Intrada Will Release Poledouris' Conan The Barbarian and Conan The Destroyer

[Dean1700 4]

I've come across a whisper of a complete Poledouris Conan release by Intrada for later this year. Now that would be nice.

Has anyone heard any whispers or hints of this at all?

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,415]

Source? Link?

[Koray Savas 2,254]

We already got one.

[Wojo 2,456]

No we don't. We have a complete re-recording, which angered a lot of audiophiles who found much to complain about. I've been listening to it since last night, and it's probably my favorite release of 2010.

If Intrada's going to enter the market on Conan scores, they would have either found previously unknown masters of the original recording of the complete Conan the Barbarian score...

...or they would be releasing a complete Conan the Destroyer score. Dean1700 wasn't specific.

Ok, now you changed the subject.

[Dean1700 4]

The source come through IMDB (yes, I can hear you all groan) on the CTB page where the poster stated he attended Monsterpalooza in Burbank, Ca and quote "the word is out that the complete ORIGINAL recording tapes for the 1982 "Conan" have been found (I didn't know they were lost?), and that they are being remastered for a release towards the end of the year, by Entrada music!" end quote.

I probably shouldn't have started this thread as I don't like spreading unfoundered rumours.

[Luke Skywalker 1,939]

In the varese liner notes they say that the master tapes were damaged beyong usuability for release. In fact Poledouris wanted to release more cues with varese but they could not use it due to the damage.

[Dean1700 4]

But how many times did we hear the story of the BTTF tapes being lost in the fires at Universal studios and yet we have a complete release of it.

[Ollie 1,136]

Every once and awhile the labels will give cryptic responses / hints that make you wonder what they are working on.

A while back Doug Fake had suggested the tapes for Conan may not be in such a bad condition. Roger mentioned on the message board that they hoped to put a certain rumor to rest about a particular score.

A recent comment by Doug also suggests they are working towards releasing the scores to the Psycho films as well.

With the recent progress made with the studios, more material is surfacing, better sources are being found, so who knows.

[Andy 5,152]

I really hope it's true. I'm usually partial to the original recordings over re-recordings, and I've held off buying the Prometheus set.

[Wojo 2,456]

The re-recording is sufficient for me.

[Joe Brausam 218]

The re-recording is sufficient for me.

Same here, the original performance of this doesn't thrill me, I'm very happy with the Prague recording.

That being said, if they did release the original recording I'd probably buy it.

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,415]

I love the rerecording, but there is no way in hell i would not buy a complete original score.

[Charlie Brigden 7]

I love the rerecording, but there is no way in hell i would not buy a complete original score.

[Trent B 340]

Even if a re-recording is practically spot on to the original score, it still doesn't have the feel of the original recording. I'm with Steef on this one.

[Joe Brausam 218]

I think that has more to do with your personal view on how a score "feels" than the actual truth of the matter.

Take the classical music scene for example, pieces are constantly being rerecorded. There is no "original recording". So are we saying that nothing can compare to the first recording of Beethoven's 9th? It's all the same, its just a silly viewpoint that the original film recording is definitive.

[Romão 2,319]

I have never understood this view that "original recordings reign supreme"

[Henry B 51]

I think that the original recording of Conan is great. So the orchestra couldn't sight read as well as the Vienna Philharmonic, or supply all the percussion instruments Poledouris requested. They still played with spirit, and the recording brings out the best. The woodwinds especially are so ethereal. The Tadlow recording is completely polished and professional (except for the clipping...), but I'm not sure it has as much heart.

[Andy 5,152]

I have never understood this view that "original recordings reign supreme"

I dunno. It's just my preference. It's the original. It came first, and it's what I'm used to. Anything following doesn't sound quite right, and will always be compared to original. It's also got the composer doing conducting, so many of their intentions are reflected in the recording.

If Doc Brown were to step out of the Delorean with original recordings of Mozart and Beethoven conducting their works, don't you think those would "reign supreme"? Wouldn't they be the standard against which all other recordings are measured, even if the 18th century orchestra had some less polished nuances?

I fell in love with the original 1981 recording of Conan. It never sounded lacking to my ears, and needs no plastic surgery as far as I'm concerned.

[Ollie 1,136]

When it comes to film music I'm always open to good re-recordings, but I have yet to encounter one that perfectly captures the original. A bunch have come close but the original recordings are always the best.

And I know it's impossible to do a recording that is 100% faithful and captures the spirit, emotion and heart, as Henry correctly states. I don't know if I'm open to idea of film music having different interpretations like classical music.

While I separate it from the film and listen to it as a stand alone experience, I do keep in mind that it was written with a purpose, to cover a specific moment.

However, there have been some damn fine recordings done, McNeely's Herrmann recordings for Varese, William Stromberg & John Morgan's works for Naxos / Marco Polo and now their own Tribute label. Bruce Broughton's excellent work for Intrada, Jason and The Argonauts is superb.

And Tadlow has really upped the stakes with the excellent work they are doing.

[Romão 2,319]

I have never understood this view that "original recordings reign supreme"

I dunno. It's just my preference. It's the original. It came first, and it's what I'm used to. Anything following doesn't sound quite right, and will always be compared to original. It's also got the composer doing conducting, so many of their intentions are reflected in the recording.

If Doc Brown were to step out of the Delorean with original recordings of Mozart and Beethoven conducting their works, don't you think those would "reign supreme"? Wouldn't they be the standard against which all other recordings are measured, even if the 18th century orchestra had some less polished nuances?

I fell in love with the original 1981 recording of Conan. It never sounded lacking to my ears, and needs no plastic surgery as far as I'm concerned.

But original recordings, specially in the case of film music, are quite often undermined by tight schedules, very little rehearsing time and adjustments that have to be made on the spot in order for the music to fit the film, which does not always do the music any favors, and, specially with old scores, the sound quality is often not perfect. Mind you, I'm not saying an original recording cannot be the definitive interpretation of a given work, but I don't agree the composer conducted version is more legimate than any other. True, one can argue the composer's intentions shine through more clearly when he himself is conducting, but quite often these guys are much better composers than conductors (as a matter of personal taste, I was never fond of Herrmann conducted recordings, except the ones he did for Decca with suites from his scores)and even more often they are unsatisfied with the somewhat rushed job in recording the score in the first time. How many scores did Goldsmith himself re-record?

The only thing that original recordings have that cannot be replicated is that they are frequently the first exposure one has with the music and that can create a strong emotional attachment to it. But the same thing would happen if our first exposure to the score was a re-recording.

[Wojo 2,456]

I think that has more to do with your personal view on how a score "feels" than the actual truth of the matter.

Take the classical music scene for example, pieces are constantly being rerecorded. There is no "original recording". So are we saying that nothing can compare to the first recording of Beethoven's 9th? It's all the same, its just a silly viewpoint that the original film recording is definitive.

This is valid.

But one could also argue that were you to take an original rock, pop, or country song, and have another artist re-record it, that it is not the same.

Now I know there is a huge difference between original songs and their covers, since the covering artist weaves their own style into the song. Just compare CCR's "Heard It Through the Grapevine" to Marvin Gaye's, or Van Halen's "Pretty Woman" to Roy Orbison's original.

The people re-recording a film score either decidedly try to recapture the feel and sound of the original for archival purposes (Tadlow, Naxos, Tribute, et al), or change it and make it their own (like how Charles Gerhardt's Star Wars differ from the originals).

[Marian Schedenig 9,042]

But one could also argue that were you to take an original rock, pop, or country song, and have another artist re-record it, that it is not the same.

It isn't. It could be better, or worse, or just different. It's a fact that most re-recordings of film music can't compare to the original, because that was typically recorded in the US (with the best sight readers in the world) under supervision by the composer and with an adequate budget, whereas many re-recordings have to deal with insufficient funding, resulting in under-rehearsed orchestras, and conductors who typically aren't as acquainted with the score as they would be with a Beethoven symphony they've studied for 30 years.

But "most" doesn't mean "all".

[Uni 306]

Take the classical music scene for example, pieces are constantly being rerecorded. There is no "original recording". So are we saying that nothing can compare to the first recording of Beethoven's 9th? It's all the same, its just a silly viewpoint that the original film recording is definitive.

Silly to you perhaps. Not necessarily to everyone.

A similar conversation's going on over on the "Holy Grail" thread. Let's use a different illustration here. Many people in America have a photocopy of the U.S. Constitution. Some are facsimiles of the actual document itself, others are retyped and reformatted. But what if you had the chance to own the original document--the actual piece of paper signed by that original Congress. It would be infinitely more valuable to you, yes? But why? It wouldn't say anything different than the copied versions. It's exactly the same document. It's the ideas behind the words that are important. But there's intrinsic value in an original. We're just funny about things like that. (Speaking toward your own example: do you think there's a conductor alive, even if they've conducted Beethoven's 9th half a thousand times in their life, who wouldn't leap at the miraculous chance to hear a recording of Beethoven himself conducting an orchestra in his day? Please.)

I can say I definitely have a distinctive experience when I'm listening to an original recording as opposed to a re-recording of a piece of music. The notes are all the same, the arrangement's pretty much spot-on . . . but as I'm listening to the original, I know (and can see in my mind) that John Williams, or Jerry Goldsmith, or Basil Polodouris is standing before this group of musicians, leading them, molding their music, giving life to their unified harmonies. It's probably not the first take I'm hearing, either--they've spent some time rehearsing, adjusting, starting and stopping and correcting in order to fashion it exactly the way the composer/conductor wants it to sound. It's their vision at work, and (in most cases) it's the first time even the composer has heard it played to full effect. There's just something special about that.

You're right in that it's mostly a mental disctinction. But to say that distinction doesn't have any value whatsoever just because you don't see the value in it . . . well, from my perspective, I'd have to say that's the sillier viewpoint.

- Uni

[Koray Savas 2,254]

But one could also argue that were you to take an original rock, pop, or country song, and have another artist re-record it, that it is not the same.

It isn't. It could be better, or worse, or just different.

A bit off-topic, but I only appreciate covers that try to be different. The worst thing you can do is just perform the same song with a different band. Changing the instrumentation and pace can do wonders. My two favorite covers do exactly that, and I like them more than the originals:

[Jacob 0]

The only thing that original recordings have that cannot be replicated is that they are frequently the first exposure one has with the music and that can create a strong emotional attachment to it. But the same thing would happen if our first exposure to the score was a re-recording.

I'm that way with Patton.

I grew up with the RSO re-recording, and I was naturally excited for Intrada's release of the original.

But I was surprised and disappointed at how underwhelmed I was after listening to the samples.

To me, the original recording is the one that just doesn't sound right in this case.

[tharpdevenport 4]

A month or two ago, commenting on the re-recording (suffice to say I don't have good words) at the Intrada forum, I said what I honestly felt (summerized):

I have lost all hope for the complete, original score; some tapes were reported dmanaged even (as I recall) from Basil's own copies, and with a re-recording out, the chances of the original score surfacing, just went almost completely bye-bye.

Roger then told me something like, "Don't be so sure".

I hope the rumor is true, and I will take it that IT IS, and thusly when work comes in, I will start saving up coming to buy it, assuming -- with shipping -- it will be $25.00 to $30.00.

[Doo_liss 6,423]

The only thing that original recordings have that cannot be replicated is that they are frequently the first exposure one has with the music and that can create a strong emotional attachment to it. But the same thing would happen if our first exposure to the score was a re-recording.

I'm that way with Patton.

I grew up with the RSO re-recording, and I was naturally excited for Intrada's release of the original.

But I was surprised and disappointed at how underwhelmed I was after listening to the samples.

To me, the original recording is the one that just doesn't sound right in this case.

I am that way with The Ten Commandments though my opinion could change if the original recording is remastered/restored

[Ollie 1,136]

Okay, I know rumors started on this. Not sure where it started (AICN perhaps?), but given the number of requests we get for clarity, I thought I would do one posting for my own sanity. Yes, we are restoring and releasing both CONAN THE BARBARIAN and CONAN THE DESTROYER. Yes, the rumors that the masters were missing were false. They were there...24-track and 4-track units in pristine condition and complete, sitting right where we expected them to be at Universal. We transferred everything...the sound is stunning. Simply stunning. Going back to the 24-track is going to reveal a detail and ferocity on both scores you just haven't heard before. Basil often went for a muscular, powerhouse over the top performance to match unrivaled visuals and got it in a way no big orchestral score had quite achieved up to that point. Remember the feeling when you heard these scores for the first time? You'll feel it again! Fans of these scores should be ready to have their socks knocked off.

http://www.intrada.n....php?f=4&t=4297

Oh My!!!!!!!!!

[ManofDestiny 82]

Wow, after we Already have a nice re-record?

I know it's a must have. But I wonder which version I will listen to for more times.

[Jay 39,428]

Okay, I know rumors started on this. Not sure where it started (AICN perhaps?), but given the number of requests we get for clarity, I thought I would do one posting for my own sanity. Yes, we are restoring and releasing both CONAN THE BARBARIAN and CONAN THE DESTROYER. Yes, the rumors that the masters were missing were false. They were there...24-track and 4-track units in pristine condition and complete, sitting right where we expected them to be at Universal. We transferred everything...the sound is stunning. Simply stunning. Going back to the 24-track is going to reveal a detail and ferocity on both scores you just haven't heard before. Basil often went for a muscular, powerhouse over the top performance to match unrivaled visuals and got it in a way no big orchestral score had quite achieved up to that point. Remember the feeling when you heard these scores for the first time? You'll feel it again! Fans of these scores should be ready to have their socks knocked off.

Wow. I had no idea there were recent rumors of these coming out. I mean, they've been rumored kinda loosely forever. Dunno what recent AICN stuff Roger is referring to though

I wonder if Tadlow will go through with their plans to re-record The Destroyer?

[Hlao-roo 389]

I love Poledouris but am not a completist -- not sure how keen I am on picking up Destroyer, which is not a particularly robust score on the whole based on what I've heard.

Barbarian is probably a must buy, though, despite the itch having been scratched somewhat by the re-recording.

[Koray Savas 2,254]

I don't see why not. Poledouris wasn't pleased with his recording of Destroyer. Didn't they say the rerecording will be done more to what his original intent was?

[Jay 39,428]

There was fan speculation that they would; I don't think Tadlow themselves have even officially confirmed it let alone commented on it.

[Romão 2,319]

I'll get Barbarian, but I'll opt for the Destroyer re-recording instead. Poledouris was right, it sounds awfull, but I'm sure there will be purists that consider the film version the definitive version for reasons that still elude me

[Ollie 1,136]

There was fan speculation that they would; I don't think Tadlow themselves have even officially confirmed it let alone commented on it.

Here's the discussion at FSM with comments from Mr. Fitzpatrick regarding Destroyer.

http://www.filmscore...mID=1&archive=0

I'll get Barbarian, but I'll opt for the Destroyer re-recording instead. Poledouris was right, it sounds awfull, but I'm sure there will be purists that consider the film version the definitive version for reasons that still elude me

Regardless of quality the film versions will always be the definitive ones because they were recorded with the film. That being said it doesn't mean you can't enjoy both. I will be buying the recording and Intrada's remastered version.

[Wojo 2,456]

I don't think I'll buy either. The Tadlow is enough for me, and I shall await their re-recording of Destroyer with mild, subdued, almost backburner anticipation.

[Jay 39,428]

There was fan speculation that they would; I don't think Tadlow themselves have even officially confirmed it let alone commented on it.

Here's the discussion at FSM with comments from Mr. Fitzpatrick regarding Destroyer.

http://www.filmscore...mID=1&archive=0

Ah yes, I remember now. Here's the most important post from Mr. FItzpatrick:

No dates as yet....but now having gone through the complete newly prepared score with a toothcomb today and compared it against the performances on the original album and the double CD bootleg cd it amazes me that

1. How many wrong notes where on Basil original scores

2. How so few of them were corrected on the Italian sessions

3. How bad generally the orchestra was but in particular the woodwind who fluffed many a solo ... plus the brass splits and poor string intonation.

4. Because Basil was only given a relatively small string section of 36 for such a large score, a good deal of the time 2 synths doubled the strings lines. (the new recording will have 54 string)

5. These 2 synths also often played (or failed to play) the Cimbalom, Harpsichord, Tuba and Bass lines...

6. Quite a bit of the percussion listed on each cue seems to have either been taceted or missed their entries or came in early

7. Some cues the 2 harps obviously could not play what was written

8. And finally, the Main Title as composed was never performed correctly ... so the main titles, end credits etc.. are edits of different cues

No Wonder Basil was so Unhappy!!! I am sure we can do a bit better for him and for his family who are supporting this venture

Sounds like it will be considerably different than what Intrada will be offering as far as Destroyer goes.

[Demondm810 413]

Holy. Shit.

I was just thinking about these today while watching the new Barbarian blu-ray. I like the re-recording ok, but it's about to be obsolete...

[Ollie 1,136]

Anyone want my two Varese CDs for a reasonable price?

[Romão 2,319]

Not many scores have subject of 4 releases, 3 for the original soundtrack and one full re-recording.

[Jay 39,428]

Even more if you count the bootlegs!

[Demondm810 413]

Anyone want my two Varese CDs for a reasonable price?

Yes PM me!

[Wojo 2,456]

I like the re-recording ok, but it's about to be obsolete...

Don't you listen to classical music?

Talk like that makes me sad. Were Charles Gerhardt's re-recordings of Star Wars "obsolete" the day the Anthology or Special Edition soundtracks were released?

[Hlao-roo 389]

Were Charles Gerhardt's re-recordings of Star Wars "obsolete" the day the Anthology or Special Edition soundtracks were released?

Absolutely. People who say otherwise are uncivilized.

[Matt C 468]

That's nice for people clamoring for a remastered original release. Yet the original performances by the Italian orchestra leave somewhat to be desired -- like the opening percussion and underpowered French horns in "Prologue/Anvil of Crom". There's so many flubs with the performance that it distracts me, especially the underpowered timpani closing out "The Awakening".

I really think the pristine remixes will just make these flubs more prominent. For me, the Prague re-recording gets the nuance and timing of Basil's music right. It also nails the same rawness the original sessions did so well -- without sounding amateurish.

[Demondm810 413]

I may like it more if there wasn't clipping.

[ManofDestiny 82]

Well, at least now we know the original and the new recording will sounds very different.

[King Mark 3,713]

I never "got" what's so great about Conan the Barbarian

[Incanus 5,801]

I never "got" what's so great about Conan the Barbarian

You are obviously not a Poledouris man. I actually learned to appreciate the score more through the recent re-recording. I was not a huge fan of the film or the score so I had no complaints about the re-recording whatsoever.

People who love these scores are truly pampered now. To get re-recording and the actual scores in about a year's time is pretty nice.

[scallenger 558]

Wow! I for one am very excited. Even moreso for "Destroyer" since it had a lame OST, imo. Needed more cues.