Star Wars Disenchantment

[Mattris 416]

11 minutes ago, Jurassic Shark said:

If that was for Ep X, JW would have revealed it by now. 

 

What reason would he have to do that? Surely, such a 'reveal' would be breaking an NDA.

[Trope 527]

@Mattris How would you respond to this 2020 Daisy Ridley interview where she says of Rey's parents (and I quote):

 

"At the beginning, there was toying with an Obi-Wan connection, and then... there were different versions. And then it really went to that she was no-one. And then it came to Episode IX, and J.J. pitched me the film and was like, "Oh yeah, Palpatine is grandaddy," and I was like, "Awesome!" And then two weeks later he was like, "Ooh, we're not sure." So it kept changing. So then even I think we were filming and I wasn't sure what the answer was gonna be."

 

 

Could it possibly be that Lucasfilm and J.J. were intentionally hiding the truth of Rey's lineage from lead actress Daisy Ridley in order to not distract her from her job as an actress? I would imagine knowing so much information about her character might cause her to inadvertently forget her lines and lightsaber choreography.

[Mattris 416]

I addressed this. Rey's lineage/origin was locked-in as the trilogy was being formulated on a basic level. Daisy Ridley didn't need to know the truth and wasn't told until 2018, making her performances in TFA and TLJ that much more authentic.

 

This interview is 'a bit', adding to the series that Gad and Ridley shot - along with many other famous actors - in the lead up to TLJ. (They're still available on YouTube.)

[Trope 527]

46 minutes ago, Mattris said:

This interview is 'a bit', adding to the series that Gad and Ridley shot - along with many other famous actors - in the lead up to TLJ. (They're still available on YouTube.)

This video was clearly shot post-TROS, given the fact that she is casually talking about Palpatine being Rey's grandfather. Also, it was uploaded to YouTube in September 2020.

[A. A. Ron 1,742]

4 hours ago, Mattris said:

Occam's Razor dictates that, when presented two opposing conclusions, the more simple one is almost always correct.

 

Right, but as a rule, you ALWAYS skip over the simplest explanation in favor of one you like better.

 

It’s a principle I think I’ll call Mattris’s Sledgehammer.

 

4 hours ago, Mattris said:

There must  be more to the story for it to be complete, much less, good.

 

In my opinion it's too late for the story to be good. In fact, you might even say the saga has gotten so bad that it can no longer be... redeemed.

 

4 hours ago, Mattris said:

Otherwise, Star Wars is akin to X-Men, and George Lucas lied about literally everything about his work.

 

It is and George literally admitted to lying about this in his congratulatory letter to the producers of LOST.

 

In his own words: "When Star Wars first came out, I didn't know where it was going either. The trick is to pretend you've planned the whole thing out in advance. Throw in some father issues and references to other stories - let's call them homages - and you've got a series!"

 

Why are you so willing to believe George's claims of some elaborate master plan, but so determined to ignore the simplest explanation -- that George simply lied about how much of a plan he had? He's literally admitted as much!

 

4 hours ago, Mattris said:

I predicted things about Star Wars that few thought were even remotely possible, much less, likely.

 

Yeah no. Everyone knew your only correct prediction -- Palpatine's return -- was possible. No one considered it likely because it was a stupid idea and we wanted to believe the folks at Lucasfilm would come up with something better. Unfortunately they didn't.

 

4 hours ago, Mattris said:

Episode IX ended identically to VI, which continued onto VII.  It is 100% logical to expect Episode X to follow, the start of another trilogy.

 

Implying lack of originality and a general openness to making more money in the future, nothing more.

 

4 hours ago, Mattris said:

The only "nonsense" I spouted was assuming that Lucasfilm were betraying George Lucas...

 

He certainly seems to have felt they did. After the release of TFA, George literally called Disney "white slavers."

 

4 hours ago, Mattris said:

and were going to conclude the Saga with Episode IX.

 

The folks at Lucasfilm have stated several times that Episode IX is indeed the last film in the "Skywalker Saga." No one will be surprised when LFL backtracks and announces an Episode X, but not because it was clearly George's "original intentions." It's predictable because big movie studios go back to film series they claimed to be done with all the time.

 

4 hours ago, Mattris said:

The story is only lame if it's interpreted as a small child would. You are not aware of Star Wars matters "as they are"; you only have a perception.  It has not been confirmed that you are right in your assessment. You have theories, just as I do.

 

"The difference between" me and the rest of you here is that I have primary evidence and factually-present musical clues to bolster my theories. You do not, only a child-like reading of the story and a list of assumptions a mile long.

 

Oh you sweet summer child. If it weren't for bad assumptions you wouldn't have any theories at all.

[Trope 527]

5 hours ago, A. A. Ron said:

He certainly seems to have felt they did. After the release of TFA, George literally called Disney "white slavers."

Oh, you gullible fool! That was all a publicity stunt masterminded by George Lucas himself.
 

“White slavers” was actually an allegory for the child slavery scenes on Canto Bight in Rian Johnson’s Star Wars: The Last Jedi (a film clearly mapped out by the same Lucasfilm team who worked on The Force Awakens). 
 

I’ve come to understand these rich connections through years of intense research and study, analysing the words and works of George Lucas to a degree not achieved by any other living being. You can only hope to achieve even a fraction of the knowledge I possess. Now, it’s my turn to ask: 

 

What does “white slavers” mean to you?

[Jurassic Shark 12,079]

7 hours ago, Mattris said:

 

What reason would he have to do that? Surely, such a 'reveal' would be breaking an NDA.

 

Because he would forgot not to. 

[Chen G. 3,949]

6 hours ago, A. A. Ron said:

It is and George literally admitted to lying about this in his congratulatory letter to the producers of LOST.

 

In his own words: "When Star Wars first came out, I didn't know where it was going either. The trick is to pretend you've planned the whole thing out in advance. Throw in some father issues and references to other stories - let's call them homages - and you've got a series!"

 

 

I'm still amazed he had the gall to write this.

[Jurassic Shark 12,079]

He was obviously being ironic.

[JTN 2,030]

2 hours ago, Trope said:

Oh, you gullible fool! That was all a publicity stunt masterminded by George Lucas himself.
 

“White slavers” was actually an allegory for the child slavery scenes on Canto Bight in Rian Johnson’s Star Wars: The Last Jedi (a film clearly mapped out by the same Lucasfilm team who worked on The Force Awakens). 
 

I’ve come to understand these rich connections through years of intense research and study, analysing the words and works of George Lucas to a degree not achieved by any other living being. You can only hope to achieve even a fraction of the knowledge I possess. Now, it’s my turn to ask: 

 

What does “white slavers” mean to you?

Oh no, Mattris has multiplied.

 

[Mattris 416]

On 27/01/2024 at 7:58 PM, Trope said:

This video was clearly shot post-TROS, given the fact that she is casually talking about Palpatine being Rey's grandfather. Also, it was uploaded to YouTube in September 2020.

 

Yes, I know that. I was drawing the connection between this interview and the comedic bits Daisy Ridley and Josh Gad produced before TLJ came out. Daisy's even looking away from the camera, a clear indicator that she's lying... and/or trying to remember how she was supposed to respond to the questions. Trust me, it's not a tell-all from someone who knows the complete truth. These are actors acting... and trolling.

 

On 28/01/2024 at 2:00 AM, Jurassic Shark said:

Because he would forgot not to. 

 

John Williams would have 'forgotten' that he wasn't supposed mention perhaps the biggest secret of his career? I think the man is much smarter than you give him credit.

 

On 28/01/2024 at 2:53 AM, Chen G. said:

I'm still amazed he had the gall to write this.

 

Why? You consider Lucas a pathologic liar.

[Jurassic Shark 12,079]

27 minutes ago, Mattris said:

John Williams would have 'forgotten' that he wasn't supposed mention perhaps the biggest secret of his career? I think the man is much smarter than you give him credit.

 

He smart, but forgetful at 90 years of age. He did reveal the alternate ending of Indy V, which he clearly wasn't supposed to do. But I guess you only follow Star Wars news.

[Mattris 416]

Clearly wasn't supposed to do? When/where did he say this?

 

John Williams revealing that he's already recorded the score for Episode X - before the film's even been announced - would perhaps be the worst mistake of his professional career... not simply 'forgetful'. He may be almost 92, but he's not foolish or senile!

[JTN 2,030]

Convincing this guy that Star Wars is but a kid’s movie, is the same as trying to convince the Pope that God doesn’t exist.

He (Matty that is) will never admit that he’s wrong, even if he knows it. He’s either delusional, or he’s just the biggest troll. Either way we’ll never be able to convince him and if we would, he’ll never admit it. 

 

It’s better if we just ignore him because clearly it’s the fuel he thrives on.

[Jurassic Shark 12,079]

25 minutes ago, Mattris said:

Clearly wasn't supposed to do? When/where did he say this?

 

Oh do keep up.

[JTN 2,030]

One more thing that has occurred to me. It’s meant for everyone else, not M.

 

What about all the changes GL made to the OT over the decades? You know, putting Hayden in the end scene of RotJ? Why did they reshoot the Wampa-scene showing its face and full body? Why did Lucas change the Sarlacc? Why does Force ghost Obi-Wan hit a branch  while walking in the forest?
And why did they put back some of the deleted scenes, but not all of them. And the deleted scenes alone. Why were they shot if they got cut out of the final film? Why were some of them put back later?
 

Were all these things all parts of “The Great Master Plan” all along? Why change so many things along the way if Lucas knew and planned everything right from the get go? 

[Tallguy 3,398]

54 minutes ago, JTW said:

Were all these things all parts of “The Great Master Plan” all along?

 

The Wampa certainly was. Of all the changes to the SEs the one that he was clearly not happy with from the very second was the Wampa. The way it was shot was a fallback because the thing didn't work.

 

I don't like the new scenes because they don't feel like part of the same movie. But they were clearly closer to what was originally "intended". Kind of the opposite of Han and Jabba in Star Wars.

[Mr. Hooper 1,793]

1 hour ago, Tallguy said:

But they were clearly closer to what was originally "intended". Kind of the opposite of Han and Jabba in Star Wars.

I personally prefer the sound of Jabba with his original Irish brogue...

 

 

[GerateWohl 4,370]

I find it strange, that Greedo is alive in that scene again. Same as strange as the scene with R4 exploding motivator and in the next shot you see him again standing besides R2D2. Never understood, why these things were not fixed in the SE.

[Jurassic Shark 12,079]

33 minutes ago, GerateWohl said:

I find it strange, that Greedo is alive in that scene again.

 

I've never noticed that. Thanks for running Star Wars for me!

[Datameister 2,044]

3 hours ago, JTW said:

Convincing this guy that Star Wars is but a kid’s movie, is the same as trying to convince the Pope that God doesn’t exist.

He (Matty that is) will never admit that he’s wrong, even if he knows it. He’s either delusional, or he’s just the biggest troll. Either way we’ll never be able to convince him and if we would, he’ll never admit it. 

 

It’s better if we just ignore him because clearly it’s the fuel he thrives on.

 

Oh, he's almost certainly trolling. But the Mattris character is an entertaining one, and the commitment to the bit is pretty impressive. 

[A. A. Ron 1,742]

3 hours ago, JTW said:

lwe’ll never be able to convince him and if we would, he’ll never admit it.

You’ll notice that instead of getting a book length reply like I usually do, he just completely ignored my most recent post. He knows he’s wrong.

[Jurassic Shark 12,079]

4 minutes ago, Datameister said:

 

Oh, he's almost certainly trolling. But the Mattris character is an entertaining one, and the commitment to the bit is pretty impressive. 

 

He's like an evil version of Chen. 

[JTN 2,030]

Fixed.

34 minutes ago, Datameister said:

 

Oh, he's almost certainly trolling. But the “Mattris” character is a laughable one, and the commitment to the bit is pretty lame. 

1 hour ago, GerateWohl said:

Never understood, why these things were not fixed in the SE.

Because Lucas shot it that way and planned not to change it later when he could so we would believe he didn’t change it on purpose. Duh. 

[Mr. Hooper 1,793]

8 minutes ago, Jurassic Shark said:

 

He's like an evil version of Chen. 

So Chen, but with facial hair?

 

[A. A. Ron 1,742]

Fascinating.

[JTN 2,030]

George Lucas to Mattris, in The Mattrisverse.

[Chen G. 3,949]

1 hour ago, Mr. Hooper said:

So Chen, but with facial hair?

 

But I...I have facial hair! 

[A. A. Ron 1,742]

Sure, but is it evil facial hair?

[Mattris 416]

5 hours ago, JTW said:

Convincing this guy that Star Wars is but a kid’s movie, is the same as trying to convince the Pope that God doesn’t exist.

He (Matty that is) will never admit that he’s wrong, even if he knows it. He’s either delusional, or he’s just the biggest troll. Either way we’ll never be able to convince him and if we would, he’ll never admit it. 

 

What makes you think "Star Wars is but a kid’s movie"? What exactly comprises "a kid’s movie"? Why are you here talking so much about "a kid’s movie"?

  

2 hours ago, A. A. Ron said:

You’ll notice that instead of getting a book length reply like I usually do, he just completely ignored my most recent post. He knows he’s wrong.

 

On the contrary, I know I'm right... and with more than enough evidence to prove it. I presented some of it in this very thread, a fact you and others habitually ignore.

 

You really have no good reason to doubt me. Compared to your interpretation of Star Wars, mine is objectively superior: All featured character arcs, throughline themes, and major plot elements within the story actually have a rhyme and a reason. All told, it amounts to a story worth being told to everyone, not just to kids.

 

You don't think you're right, do you? Based on what evidence and logical reasoning? Surely, you have something to offer!

 

Honestly, I glanced over your utterly pathetic response and noticed - not for the first time - that you made no good points; you're just contradicting me from a perceived position of strength when you actually have nothing hold on to but assumptions.

[Datameister 2,044]

@JTW Sounds like you don't have as much appreciation for this swill as I do. All good—Mattris always goes into hibernation after each round of posting. But for my money, this thread is only interesting when he's here to spout his utterly masterful trollspeak. No offense to anyone else.

[Brónach 1,302]

you're losing it

[JTN 2,030]

11 minutes ago, Datameister said:

Mattris always goes into hibernation after each round of posting.

So he’s like Pennywise from IT? 
 

 

11 minutes ago, Datameister said:

this thread is only interesting when he's here to spout his utterly masterful trollspeak.

But he’s spouting it in the wrong thread. This is the disenchantment thread, not the Star Wars World Conspiracy Thread. 

Maybe it’s a freudian thing and unconsciously he dislikes Star Wars. Or he’s like a mosquito and our “scent” a.k.a. any discussion about Star Wars attracts him. 

[Tallguy 3,398]

16 minutes ago, JTW said:

So he’s like Pennywise from IT? 

 

With evil facial hair!

[Chen G. 3,949]

1 hour ago, A. A. Ron said:

Sure, but is it evil facial hair?

 

Well, I'd like to think its sagacious facial hair. 

[Nick1Ø66 4,718]

[JTN 2,030]

12 minutes ago, Chen G. said:

 

Well, I'd like to think its sagacious facial hair. 

 

[Jurassic Shark 12,079]

12 minutes ago, Chen G. said:

 

Well, I'd like to think its sagacious facial hair. 

 

You didn't!

[greenturnedblue 372]

3 hours ago, GerateWohl said:

I find it strange, that Greedo is alive in that scene again

Not only that, there are like 3 or 4 Greedos in that scene!

 

 

[A. A. Ron 1,742]

1 hour ago, Mattris said:

On the contrary, I know I'm right... and with more than enough evidence to prove it. I presented some of it in this very thread, a fact you and others habitually ignore.

 

You really have no good reason to doubt me. Compared to your interpretation of Star Wars, mine is objectively superior: All featured character arcs, throughline themes, and major plot elements within the story actually have a rhyme and a reason. All told, it amounts to a story worth being told to everyone, not just to kids.

 

You don't think you're right, do you? Based on what evidence and logical reasoning? Surely, you have something to offer!

 

Honestly, I glanced over your utterly pathetic response and noticed - not for the first time - that you made no good points; you're just contradicting me from a perceived position of strength when you actually have nothing hold on to but assumptions.

You know what, you’re right. Star Wars IS the greatest story ever told. I don’t know why I thought anyone would be convinced by my utterly pathetic arguments when everything is clearly proceeding just as you have foreseen. Forgive me master for doubting the power of your mighty sledgehammer.

[Mr. Hooper 1,793]

3 hours ago, Chen G. said:

 

But I...I have facial hair! 

 

3 hours ago, A. A. Ron said:

Sure, but is it evil facial hair?

Unless TV has lied to us, a moustache connected to a goatee connotes evil. But if you have a full beard, you should be good. It just means you've lost interest in shaving.

 

[bored 309]

2 hours ago, greenturnedblue said:

Not only that, there are like 3 or 4 Greedos in that scene!

 

 

But what role does Greedo have in this master plan? Are the multiple Greedos just multiple versions who have been murdered by Han in various Maclunky shooting orders? Are the special editions really George's eventual plan for Star Wars multiverse? 

 

Only Mattris has the answers...

[Bayesian 1,363]

23 hours ago, Chen G. said:

No, no, no, no!

 

We were talking about food!

 

Salad ain't food!

Unless it's a big salad. You know, big lettuce, big carrots, tomatoes like volleyballs. The kind of salad you deserve to get credit for when you buy one for your friend.

[Tom 4,664]

19 hours ago, A. A. Ron said:

It is and George literally admitted to lying about this in his congratulatory letter to the producers of LOST.

Turns out, George lied in the letter.  Also, I am lying right now.

 

 

[Chen G. 3,949]

8 minutes ago, Bayesian said:

Unless it's a big salad. You know, big lettuce, big carrots, tomatoes like volleyballs. The kind of salad you deserve to get credit for when you buy one for your friend.

 

Also dependent on the richness of the dressing, like the salad we order at an entree at one of our local restaurants...

[JTN 2,030]

[Mr. Hooper 1,793]

50 minutes ago, Tom said:

Turns out, George lied in the letter.

The leaked letter was a clever distraction, to lead us to believe that He was weak when He was, in fact, strong—in a masterful move to make us underestimate His powers...so that when the final trilogy is released, we'll be simultaneously humbled and brought into a state of bliss as all is revealed to our tired eyes, ears, and hearts...and we unite to sing the praises of His greatest prophet...

 

 

[JTN 2,030]

 

If Lucas planned everything all along, why didn’t Disney use his story treatments for the sequel trilogy? Or they did, only Lucas says they didn’t? And he said so because… he wants us to believe that the new story isn’t his, while it in fact is? Why would he want us to believe it isn’t? And if it isn’t, how could Star Wars be what he planned all along? 

[Tallguy 3,398]

Why is George pretending to be weak when he is actually strong. Who is he trying to defeat? Other than us? And he did that just fine while appearing to be at the height of his powers.

[mstrox 6,651]

They actually followed his instructions for the new trilogy to the letter:

Quote

 

Just make any dumb shit.  Kids will love it and the nerds will slop it up, more slop, slop slop slop, slop for the piggies.  Even if the nerds don’t like it, they’ll still buy action figures and statues and book and comics and toothbrushes that look like Jar Jar’s taint and t-shirts and slightly redesigned theme park bottles of Diet Coke.  
 

I genuinely don’t give a good god damn what you do, and as long as you never release the expanded soundtracks, you can have the thing for six billion dollars.