem? No problem! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quintus 5,399 Posted April 17, 2018 Share Posted April 17, 2018 3 hours ago, Stefancos said: Ford sells it though. Mostly. Hmm, I dunno. For me the best, most naturalistic line in the movie is, "Sure great! Don't wait for me!" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crumbs 14,319 Posted April 17, 2018 Share Posted April 17, 2018 The first third of KOTCS is actually solid, and it feels right in line with the tone of the original 3 (barring some wonky dialogue, but that's Koepp's fault -- he ain't no Tom Stoppard). It all falls apart badly once they leave the US. It's practically on life support for about 50 minutes, with scene after scene of lazy, boring exposition, moving from one obvious soundstage to another. It's painfully obvious all the exteriors were shot in the safety of the Universal backlot, further entrenching the idea that the film was just a lazy cash-grab. And yes, the cinematography is atrociously distracting and (bizarrely) gets worse as the film goes on. The overdone colour grading and bloom throughout the jungle sequence looks fucking awful. It's rather strange, because KOTCS doesn't look anything like Kaminski's usual work, which generally has a far grittier, grainier texture that would've suited the Indy series just fine if he toned down his more stylised lighting choices. So I can only assume this was a deliberate attempt to approximate Slocombe's photography? If so, what an unmitigated failure. You can't even tell they went to the trouble of shooting animorphic on old-school lenses because the whole film is scrubbed cleaner than the Star Wars prequels. Cerebral Cortex 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unlucky Bastard 7,782 Posted April 18, 2018 Share Posted April 18, 2018 54 minutes ago, crumbs said: You can't even tell they went to the trouble of shooting animorphic on old-school lenses because the whole film is scrubbed cleaner than the Star Wars prequels. Unless you have an eye for oval-shaped bokeh and distorted heads. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gruesome Son of a Bitch 6,488 Posted April 18, 2018 Share Posted April 18, 2018 8 hours ago, Quintus said: Pretty much. But the trademark dry Indy wit in the dialogue is way off and stands out like a sore thumb. Those were the early warning signs. HF was completely out of character and coming off like a buffoon running around asking to use the phone in the nuke town. Then he mispronounces nuclear. It's just bad writing and directing, with Ford failing to sink back in the role. Meanwhile, he did a good job as old Han Solo several years later. He was in rare form channeling his early 80sness there. I was stunned. But everything went wrong with KOTCS, so. Such a missed opportunity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unlucky Bastard 7,782 Posted April 18, 2018 Share Posted April 18, 2018 Why'd they think it was a great idea to see an elderly adventurer? Reminds me of that I Still Dream of Jeannie tele movie from the 90s, it didn't work having Barbara Eden as mutton dressed as lamb. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kasey Kockroach 2,344 Posted April 18, 2018 Share Posted April 18, 2018 I'm a glutton for that mutton! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cerebral Cortex 3,357 Posted April 18, 2018 Share Posted April 18, 2018 47 minutes ago, Margo Channing said: Why'd they think it was a great idea to see an elderly adventurer? Reminds me of that I Still Dream of Jeannie tele movie from the 90s, it didn't work having Barbara Eden as mutton dressed as lamb. I dunno. I've always really liked it when heroes are allowed to age. Can't really place why. It kinda humanizes them in a way, knowing that they got to live and grow and change as the years went by. Or perhaps it is just getting to see these characters at different points in their life? Kinda adds another layer to things. I don't know. I'm incoherently rambling as usual. Once 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unlucky Bastard 7,782 Posted April 18, 2018 Share Posted April 18, 2018 3 minutes ago, Cerebral Cortex said: I dunno. I've always really liked it when heroes are allowed to age. Can't really place why. It kinda humanizes them in a way, knowing that they got to live and grow and change as the years went by. Or perhaps it is just getting to see these characters at different points in their life? Kinda adds another layer to things. I don't know. I'm incoherently rambling as usual. Seeing where they are later on isn't bad in itself, it's the execution and the believability of seeing a 65-year-old man seeming almost invincible when his younger self took about as much abuse and looked really sore afterward. Once and dtw42 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cerebral Cortex 3,357 Posted April 18, 2018 Share Posted April 18, 2018 I can agree with that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jurassic Shark 12,091 Posted April 18, 2018 Share Posted April 18, 2018 9 hours ago, mstrox said: How does a fourth (or fifth) movie make the end of TLC a "prank ending?" Did they not really escape the temple and ride away on horses? It was rubber horses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kasey Kockroach 2,344 Posted April 18, 2018 Share Posted April 18, 2018 Or they came across this guy. (I'd watch the hell out of that movie) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post crumbs 14,319 Posted April 18, 2018 Popular Post Share Posted April 18, 2018 Are there any other recurring ideas from the long-gestating Indy 4 drafts that never made the final cut? I'd expect they'll find their way into the fifth film, considering how many other recycled ideas made it into the fourth film (aliens, giant ants, a waterfall setpiece, even ideas for other franchises like Nuke Town). I reckon Spielberg will mine Darabont's script for ideas that he liked but Lucas vetoed, such as Indy's daughter and a scene where all his former mistresses/girlfriends confront him. Plus that fun scene of Indy getting drunk in his museum while reflecting on his life and reminiscing on old adventures. I really hope they don't shy away from the age factor and actually make it part of the storyline this time, Unforgiven style. The retired adventurer forced back into action one last time. Focus more on Indy the investigator/espionage agent, rather than the action hero (which will probably not work). Pieter Boelen, Once, dtw42 and 1 other 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unlucky Bastard 7,782 Posted April 18, 2018 Share Posted April 18, 2018 I just don't see him at his age donning the classic outfit. He'd be better in the professor suit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kasey Kockroach 2,344 Posted April 18, 2018 Share Posted April 18, 2018 He's better as Elliot's principal! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Naïve Old Fart 9,553 Posted April 18, 2018 Share Posted April 18, 2018 For me, the one saving grace of INDY 4 is that it's not Indiana Jones' film. It's not about him, it's about Mutt's relationship with Oxley. That aspect of the film has always moved me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quintus 5,399 Posted April 18, 2018 Share Posted April 18, 2018 Really? I could never get over how they wasted John Hurt so badly. Once 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jurassic Shark 12,091 Posted April 18, 2018 Share Posted April 18, 2018 1 minute ago, Quintus said: Really? I could never get over how they wasted John Hurt so badly. I had the EXACT same feeling. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crumbs 14,319 Posted April 18, 2018 Share Posted April 18, 2018 Yeah, just another baffling fuckup in a film filled with baffling fuckups and wasted opportunities. Just like that awesome jungle cutter truck that other filmmakers would've crafted an entire action sequence around, yet they thought the most creative option was to do two fifths of fuck all with it! Pieter Boelen 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gruesome Son of a Bitch 6,488 Posted April 18, 2018 Share Posted April 18, 2018 4 hours ago, Richard said: For me, the one saving grace of INDY 4 is that it's not Indiana Jones' film. It's not about him, it's about Mutt's relationship with Oxley. That aspect of the film has always moved me. ???????????????????? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Naïve Old Fart 9,553 Posted April 18, 2018 Share Posted April 18, 2018 5 hours ago, Quintus said: Really? I could never get over how they wasted John Hurt so badly. 5 hours ago, Jurassic Shark said: I had the EXACT same feeling. Of course they wasted Hurt, as they wasted Allen, Winstone, and Broadbent, but if I concentrate on the Mutt/Ox aspect of the story, I find the film at least bearable. Jurassic Shark 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kasey Kockroach 2,344 Posted April 18, 2018 Share Posted April 18, 2018 No, THIS film is bearable. Jurassic Shark 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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