Luke Skywalker 1,795 Posted April 15, 2014 Share Posted April 15, 2014 i heard the ominous music preceding ''dark side beckons'' and some "chairman's waltz" while listening to the score the other day. Jediwashington 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonesy 55 Posted April 15, 2014 Share Posted April 15, 2014 I heard the carnivore motif in Appolini's Decision. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Koray Savas 2,251 Posted April 16, 2014 Share Posted April 16, 2014 it's a procession of priests in a cathedral, near the end the Christopher Reeve character get shocked by something he seesThis Gloria chick must be really ugly. Marian Schedenig and Omen II 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
filmmusic 1,829 Posted May 26, 2018 Share Posted May 26, 2018 we haven't talked about this score and its themes much. I was trying to identify more themes than the 3 (monsignor waltz, gloria, italy scherzo).. Maybe a religous theme in the "Audience with the Holy father" (the one starting with parallel harmony), but still it's not very clear. (edit: starting at 1:36'') Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thor 7,504 Posted May 26, 2018 Share Posted May 26, 2018 The score is great for what it is (for a bad movie), but curiously absent of Williams' trademark religious/pastoral sound, given the subject matter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Naïve Old Fart 9,528 Posted May 26, 2018 Share Posted May 26, 2018 The film is a about a man who has to disguise his faith - to lie - and, as such, "religious" music would be inappropriate. The music reflects Father Flaherty's inner struggle, and it supports it well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thor 7,504 Posted May 26, 2018 Share Posted May 26, 2018 2 hours ago, Richard said: The film is a about a man who has to disguise his faith - to lie - and, as such, "religious" music would be inappropriate. The music reflects Father Flaherty's inner struggle, and it supports it well. Yes, there's that. There's also -- if I remember the plot correctly (it's been years since I saw it last) -- the fact that it's mostly about forced political intrigue inside the Vatican, so again not something that perhaps calls for the type of glorious Williams pastorality/religiousity á la "Angela's Prayer" from ANGELA'S ASHES. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Naïve Old Fart 9,528 Posted May 26, 2018 Share Posted May 26, 2018 Yes. Any "religious", is "spiritual" music, would sound hypocritical, within the context of the film, rather like (some would argue) the organisation that it portrays. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Nick Parker 3,040 Posted May 26, 2018 Popular Post Share Posted May 26, 2018 True story: I bought this CD about ten years ago when I was in high school, and was listening to it on the school bus one day when a stoner kid sat down next to me. Even through my headphones I could hear thrashing music blaring out of his earbuds. He looked me and asked what I was listening to. I gave my headphones to him and played track 10, which begins with that beautiful piano solo. The kid absolutely loved it, and from that day we became very good acquaintances throughout the rest of high school. John Williams talks about the surprise of people still going to concerts to listen to Star Wars, but he never talks about random high school kids becoming friends over a Razzie nominated score! Marian Schedenig, Ricard, Once and 10 others 13 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gruesome Son of a Bitch 6,488 Posted May 27, 2018 Share Posted May 27, 2018 It's one of his worst scores from an era when he could do no wrong. Eslanade Overture doesn't count because it's repurposed, but it's obviously the highlight. Ricard 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
publicist 4,643 Posted May 27, 2018 Share Posted May 27, 2018 'Worst'? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
artguy360 1,843 Posted May 27, 2018 Share Posted May 27, 2018 I am not a fan of the main theme at all. It's an odd piece of music that sounds nearly comical and yet builds in tension in a kind of disjointed way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Parker 3,040 Posted May 27, 2018 Share Posted May 27, 2018 Hey, a dude's alright when stuff like this is on his worst! 2 minutes ago, artguy360 said: I am not a fan of the main theme at all. It's an odd piece of music that sounds nearly comical and yet builds in tension in a kind of disjointed way. The main theme actually reminds me as a cousin of stuff like The Fury and Seven Years in Tibet, interesting that you find it funny. Is it the harpsichord thing at the beginning? It has a little Italian flair to me. SteveMc and Jurassic Shark 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
artguy360 1,843 Posted May 27, 2018 Share Posted May 27, 2018 Yeah I think it is an attempt at Italian styling done poorly. The the textural distance between the trumpet and harpsichord is also kind of comedic as well. In the string writing I do hear the more familiar signatures of JW's dark, moody, drama writing but just not as successful. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
publicist 4,643 Posted May 27, 2018 Share Posted May 27, 2018 It's a fucking and bleedingly obvious riff on 'The Godfather' (which can be read 'comical', too, of course). But as a tune, it's good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
filmmusic 1,829 Posted May 27, 2018 Share Posted May 27, 2018 I don't understand why people say it's a copy of the Godfather. Other than a trumpet in waltz rhythm, I don' see any other connection, either in melody or harmony. Anyway, I love the theme. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
publicist 4,643 Posted May 27, 2018 Share Posted May 27, 2018 Because it obviously is modeled on exactly that piece. Williams wrote on of his more shifty drama themes and set it exactly like the Rota tune (Godfather Waltz). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
filmmusic 1,829 Posted May 27, 2018 Share Posted May 27, 2018 15 hours ago, Richard said: Yes. Any "religious", is "spiritual" music, would sound hypocritical, within the context of the film, rather like (some would argue) the organisation that it portrays. On the contrary, I think there is religous music in the score. The whole Audience with the Holy Father track, and especially a motif that i identified as the religious theme. top voice at 0.36-0.48 and flute at 1.10-1.23. And that opening motif of the theme emerges some more times in the track. Also we have the instrumental version of the Gloria in Santoni's Confession: 1.24-.... SteveMc and Ricard 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brundlefly 2,385 Posted May 27, 2018 Share Posted May 27, 2018 Sounds interesting. I will buy it when Intrada re-releases it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bespin 8,482 Posted May 27, 2018 Share Posted May 27, 2018 That album was a great addition to my collection. Of course the movie did'nt have the expected impact, nor the score. I think Williams wrote it in a period where he was particularly busy. But yet, this is a score to discover, altought it may now appears, many many many years later, like an anachronism in the career of JW. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted May 27, 2018 Share Posted May 27, 2018 Williams was robbed of the Razzie! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TownerFan 4,983 Posted May 27, 2018 Share Posted May 27, 2018 There is indeed some religioso writing in a few cues, such as "Audience with the Holy Father" and "Santoni's Compassion". Some of those gestures were also used in the "Death of Yoda" cue in ROTJ a year later. Also, the motif in "Santoni's Compassion" which develops from the Gloria material always reminded me a bit of Andre Previn's Four Horsemen of the Apocalypse main theme. Ricard 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thor 7,504 Posted May 28, 2018 Share Posted May 28, 2018 Not the type of Ralph Vaughan Williams/pastoral-type religioso writing I had in mind, and which Williams is so brilliant at. There's nothing of that in this score. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bespin 8,482 Posted May 28, 2018 Share Posted May 28, 2018 The mix of the OST was done quick too. It may be a good candidate for an "expansion", or at least just a new mix from the original material. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TownerFan 4,983 Posted May 28, 2018 Share Posted May 28, 2018 4 hours ago, Thor said: Not the type of Ralph Vaughan Williams/pastoral-type religioso writing I had in mind, and which Williams is so brilliant at. There's nothing of that in this score. There is some "Tallis Fantasia"-like string writing in "At the Forum" (which is an arrangement done just for the OST album, it doesn't appear in the movie). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thor 7,504 Posted May 28, 2018 Share Posted May 28, 2018 More of a mysterioso waltz piece, I'd say. Not really psalm-like chord structures. But despite the absence of this particular sound, it's still a fine, romantic score. Nothing "Razzie" about it, as previously mentioned by someone, even if the film itself is mediocre. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TownerFan 4,983 Posted May 28, 2018 Share Posted May 28, 2018 I agree. It's somehow a strange and obscure element in JW's filmography, mostly because it's sandwiched between huge popular hits like Raiders of the Lost Ark, E.T. and the Star Wars series, but it bears the same greatness and profound operatic tones of his works from those years, in pure musical terms. 5 hours ago, Bespin said: The mix of the OST was done quick too. It may be a good candidate for an "expansion", or at least just a new mix from the original material. The OST sounds fine in Intrada's remastering, at least to my ears. The score is virtually complete, it only misses a couple of short cues. One of them is actually featured in this promotional clip for the DVD release: thx99 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gruesome Son of a Bitch 6,488 Posted May 28, 2018 Share Posted May 28, 2018 I thought this movie was only available on VHS recording of a TV broadcast at 3 AM from 1987? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Parker 3,040 Posted May 29, 2018 Share Posted May 29, 2018 Me too, actually. Guess they wqnted to appease someone who was a Christpoher Reeve fan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Naïve Old Fart 9,528 Posted May 30, 2018 Share Posted May 30, 2018 There's some nice unreleased music, in that clip. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveMc 2,674 Posted May 30, 2018 Share Posted May 30, 2018 On 5/26/2018 at 8:53 PM, Batman's Diet Coke said: It's one of his worst scores from an era when he could do no wrong. Eslanade Overture doesn't count because it's repurposed, but it's obviously the highlight. Gloria is the highlight of the score, which to me is quite good. Does anyone think that, given the short period of time Williams reportedly had to write the score, that pieces like Gloria may have already existed in Williams' mind or in sketches before he started the project. It would not surprise me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jediwashington 59 Posted June 2, 2018 Share Posted June 2, 2018 On 4/15/2014 at 5:52 PM, Luke Skywalker said: i heard the ominous music preceding ''dark side beckons'' and some "chairman's waltz" while listening to the score the other day. Definitely "Chairman's Waltz." Uses a lot of the same melodic chromatic alterations and chord progressions. Maybe a little slower, but I hear it as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fommes 153 Posted June 3, 2018 Share Posted June 3, 2018 Wow, I thought Intrada said the short cues missing weren't really worth it, but that's a great unreleased cue. I want the complete score now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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