Richard Penna 3,692 Posted January 2, 2008 Share Posted January 2, 2008 I haven't listened to any of the DVDs either - I don't have the equipment to listen to the advanced resolution. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
indy4 155 Posted January 2, 2008 Share Posted January 2, 2008 I just finished listening to the ROTK CR. Wow. Absolutley amazing. It starts out very strong, with two brilliant opening tracks. The middle is a bit shaky for me, with mainly very good tracks but still a bit of dead music scattered here and there. But once you get to the third disc, you're in for a real treat. I like every single track on discs 3-4, which is incredibly rare for me. The action music is superb, almost all of the important themes get loud, bold, or impacting variations. The Battle of Pelenor Fields is amazing, especially in the beggining when Theoden comes. Then there's the climax--the destruction of the Ring. Amazing! The choir really shines here, the beauty, horror, and triumph is all emphasiazed. Then there is the resolution. Tender strings, almost equivalent to Hand of Fate Part 2 play, along with a new dose of the beloved Shire music. In the end, I felt more than satisfied. It is a wonderful ending to a wonderful trilogy. It took 189 tracks, 13.4 hours, and 750.7 MB, but Shore's "The Lord of the Rings Trilogy" is finally complete. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aj_vader 534 Posted January 2, 2008 Share Posted January 2, 2008 I just finished listening to the ROTK CR. Wow. Absolutley amazing. It starts out very strong, with two brilliant opening tracks. The middle is a bit shaky for me, with mainly very good tracks but still a bit of dead music scattered here and there. But once you get to the third disc, you're in for a real treat. I like every single track on discs 3-4, which is incredibly rare for me. The action music is superb, almost all of the important themes get loud, bold, or impacting variations. The Battle of Pelenor Fields is amazing, especially in the beggining when Theoden comes. Then there's the climax--the destruction of the Ring. Amazing! The choir really shines here, the beauty, horror, and triumph is all emphasiazed. Then there is the resolution. Tender strings, almost equivalent to Hand of Fate Part 2 play, along with a new dose of the beloved Shire music. In the end, I felt more than satisfied. It is a wonderful ending to a wonderful trilogy. It took 189 tracks, 13.4 hours, and 750.7 MB, but Shore's "The Lord of the Rings Trilogy" is finally complete.Another Satisfied Customer! 750.MB? bit small that aint it? Did you listen to it on DVD? its rather spectacular! glad you liked it, im still and think always will be in love with this score! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
indy4 155 Posted January 2, 2008 Share Posted January 2, 2008 I don't really care about sound quality, so I don't care about the DVDs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maglorfin 196 Posted January 2, 2008 Share Posted January 2, 2008 [...] and think always will be in love with this score! Amen to that! The RotK CR are truly magnificent , and the circle is finally complete. Yeah! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Crichton 4 Posted January 3, 2008 Share Posted January 3, 2008 A good amount of my favorite stuff is on Disc 1, if I'm just looking for a quick fix that's what I go for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quintus 5,399 Posted January 8, 2008 Share Posted January 8, 2008 The Mumakil. Wow at that brass, especially that cool as hell wailing of it at 00:34secs! Just wow. The LPO is the new LSO! Damn straight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lordskylark 1 Posted January 10, 2008 Share Posted January 10, 2008 I haven't listened to the ROTK CR yet. But I had a question. On the OST, there is a track that features a motif that was heard only in the movies during the climb up Caradhas. And it was uncertain where this went. Did this appear on the ROTK CR? If so, where was it intended to go?~Andy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Incanus 5,715 Posted January 10, 2008 Share Posted January 10, 2008 I haven't listened to the ROTK CR yet. But I had a question. On the OST, there is a track that features a motif that was heard only in the movies during the climb up Caradhas. And it was uncertain where this went. Did this appear on the ROTK CR? If so, where was it intended to go?~AndyThe motif you are refering to is called Dangerous Passes and it plays twice in the Pass of Cirith Ungol in the RotK score. First when Frodo, Sam and Gollum are leaving the Morgul Vale after witnessing the passing of the Army of Minas Morgul and the second time when Frodo tells Sam to go home and goes on with Gollum to Shelob's Lair. Both statements were left out of the film. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Penna 3,692 Posted January 13, 2008 Share Posted January 13, 2008 Someone on Amazon UK marketplace is trying to flog it as 'rare' for a truly insulting £115 And in a 'used - very good' condition.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Brausam 214 Posted January 13, 2008 Share Posted January 13, 2008 You know - I really enjoy the writing in the first half of The Land of Shadow. There are some REALLY cool things going on in the brass! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Henry B 50 Posted January 20, 2008 Share Posted January 20, 2008 So I noticed "Days of the Ring" has an awkwardly tracked "suite." This is too bad. All that's needed is the original credits music: "Into the West," "Bilbo's Song" and the final coda (which, incidentally, should follow Bilbo's song, not precede it, I think). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luke Skywalker 1,795 Posted January 20, 2008 Share Posted January 20, 2008 shore should have composed those suites, not tracked them Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted January 20, 2008 Share Posted January 20, 2008 I'm sure Shore did not track them.He actually composed End Credit Music, which are on the OST releases. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luke Skywalker 1,795 Posted January 21, 2008 Share Posted January 21, 2008 they should have released just the composed music for the credits in the CR then :/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Incanus 5,715 Posted January 21, 2008 Share Posted January 21, 2008 they should have released just the composed music for the credits in the CR then :/And then somebody would have complained about why weren't the film versions of the end credits on the CRs And I think that the End Credits cut/paste job is the weakest spot on the CRs. But then again it is as the music was presented in the films so we just have to live with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luke Skywalker 1,795 Posted January 21, 2008 Share Posted January 21, 2008 they should have released just the composed music for the credits in the CR then :/And then somebody would have complained about why weren't the film versions of the end credits on the CRs And I think that the End Credits cut/paste job is the weakest spot on the CRs. But then again it is as the music was presented in the films so we just have to live with it.Dont people complain becasue the complete EE end credits are not present in the CR?So they still complain in the end... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Breathmask 555 Posted January 21, 2008 Share Posted January 21, 2008 Well, seeing how the full end credits on FotR EE run for a good 35 minutes, I really don't think we need all of it... Not the tracked portions, anyway (and the alternate Breaking of the Fellowship will probably be released next year). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Penna 3,692 Posted January 21, 2008 Share Posted January 21, 2008 I've said it before - rip the DVD - all 3 in CD quality. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie Brigden 7 Posted May 20, 2008 Share Posted May 20, 2008 I have a question which could be me talking rubbish or not.In "For Frodo" on the ROTK CR, after the quiet initial statement of the Fellowship Theme, the grand following statement of the theme is combined with the choir immediately as it begins, but I remember it from the film (and the audio rip I did of it) as the first part of the theme (dah-duh-dah-dah-dah) being orchestral, with the choir kicking in after that point as the Hobbits et al follow Aragorn towards the Black Gate. Is this right, or is my memory being tricksy and false? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Penna 3,692 Posted May 20, 2008 Share Posted May 20, 2008 No, that's right, they just dialled the choir out until the B part of the theme. One of the more pleasant surprises on the CR.The obsessive completist in me wants to rip that tiny bit and make a film version <_< Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kühni 485 Posted April 14, 2016 Share Posted April 14, 2016 And here is the final instalment of my assessments of the CR, this one from March 2008: * * * * * * * * * * Consider yourselves warned, this will be a thousand words long: Well, I have been listening to this lovely set for the past six weeks. Almost daily. There was some other film music in between, but 80% of the time I was listening to stuff from my collection, it was RotK Complete. You are all aware of my love for the LotR trilogy, book, film, and score. This, of course, makes anything I say about it inherently biased, but still...since the journey ends with the RotK set (kinda), a summary of sorts seems appropriate now. First off, this set is, once again, a revelation. While the thrill of the opening chapter, The Fellowship of the Ring, was absent both from T2T and RotK, listening to the music Howard Shore conceived for RotK is almost a religious experience for me (and before anybody accuses me of blasphemy...shove it!). Even after all these years, I still get goose-bumps from the music, get that manic grin some of you know, get teary-eyed etc. And it keeps on being interesting to listen to. Even now I find myself thinking: "Whoa...I haven't noticed this before...", although Doug Adams' exemplary liner notes helped connecting the dots. I know that some of you have problems with the music, for whatever reasons (both valid and no). I probably cannot offer a musicological explanation for why I adore this music (hi, Chris Tilton, you jolly old gasbag!), but I don't think I have to do this anyhow. It's primarily an emotional experience, which is kinda impossible to base on facts or specific details. There are too many whole notes and too much vertical and aleatoric writing for your liking? So what? It still sounds great! The trilogy offers some of the most gorgeous music I've ever heard, just as it offers the most ferocious, exciting, introspective, sorrowful, etc. While Fellowship is and will continue to be my favourite part of the trilogy (partly due to it actually having been novel back in 2001), RotK has much to offer. Whether it be the complete Shelob's lair sequence, the complete Osgiliath sequence, the battle of Pelennor fields ("Shieldmaiden of Rohan"...Oh. My. GOD!), the increasingly desperate music accompanying Frodo and Sam to and through Mordor, or especially the three wall-shaking appearances of the 'Reclamation of Nature' (end of #15, CD 1; #4 and end of #16, CD 3), Shore cranks the music up to ridiculously activity and size and his method of "running themes into each other" to mirror the chaotic action on-screen makes for a marvellous listening experience. With the setting out of the Minas Morgul army (#14 on CD 1), the pulse of the music (and film!) begin beating and never wholly disappears until the climax. Oh, and what a climax it is! Scoregasm material. Unbelievably so. During the 15 minutes from "For Frodo" (#16, CD 3) to "The Eagles" (#3, CD 4), Shore offers a culmination of themes and orchestral and choral power that, for me, is unrivaled in the history of film music. But what makes it even more outstanding, especially in the present climate of "everything must be bigger!", is that this musical zenith comes so naturally and appropriately. The journey of Frodo and Sam led us to Mount Doom, to this single moment of decision, and Shore's music has so perfectly illuminated this journey, and those that have offsprung (?) from it along the way. With the multitude of themes and motifs and their connections, the music informed us both of the action at hand and the bigger, overacing picture. And it never played as contrived or overly showy music. If there's a term for it, I'd say it's "being emotionally truthful". I know that this doesn't really explain anything and/or can be laid out ten different ways, but it's the best description I can come up with. And when it's all said and done, the music is reduced to purity and quietness and "sails away with remarkable grace", as Christian C. once put it. All in all, Shore's music for the entire trilogy is remarkably mature, but never more than in the closing moments of RotK. I remember being very skeptical when I heard back in 2000 that Howard Shore had been signed to do the score for LotR. I remember sitting in the cinema for my first watching of Fellowship on Dec. 21st, 2001 and being spellbound by this spectacle. I remember the slight apprehension at the question whether or not Shore could continue the music at such a high level. I remember the relief, joy and mounting excitement when it became clear that not only did he maintain that level, but actually went higher with the next two parts. (And I remember being absolutely thrilled to have been invited and attending the rehearsal of the first Fellowship concert in London in February of 2003.) I don't think that I will ever hear another score that has been composed, thought-out and performed with so much diligence as the LotR trilogy. Of course, Shore had, unlike Williams with the original Star Wars trilogy, the entire picture in front of him from the beginning and knew how to lay out the path. One day, I hope to be able to listen to the DVDs of the Complete Recordings. After that, I think I can die as a happy man. Unless somebody manages to get The Silmarillion done in as true a way as Peter Jackson & Co. did with LotR, I don't think I will hear something better. And even with all the other LotR fans out there (and over at moviemusic.com), I still get most pleasure out of it by simply sitting in my room with a cup of tea and letting the music engulf me. For over six years (and counting) of sheer musical joy and excitement, I tip my hat to Howard Shore, the London Philharmonic Orchestra and London Voices and everybody else who had something to do with the creation of this magnificent opus. Hannon le! Thanks for reading, CK PS: An irate note of condescension to those woolly-footed peabrains at Warner Music and Reprise Records who, for some fucking inane reason, did not expect the high demand for this release, pressed too few copies, so that I once again I had to ask somebody in the US to arrange for a copy from their personal collection to be sent my way. To that party, I owe unending gratitude! SafeUnderHill 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Faleel 5,350 Posted April 14, 2016 Share Posted April 14, 2016 CK, did you do anything like this for the Rarities disc? I would love to read your early thoughts on that disc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kühni 485 Posted April 14, 2016 Share Posted April 14, 2016 9 minutes ago, Faleel said: CK, did you do anything like this for the Rarities disc? I would love to read your early thoughts on that disc. Good question, I honestly can't remember. It would be weird if I hadn't, however... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amer 2,110 Posted December 31, 2021 Share Posted December 31, 2021 Folks, Need some help. I just dont have the time to really find and explore the huge number of posts here, but can some one having good memory tell me about the break-up of track 3 'Minas Tirith' on the ROTK OST album (which) is basicaly an edited suite of various cues? I need to know the exact breakup of these used cues from the Complete Recordings set ? I have a feeling that some of these on the OST version cue are different alternates. Thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Ware 526 Posted December 31, 2021 Share Posted December 31, 2021 6 hours ago, Amer said: Folks, Need some help. I just dont have the time to really find and explore the huge number of posts here, but can some one having good memory tell me about the break-up of track 3 'Minas Tirith' on the ROTK OST album (which) is basicaly an edited suite of various cues? I need to know the exact breakup of these used cues from the Complete Recordings set ? I have a feeling that some of these on the OST version cue are different alternates. It's actually a cut down version of a single composition (rotk 529 909) - compare with Osgiliath Invaded on the Complete Recordings. The OST and CR are based on the same material. This composition was written when the arrival of Gandalf and Pippin at Minas Tirith coincided with Faramir's retreat from Osgiliath. The reveal of Minas Tirith in the OST track (at 1:37) is the only 'alternate' material on the OST (it's at 6:28 in Osgiliath Invaded). Amer 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amer 2,110 Posted December 31, 2021 Share Posted December 31, 2021 thanks @Jim Ware I was kinda hoping you would respond. So I was correct in assuming that the OST had an alternate version. Jim Ware 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Ware 526 Posted December 31, 2021 Share Posted December 31, 2021 This was one of several sequences scored twice when scenes moved around! The Grace of Undomiel on the CR contains the film version. Amer 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corellian2019 386 Posted July 2, 2023 Share Posted July 2, 2023 Not intimately familiar with this score, but I could have sworn that the "wailing" sound effect heard when Gollum falls into the lava with the ring was part of the score and not sound design. Is there any way to confirm that it is just sound design and not unreleased music left off of the CR and Rarities CD? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chen G. 3,949 Posted July 2, 2023 Share Posted July 2, 2023 Its musical sound design by Plan 9 and David Longe. Its used in quite a few places, so it has a similar kind of mnemonic quality as Shore's leitmotives, and it was achieved with musical instruments on some sort (my bet is, in part, a tin-can Dan Bau that the band had constructed). My own feeling is that its as much a part of the score as "Flaming Red Hair", "The Green Dragon" or "Rock and Pool." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corellian2019 386 Posted July 2, 2023 Share Posted July 2, 2023 9 hours ago, Chen G. said: Its musical sound design by Plan 9 and David Longe. Its used in quite a few places, so it has a similar kind of mnemonic quality as Shore's leitmotives, and it was achieved with musical instruments on some sort (my bet is, in part, a tin-can Dan Bau that the band had constructed). My own feeling is that its as much a part of the score as "Flaming Red Hair", "The Green Dragon" or "Rock and Pool." Thanks for clarifying. Imagine my surprise when I couldn't find that vocal between "Mount Doom" and "The Crack Of Doom". At least "Flaming Red Hair" is on the Fellowship set. Was there ever any leak of this Plan 9 material, even on one of the video games? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chen G. 3,949 Posted July 3, 2023 Share Posted July 3, 2023 11 hours ago, Corellian2019 said: Was there ever any leak of this Plan 9 material, even on one of the video games? Pretty sure you can get it clean off of some of the appendices or something, but I never tried. There's more diegetic stuff we know exists but don't have: Plan 9 and David Longe also wrote a companion piece to "Flaming Red Hair" called "Flowers for Rosie" and Viggo Mortensen composed and recorded one of the alternates for Arwen's Return of the King scenes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A. A. Ron 1,742 Posted July 4, 2023 Share Posted July 4, 2023 Too bad. Now that I know those exist, I want them! Chen G. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Faleel 5,350 Posted July 11, 2023 Share Posted July 11, 2023 On 03/07/2023 at 2:55 AM, Chen G. said: Pretty sure you can get it clean off of some of the appendices or something, but I never tried. There's more diegetic stuff we know exists but don't have: Plan 9 and David Longe also wrote a companion piece to "Flaming Red Hair" called "Flowers for Rosie" and Viggo Mortensen composed and recorded one of the alternates for Arwen's Return of the King scenes. From what I recall, only the isolated choir element from the Shore version of the scene is on the Appendices but it's been forever since I checked Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amer 2,110 Posted July 11, 2023 Share Posted July 11, 2023 Is the Appendices been officially tallied out. I'd like to compare as to what's there and different from their Expanded counterparts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Penna 3,692 Posted July 11, 2023 Share Posted July 11, 2023 FWIW if you have a bit you want that's clear but it has some sort of vocal over it, there's a tool at https://x-minus.pro/ai which does a great job at removing vocals without resorting to fiddling with mono. It can separate choir from orchestra to an extent too. It's primarily designed to get instrumental versions of songs but it did an astonishingly good job with a cue where I wanted to try a different soloist. Certainly, if it's just orchestra and a studio-recorded vocal, you'll probably get it 99% clean. Holko 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Faleel 5,350 Posted July 11, 2023 Share Posted July 11, 2023 Unfortunately there still isn't an AI that can isolate the unreleased Bilbo Vs. The Orc bit in the AUJ Appendices, that is mixed in mono for some reason 15 hours ago, Amer said: Is the Appendices been officially tallied out. I'd like to compare as to what's there and different from their Expanded counterparts. Amer 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amer 2,110 Posted July 12, 2023 Share Posted July 12, 2023 6 hours ago, Signals said: Unfortunately there still isn't an AI that can isolate the unreleased Bilbo Vs. The Orc bit in the AUJ Appendices, that is mixed in mono for some reason Oh THANKS! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bellosh 3,419 Posted July 24, 2023 Share Posted July 24, 2023 Does anyone know if this bit at 2:06-2:47 is a motif or theme of any sort. I don't have Doug Adam's book. I always interpreted it as a 'Sauron winning' motif. That sense of all hope gone. Also probably one of my favorite parts in the entire score. Jay 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Chen G. 3,949 Posted July 24, 2023 Popular Post Share Posted July 24, 2023 3 hours ago, Bellosh said: Does anyone know if this bit at 2:06-2:47 is a motif or theme of any sort. I don't have Doug Adam's book. I always interpreted it as a 'Sauron winning' motif. That sense of all hope gone. Its certainly one of the absolutely most sinister-sounding ideas in the score: it actually permeates the whole of The Return of the King, but here the high choral timbre and broad reading make it sound quite different, and particularly spooky. Its first introduction (en embryo) is when Pippin takes the Palantir, then in its "definitive" form shortly afterwards when Pippin recalls his vision of Sauron to Gandalf. Its actually a combination of two principal ideas from the previous scores: the main motif associated with the Ring itself, its switching hands and so forth; and the motif associated with Sauron, his connection to the Ring, Mordor, etc... This is part of a greater trend in The Return of the King of taking themes - particularly themes from opposing theme-groups - and merging them or blurring the lines between them. Doug chose not to label it as a separate motif unto itself but as a development of the preceeding motifs. Certainly, if you tried to pin down its association, it'd be quite difficult to do except as Sauron's music at its most sinister (and, as you say, looking forward to his seemingly-impending victory). Its this theme, too, that at the end is transformed into the music of the Ring's destruction. Bellosh, Jim Ware and Jay 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bellosh 3,419 Posted July 24, 2023 Share Posted July 24, 2023 1 minute ago, Chen G. said: Its certainly one of the absolutely most sinister-sounding ideas in the score: it actually permeates the whole of The Return of the King, but here the high choral timbre and broad reading make it sound quite different, and particularly spooky. Its actually a combination of two principal ideas from the previous scores: the main motif associated with the Ring itself, its switching hands and so forth; and the motif associated with Sauron, his connection to the Ring, Mordor, etc... Doug chose not to label it as a separate motif unto itself but as a development of the preceeding motifs. Certainly, if you tried to pin down its association, it'd be quite difficult to do except as Sauron's music at its most sinister. thank you for this! Chen G. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KK 3,307 Posted July 24, 2023 Share Posted July 24, 2023 Such a fantastic moment. Sometimes, I don't find all of Doug's sub-theme group names very useful. So I've always seen that example as a variation of the Ring theme, which in itself is one reflection of Sauron's theme, so this instance, among others, is scoring the rising victory of those evil forces. Bellosh 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chen G. 3,949 Posted July 24, 2023 Share Posted July 24, 2023 10 hours ago, KK said: Sometimes, I don't find all of Doug's sub-theme group names very useful. Yeah, I also don't care for the motive names. I understand why Doug used them, and its very much in the long-established tradition of Cooke and Lavignac, but its also terribly limiting. Shore's themes are remarkably flexible and, in the case of some of them, the "meaning" of the motive isn't really something one could put into very simple words, e.g. "Gandalf's Farewells". And I also think the theme-groups could have been delineated differently. I'd lump Gollum's music and at least half of the more minor "Mordor" motives under the theme-family Doug calls "Middle Earth", all the motives that Doug lists as "Ring" I'd lump with Mordor, etc... KK 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Jay 37,367 Posted July 30, 2023 Popular Post Share Posted July 30, 2023 On 24/07/2023 at 11:55 AM, Bellosh said: Does anyone know if this bit at 2:06-2:47 is a motif or theme of any sort. I don't have Doug Adam's book. I always interpreted it as a 'Sauron winning' motif. That sense of all hope gone. Also probably one of my favorite parts in the entire score. Thank you for bringing up this passage, as I can't say I ever specifically thought about it deeply before. Hearing it in this context in isolation - wow, a great, cool little moment, with the choir sounding especially distinct compared to other choral passages in the score. Really cool stuff. On 24/07/2023 at 12:20 PM, Chen G. said: Its certainly one of the absolutely most sinister-sounding ideas in the score: it actually permeates the whole of The Return of the King, but here the high choral timbre and broad reading make it sound quite different, and particularly spooky. Its first introduction (en embryo) is when Pippin takes the Palantir, then in its "definitive" form shortly afterwards when Pippin recalls his vision of Sauron to Gandalf. Its actually a combination of two principal ideas from the previous scores: the main motif associated with the Ring itself, its switching hands and so forth; and the motif associated with Sauron, his connection to the Ring, Mordor, etc... This is part of a greater trend in The Return of the King of taking themes - particularly themes from opposing theme-groups - and merging them or blurring the lines between them. Doug chose not to label it as a separate motif unto itself but as a development of the preceeding motifs. Certainly, if you tried to pin down its association, it'd be quite difficult to do except as Sauron's music at its most sinister (and, as you say, looking forward to his seemingly-impending victory). Its this theme, too, that at the end is transformed into the music of the Ring's destruction. And thank you for this explanation with great examples - this is the kind of stuff that makes JWFan such an awesome place! BTW, Doug talks about this melding of "The History Of The Ring" with "The Evil Of The Ring" on page 4 of the booklet that comes with the 4-CD set. Monoverantus, Bellosh and Chen G. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Faleel 5,350 Posted July 30, 2023 Popular Post Share Posted July 30, 2023 Doesn't that variation of Sauron/Evil Of The Ring also appear in Lighting of the Beacons for Denethor talking to Faramir, right before he hallucinates Boromir. Chen G., Monoverantus and Bellosh 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Monoverantus 363 Posted July 31, 2023 Popular Post Share Posted July 31, 2023 1 hour ago, Signals said: Doesn't that variation of Sauron/Evil Of The Ring also appear in Lighting of the Beacons for Denethor talking to Faramir, right before he hallucinates Boromir. Yup. Here's some other spots: Pippin seeing Mordor for the first time: https://youtu.be/8xN77SS0K74?list=PL733F0C1AF4943B8A&t=230 The reveal of the Witch-king: https://youtu.be/5lcf5EpOzRg?list=PL733F0C1AF4943B8A&t=221 Gollum manipulating Frodo to distrust Sam: https://youtu.be/h7NVvlqePQA?list=PL733F0C1AF4943B8A&t=99 Gollum and Frodo after Shelob's Lair: https://youtu.be/e8tGKpQxbzY?list=PL733F0C1AF4943B8A&t=400 Denethor putting Faramir on the pyre: https://youtu.be/xobG_sB7TRg?list=PL733F0C1AF4943B8A&t=38 The Mouth of Sauron: https://youtu.be/mHJDhwyIXpQ?list=PL733F0C1AF4943B8A I'm sure there are more I can't remember right now. Holko, Bellosh, Jay and 1 other 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chen G. 3,949 Posted July 31, 2023 Share Posted July 31, 2023 Its a very inspired combination, it sounds exceedingly sinister. Much more than the original motifs. Reminds me very much of what Wagner does with some of his music whereby this becomes this becomes this becomes this. So they both feel the need to (naturally) intensify the evil music, and they both do so by combining ideas: after all what is this if not this motif harmonised to this motif? Monoverantus and Bellosh 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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