The Quick Question Thread

[Jurassic Shark 12,082]

4 minutes ago, Marian Schedenig said:

no, not the vinyl kind…

 

Yeah, they had to resort to wax cylinders back then.

[Stark 316]

Do we have any threads related to Patrick Williams? For obvious reasons, a little difficult to search for...

[Jay 37,372]

As far as I can tell we do not.

[Tom Guernsey 2,286]

I'm sure this is one of the thousands of pages of Jurassic Park threads (I can’t readily find the answer) but what’s the short downbeat music that plays in the film between the end of T-Rex Rescue and Finale and Welcome to Jurassic Park (i.e. the end credits) when they are boarding the helicopter? I assume it’s tracked from elsewhere in the score and I keep thinking I should know but can never place it.

[Jay 37,372]

That's just a bit of "Remembering Petticoat Lane"

 

 

[bollemanneke 3,349]

Is it normal that my nose and throat get itchy for a few hours every time I have handled my vinyl record cupboard?

[Naïve Old Fart 9,551]

Absolutely not!

Seek medical advice, immediately.

[Thor 7,518]

Perhaps you have dust allergy or some other form of allergy? Do check it out.

[Bespin 8,484]

2 hours ago, bollemanneke said:

Is it normal that my nose and throat get itchy for a few hours every time I have handled my vinyl record cupboard?

 

Allergic reaction to dust, mold.

[Jurassic Shark 12,082]

On 26/09/2023 at 9:34 PM, Naïve Old Fart said:

There's a few songbook selections, on Amazon.

 

I've got the Deluxe Anthology piano book, but the arrangement is too tame.

[Marian Schedenig 8,207]

5 hours ago, Bespin said:

Allergic reaction to dust, mold.

 

…or vinyl.

[karelm 2,914]

One of the greatest and most influential soundtracks was Walt Disney's score for Fantasia (1940).  It was the first soundtrack in surround sound and was conducted/arranged by Leopold Stokowski.   

 

The recordings were state of the art but the film was a flop.  For some reason, Disney rereleased it in 1982 with a brand-new recording that had to be completely true to the original recording to line up to the animation.  This re-release was conducted by wonderful conductor Irwin Kostel (West Side Story (1962), Marry Poppins (1964), Sound of Music (1965), etc.).  My question is why did Disney feel the need to rerecord the seminal score of their most artistic venture where that recording had to completely conform to the existing animation and today is completely ignored compared to the original Leopold Stokowski version from 1940?  What were they thinking? To me, both are excellent, but the Stokowski version is completely superior in interpretation and the technical advances between 1940 and 1982 are marginal since the 1940 recording was the pinnacle of what was then possible.  This is very important to me because the 1982 recording soundtrack was my very first album purchased (at $3.99!) when I was a kid because the experience of seeing the 1982 film in a theater that my 4th grade class was forced to attend was mind blowing!  I vividly remember that experience.  

[filmmusic 1,838]

Does anyone have in mind by any chance a percussion-only source cue?

I want to write one for an entering the arena scene.

(I wrote a couple of brass fanfares but apparently they are not needed)

[Thor 7,518]

The BIRDMAN soundtrack? "Tabla" from PUNCH-DRUNK-LOVE? 

 

Nah, I'm guessing you're looking for more bold stuff, heavy on timpani, snare drums etc.? The military percussion tracks from THE ABYSS or ALIENS? First 30 secs of "Swingin' Rude Boys" from PREDATOR 2? The timpani rolls at about 8:12 in "St. Crispin's Day/The Battle of Agincourt" from HENRY V? The take-off opening from HARRY POTTER 3 (the flying scene with the griffin thing)?

 

Or you can edit them together -- start off with some of the snare drums from THE ABYSS, segue into the timpani of HENRY V and then climax with the HARRY POTTER takeoff music. That's a pretty good arena entrance right there, that doesn't merely copy the brassy entry in BEN HUR.

 

[GerateWohl 4,371]

Something like that?

 

[filmmusic 1,838]

Thank you for the suggestions, but I don't want to use snare drums. I think they're from another era. I'm talking about 400 AD and entering in a Colosseum-like arena. Something that would fit the Gladiator movie for example.

@Thor I will listen to some of the examples, I don't remember them right now.

Pity about those brass fanfares of mine, I loved them...

5 hours ago, Thor said:

The timpani rolls at about 8:12 in "St. Crispin's Day/The Battle of Agincourt" from HENRY V?

Funny you should mention about timpani rolls, I was thinking of using them. (more like taiko-drums roll. I know they are out of place, but I really like the sound).

[Faleel 5,359]

Just the first examples that came to mind:

 

 

Wind and the Lion has a couple percussion source cues (The Horsemen, and Arabian theme)

 

The Ten Commandments has a few drum source cues, including a roll similar to what you mentioned.

 

To be continued....

 

 

 

[filmmusic 1,838]

Thanks.

I was wondering, what sweetener means?
I have seen it in other scores too, mainly John Williams's.

[Faleel 5,359]

1 minute ago, filmmusic said:

Thanks.

I was wondering, what sweetener means?
I have seen it in other scores too, mainly John Williams's.

Usually it means, a little something extra, to give a section a boost.

 

 

@filmmusic I do have a midi drumset, and some percussion VST's, if you are interested, I could try out some rhythms, and you could see if anything inspires you.

[filmmusic 1,838]

47 minutes ago, Presto said:

I do have a midi drumset, and some percussion VST's, if you are interested, I could try out some rhythms, and you could see if anything inspires you.

Oh, you're so kind, thank you very much for your offer but I don't want to put you in trouble.

I'll make up something.

[Jay 37,372]

On 01/11/2023 at 2:31 PM, filmmusic said:

Thanks.

I was wondering, what sweetener means?
I have seen it in other scores too, mainly John Williams's.

 

Here's an example for you.

 

The original version of "Escape From Venice":

 

 

The version with a mandolin sweetener mixed in:

 

 

 

[filmmusic 1,838]

Do we have any Christian (or otherwise) torture scene?

Apart from The Passion of Christ where the music score acts as counterpoint (meaning it is the exact opposite of the visuals), I cannot think of something...

[GerateWohl 4,371]

1 minute ago, filmmusic said:

Do we have any Christian (or otherwise) torture scene?

Apart from The Passion of Christ where the music score acts as counterpoint (meaning it is the exact opposite of the visuals), I cannot think of something...

Weren't there torture scenes in The Name of the Rose? But I don't remember music. 

[filmmusic 1,838]

Just now, GerateWohl said:

Weren't there torture scenes in The Name of the Rose? But I don't remember music. 

Hmmm.. I don't remember, but I remember the score. It was one of the first soundtracks I've ever heard, since they had an LP of it at my father's work (he worked at a radio station).

I don't think it is something I'm after. I remember it is a very weird score.. (and especially when I got to know Horner and what he does. It doesn't seem to be written by the same composer)

[GerateWohl 4,371]

 

Oh, and Braveheart. But that wasn't Christian.

[filmmusic 1,838]

Just now, GerateWohl said:

 

Oh, and Braveheart. But that wasn't Christian.

Ah, right. Doesn't matter.

Again the music acts as counterpoint to the picture.

I wonder if there is any score that doesn't. I was thinking of following this path too.

[Naïve Old Fart 9,551]

Maybe not what you're looking for, @filmmusic, but for torture scenes, you don't get much more counterpoint than "Singin' In The Rain" 

[GerateWohl 4,371]

What about that scene in Indiana Jones and the Temple of Doom where Indy is forced to drink the blood of Khali?

 

And then of course there is this.

 

 

[Richard Penna 3,694]

Something I wondered today while listening to a few bits of a session leak.

 

We constantly hear how tough the scoring business is, with producers/studios often not caring much about the minutiae of a score as long as it gets done, but then you see interviews with composers about taking the time on the scoring stage to perfect certain bits, and session leaks where they seem to have recorded half the score twice and endlessly revised things.

 

These two, for me, don't seem to correlate. Is it just a case where the top composers have the skills and speed and a team to do all these changes within the often insane time crunch, and perhaps the director pushes back at the studio pressure where they want some particular musical thing resolved?

 

Or do standard recording schedules intentionally build in some time to do revisions and re-record cues, particularly if it's a big score?

[karelm 2,914]

3 hours ago, Richard Penna said:

Something I wondered today while listening to a few bits of a session leak.

 

We constantly hear how tough the scoring business is, with producers/studios often not caring much about the minutiae of a score as long as it gets done, but then you see interviews with composers about taking the time on the scoring stage to perfect certain bits, and session leaks where they seem to have recorded half the score twice and endlessly revised things.

 

These two, for me, don't seem to correlate. Is it just a case where the top composers have the skills and speed and a team to do all these changes within the often insane time crunch, and perhaps the director pushes back at the studio pressure where they want some particular musical thing resolved?

 

Or do standard recording schedules intentionally build in some time to do revisions and re-record cues, particularly if it's a big score?

 

Alan Silvestri once said the five most important skills for being a professional film composer are delivering on time, delivering on budget, delivering to technical requirements (7.1 vs 5.1, 48hz vs 96hz, 16 bit vs 24 bit, ProTools vs WAV, etc), timely revising when needed, and generally collaborative team player (supporting the director's vision and needs).  He made a point that music quality wasn't one of them.  If you write the best music ever heard but always miss your deadlines, you'll not make it as a professional film composer.  Very, very few composers get the budgets to work like this where they get enough time to record what they want.  The challenges are the film is always changing and sometimes the filmmakers will just edit the existing music producing poor music results.  This is very problematic in thematic scores where a note is cut out or the theme chopped.  So ideally, the composer would revise and maybe get a chance to edit it.  Sometimes you don't know what was changed but what used to sync up no longer does.  After umpteenth revisions of the same scene, other work piling on from perhaps other projects, schedule dragging and maybe the composer feeling the first version was the best and each revision is weaking it, it can certainly drive the composer crazy.  Having a large staff can help soften this since they can delegate work to people, but the hired composer is still ultimately the one on the hook.

 

There are some composers who want to record several versions of the same cue with options such as cued instruments omitted in one take and playing in the other.  This is to have options if the director says they're just not feeling the cue works in the sound dub, the composer can say how about this alternative, but this obviously increases the budget for the scoring, performance, and mixing.  But having this option gives the composer an added sense of security that they're covered if feedback comes back later.  It isn't unusual these days to do stripes (recording sections at a time rather than full ensembles at once) which also allows more options in post.  What we're seeing is directors are piecing together a score with pieces but gives them more flexibility in the film than the composer being one of the story tellers with their own point of view.

[Faleel 5,359]

"Choose Your Own Adventure" scoring.

[GerateWohl 4,371]

When I hear these stories I sometimes wonder why film composers are still mentioned in the opening credits of a movie and not just in the end credits between the set caterer and the main actors hair dresser. Seems their artistic contribution is not valued and respected anymore accordingly to be mentioned in the key players of a movie in the opening credits.

[Jurassic Shark 12,082]

1 hour ago, karelm said:

He made a point that music quality wasn't one of them.

 

Cue Balfe.

 

23 minutes ago, GerateWohl said:

When I hear these stories I sometimes wonder why film composers are still mentioned in the opening credits of a movie and not just in the end credits between the set caterer and the main actors hair dresser. Seems their artistic contribution is not valued and respected anymore accordingly to be mentioned in the key players of a movie in the opening credits.

 

Hush, don't give them any ideas.

[Richard Penna 3,694]

57 minutes ago, karelm said:

Alan Silvestri once said the five most important skills for being a professional film composer are delivering on time, delivering on budget, delivering to technical requirements (7.1 vs 5.1, 48hz vs 96hz, 16 bit vs 24 bit, ProTools vs WAV, etc), timely revising when needed, and generally collaborative team player (supporting the director's vision and needs).  He made a point that music quality wasn't one of them.

 

That certainly aligns with some other interview where the composer said a film composer is a businessman who happens to write music. They have to be so good at collaborating, networking and managing the technical workflow that I was left with the impression of how the hell they found any time in that to actually write good music.

[GerateWohl 4,371]

40 minutes ago, Richard Penna said:

They have to be so good at collaborating, networking and managing the technical workflow that I was left with the impression of how the hell they found any time in that to actually write good music.

That is left to their assistants.

[Edmilson 7,468]

This is one of my nightmares regarding film music: the fact that the person who, according to the movie's credits, is the composer, did nothing but "networking" with producers, directors, etc. to get some basic input on how the music should sound and the actual composing was done by some unknown half their age and with a fraction of the bank account who gets credited as "Music Produced by" or "Additional Music By". 

 

Then, all of our heroes, the people whom we admire as artists and composers, did nothing more than just go like "Yep, sounds good but maybe needs some more violas" to their assistants after listening to (some of) their cues.

[Faleel 5,359]

25 minutes ago, Edmilson said:

This is one of my nightmares regarding film music: the fact that the person who, according to the movie's credits, is the composer, did nothing but "networking" with producers, directors, etc. to get some basic input on how the music should sound and the actual composing was done by some unknown half their age and with a fraction of the bank account who gets credited as "Music Produced by" or "Additional Music By". 

 

Then, all of our heroes, the people whom we admire as artists and composers, did nothing more than just go like "Yep, sounds good but maybe needs some more violas" to their assistants after listening to (some of) their cues.

Yeah, all of our heroes do the hard part, while the assistants do the easy stuff.

 

 

 

[Bespin 8,484]

22 hours ago, karelm said:

 

Alan Silvestri once said the five most important skills for being a professional film composer are delivering on time, delivering on budget, delivering to technical requirements (7.1 vs 5.1, 48hz vs 96hz, 16 bit vs 24 bit, ProTools vs WAV, etc), timely revising when needed, and generally collaborative team player (supporting the director's vision and needs).  He made a point that music quality wasn't one of them.  If you write the best music ever heard but always miss your deadlines, you'll not make it as a professional film composer.  Very, very few composers get the budgets to work like this where they get enough time to record what they want.  The challenges are the film is always changing and sometimes the filmmakers will just edit the existing music producing poor music results.  This is very problematic in thematic scores where a note is cut out or the theme chopped.  So ideally, the composer would revise and maybe get a chance to edit it.  Sometimes you don't know what was changed but what used to sync up no longer does.  After umpteenth revisions of the same scene, other work piling on from perhaps other projects, schedule dragging and maybe the composer feeling the first version was the best and each revision is weaking it, it can certainly drive the composer crazy.  Having a large staff can help soften this since they can delegate work to people, but the hired composer is still ultimately the one on the hook.

 

There are some composers who want to record several versions of the same cue with options such as cued instruments omitted in one take and playing in the other.  This is to have options if the director says they're just not feeling the cue works in the sound dub, the composer can say how about this alternative, but this obviously increases the budget for the scoring, performance, and mixing.  But having this option gives the composer an added sense of security that they're covered if feedback comes back later.  It isn't unusual these days to do stripes (recording sections at a time rather than full ensembles at once) which also allows more options in post.  What we're seeing is directors are piecing together a score with pieces but gives them more flexibility in the film than the composer being one of the story tellers with their own point of view.

 

I don't see any problem in Alan Silvestri's very clear assessment of his profession. I've always said: you write beautiful stories, write books; you know how to direct actors well, become a theater director; you take beautiful photos, become a photographer... and yes, you write beautiful music, compose for your music to be played by grand soloists and orchestras in front of an audience. Making a film, doing cinema, requires bringing together people who have multiple talents but ultimately have the desire to work together to create something bigger that combines various artistic talents.

 

That's cinema.

 

And when a movie succeeds, it's thanks to a successful combination of several artistic aspects; teamwork is crucial.

 

And yes, there's a conductor, the director... there must be a conductor.

[bollemanneke 3,349]

Is it me, or can you not do an exact search in Windows 11 folders? For instance: I want to search folders that have (Williams) in them, but not Williams. How do I tell Windows to only look for that exact phrase? Quotation marks don't work, content: does not work.

[Faleel 5,359]

14 hours ago, bollemanneke said:

Is it me, or can you not do an exact search in Windows 11 folders? For instance: I want to search folders that have (Williams) in them, but not Williams. How do I tell Windows to only look for that exact phrase? Quotation marks don't work, content: does not work.

Try: ~="(Williams)"

 

[bollemanneke 3,349]

That returns nothing.

[Mr. Hooper 1,794]

Quick question:

 

This year at Tanglewood I got to observe John Williams conducting up-close, and noticed him repeatedly shaking his left hand—palm facing down—towards the left side of the orchestra. Can anyone tell me what he was directing the musicians to do?

[Bespin 8,484]

Isn't it a signal to adjust the volume of the orchestra?

 

[Mr. Hooper 1,794]

I thought maybe that was it too, but it didn't look like that...

It was more a quick and loose shaking of his hand with the fingers curled inward. I thought it might mean something else.

[Marian Schedenig 8,207]

[Mr. Hooper 1,794]

2 hours ago, Marian Schedenig said:

Yes, more like that—but not exactly. Try again. 

[Groovygoth666 670]

Was it similar to this - 

[Mr. Hooper 1,794]

He wasn't wagging his index finger, and shook his (left) hand more up and down.

 

26 minutes ago, Groovygoth666 said:

Was it similar to this - 

 

If I'm not mistaken, he tends to wag his finger like this at the end of a piece, to tell the orchestra to hold the last note longer. But the gesture I'm wondering about was being done in the middle of the pieces.

[karelm 2,914]

On 08/12/2023 at 11:57 AM, Mr. Hooper said:

Quick question:

 

This year at Tanglewood I got to observe John Williams conducting up-close, and noticed him repeatedly shaking his left hand—palm facing down—towards the left side of the orchestra. Can anyone tell me what he was directing the musicians to do?

He's probably just telling them molto vibrato.  This was something that ended quietly, right, so hold the vibrato as the note fades type of thing.  At a basic level, conductors need to keep everyone on the same beat.  In an advanced orchestra like this, they don't need to do that (or at least not often) and focus almost purely on the musical interpretation rather than keeping time.  At this level, the orchestra is all listening to each other very closely and even self balancing.  Most conductors get in the way if they don't add something additional to the interpretation.  He's most likely just eliminated all the non-essential direction and staying out of their way so we're just left with him sort of saying keep that vibrato going as we fade.

[Nick1Ø66 4,718]

Quick question: Does anyone know the phone number for Quickbooks Pro? I have some personal financial information to give them.

 

EDIT: Never mind, found it!