Star Wars Disenchantment

[Docteur Qui 1,544]

6 hours ago, Mattris said:

 

On the other hand, hearing that the director of the divisive/terrible TLJ (as well as other Lucasfilm employees) is cursing at and name-calling fans (and that the movie is mediocre and has an SJW droid and 'pansexual' Lando) will be much more influential in their decision.

 

 

Dude, his "cursing and name-calling" was very explicitly directed towards the people who were harassing Kelly Tran to the point of her leaving social media. Those people are not "fans", they are "fuckheads", "losers", "tossers", "misogynistic and racist cunts" (my words, not Rian's, though I bet he wished he could say these things without heroes like you crying about it)

[The Illustrious Jerry 3,356]

For those that didn't like TLJ, what about this? Better? I think it's crazy, but at the same time that would've been neat...somehow.

http://ca.ign.com/videos/2018/06/07/star-wars-the-last-jedi-fixed-by-the-internet

 

 

[mstrox 6,651]

The video is blocked here - is this the clip that starts with Carrie Fisher floating in space?  If so, I saw that on Twitter a few days ago and loved it.

[The Illustrious Jerry 3,356]

Yes. It's great.

[SteveMc 2,674]

4 hours ago, Chen G. said:

We don't want a 100-page essay about galactic politics for a text crawl.

Rats.  So I've been writing one all this time for nothing? 

Oh, well.  Your loss. 

[Mattris 416]

2 hours ago, Docteur Qui said:

 

Dude, his "cursing and name-calling" was very explicitly directed towards the people who were harassing Kelly Tran to the point of her leaving social media. Those people are not "fans", they are "fuckheads", "losers", "tossers", "misogynistic and racist cunts" (my words, not Rian's, though I bet he wished he could say these things without heroes like you crying about it)

 

Rian Johnson - or any Lucasfilm employee in a leadership position - should not be cursing and name-calling at people in a public forum - period. This is child-like behavior, completely beneath him as the director of a Star Wars film. Those harassing anyone don't deserve the satisfaction of getting a reaction.

 

Kelly Tran did not leave social media. She just deleted her Instagram posts and did not give a reason why.

[Pellaeon 593]

Rian Johnson is clearly addicted to attention. He made his movie divisive on purpose, and now he will do anything to keep the conversation about him, even though people are trying to talk about Solo.

[SteveMc 2,674]

1 hour ago, Mattris said:

 She just deleted her Instagram posts and did not give a reason why.

What part of this don't you understand?

She received hateful comments, then deleted the pictures that received the comments, and has stopped posting new ones.

She left.

 

 

(like BloodBoal )

[Nick1Ø66 4,717]

45 minutes ago, Steve McQueen said:

(like BloodBoal )

 

Perhaps you can tell him that yourself when he arrives.

[Docteur Qui 1,544]

2 hours ago, Mattris said:

 

Rian Johnson - or any Lucasfilm employee in a leadership position - should not be cursing and name-calling at people in a public forum - period. This is child-like behavior, completely beneath him as the director of a Star Wars film. Those harassing anyone don't deserve the satisfaction of getting a reaction.

 

 

No. Deplorable behaviour like that should never, ever be ignored or swept under the rug, especially by people who hold power and influence. Rian did what too few men in power do, which was to call out shitty behaviour in a public forum. I can’t believe I actually have to have this conversation with you. Your insistence that he acted out of line aligns you with the fucktards responsible in the first place and contributes to a culture that enables and empowers hateful behaviour. You should be ashamed of yourself.

[Nick1Ø66 4,717]

The people who really should be calling out that kind of behaviour is not the likes of Rian Johnson...these guys don't care what Johnson has to say. In fact I'm sure they get off on the attention. There's nothing wrong with Johnson speaking out, he was right to. But Johnson doing the calling out is the equivalent of the teacher telling the class room to settle down. 

 

The ones who should be calling out this scum are members of their own peer group...i.e. people who dislike TLJ, and what Kennedy is doing with the franchise, and are vocal about it, but aren't the kind who will harass an innocent person like Kelly Marie Tran.  Someone on "your side" calling out this kind of behaviour means a lot more than some celeb doing it (there's a reason it's called peer pressure).  And if you are one of the people who hated TLJ and where the franchise is going, it's in your own interests to call out the worst among you, because you're being associated with their bad behaviour, and their actions are overshadowing your legitimate complaints.

 

 

[Docteur Qui 1,544]

Everyone's responsible for calling out shitty behaviour. Rian should do it, Trump should do it, we all should do it. There is no absolution for allowing hate.

[Nick1Ø66 4,717]

Well thankfully none of that is going on here.

[Nick Parker 3,040]

The "rebellion" "we showed them at Lucasfilm and Disney!" talk I see here and elsewhere reminds me of this video:

 

 

[Mattris 416]

On 08/06/2018 at 2:18 PM, Docteur Qui said:

 

No. Deplorable behaviour like that should never, ever be ignored or swept under the rug, especially by people who hold power and influence. Rian did what too few men in power do, which was to call out shitty behaviour in a public forum. I can’t believe I actually have to have this conversation with you. Your insistence that he acted out of line aligns you with the fucktards responsible in the first place and contributes to a culture that enables and empowers hateful behaviour. You should be ashamed of yourself.

 

On the contrary. It's the media lying and running with false narratives (like Star Wars fans are racist, sexist, etc.') that "contributes to a culture that enables and empowers hateful behaviour". Accusing me of aligning with those sending offensive messages? It's you who should be ashamed of yourself, sir.

 

By "deplorable behaviour", do you mean 'sending offensive words to someone else online'? While I condone no such thing, this nonsense should "be ignored or swept under the rug" and deleted by the recipient... or possibly archived for future evidence.

 

Those abusive, hateful, sexist, racist (online) people are the scum of the Earth and don't deserve the time of day. But what they are getting is exactly what they wanted: attention and a reaction. Rian Johnson (and others at Lucasfilm) have called them out with profanity, the media has shined the light on them, and Daisey Ridley and Kelly Marie Tran have dropped-off Instagram. And now we're bickering about it. In handling it this way, everybody looses except the "fucktards".

 

On 08/06/2018 at 2:27 PM, Nick1066 said:

The people who really should be calling out that kind of behaviour is not the likes of Rian Johnson...these guys don't care what Johnson has to say. In fact I'm sure they get off on the attention. There's nothing wrong with Johnson speaking out, he was right to. But Johnson doing the calling out is the equivalent of the teacher telling the class room to settle down. 

 

The ones who should be calling out this scum are members of their own peer group...i.e. people who dislike TLJ, and what Kennedy is doing with the franchise, and are vocal about it, but aren't the kind who will harass an innocent person like Kelly Marie Tran.  Someone on "your side" calling out this kind of behaviour means a lot more than some celeb doing it (there's a reason it's called peer pressure).  And if you are one of the people who hated TLJ and where the franchise is going, it's in your own interests to call out the worst among you, because you're being associated with their bad behaviour, and their actions are overshadowing your legitimate complaints.

 

Who is associating us "with their bad behaviour"? People "who hated TLJ and where the franchise is going" are not "peers" of these abusive, racist, sexist individuals, who will only (possibly) change their ways (i.e. no more posting offensive messages) when they are completely ignored by everyone.

[Arpy 4,145]

Is it wrong for Johnson to be defensive over the absolutely rotten behavior of the 'fans'? 

 

@Mattris Yes, they are the peers of the toxic sludge with this abusive behavior, because it's not coming from the fans and audiences who enjoyed the film, is it? It's coming from the people who share your views on the film, especially the sentiment that Lucasfilm and Disney have fucked Star Wars over.

[Gruesome Son of a Bitch 6,488]

 

Damn good thread! And HOT!

[John 2,032]

[Mattris 416]

42 minutes ago, Arpy said:

Is it wrong for Johnson to be defensive over the absolutely rotten behavior of the 'fans'? 

 

@Mattris Yes, they are the peers of the toxic sludge with this abusive behavior, because it's not coming from the fans and audiences who enjoyed the film, is it? It's coming from the people who share your views on the film, especially the sentiment that Lucasfilm and Disney have fucked Star Wars over.

 

No. But he shouldn't be sinking to the level of insults and bad language, posting dozens of 'defensive' messages daily. Seems like this is all he does now. This is the behavior of a selfish, small man. He made a bad/divisive film, fans are upset, but he can't just shut-up and take a break. This frantic, attack-and-cry-victim mentality from him is, quite frankly, embarrassing.

 

We are absolutely not their peers. And even if a 'normal' fan knew one of these 'worst of the worst' individuals, do you really think they would change after a 'speaking to'? They would not. And it's not our responsibly to try to change them. They're looking to offend. And the only way they 'succeed' is by knowing they have offended. Solution: Everyone should completely ignore them and they will eventually go away. Paying them mind will only fuel their fire.

[Nick Parker 3,040]

Usurped the throne, like a CIA backed coup that actually went the way they wanted it to! 

5 minutes ago, John said:

 

[Gruesome Son of a Bitch 6,488]

A surprise to be sure. But a welcome one.

[Unlucky Bastard 7,782]

Come on down, Oswald. I have a surprise for you.

[Nick Parker 3,040]

Just now, Batman's Diet Coke said:

A surprise to be sure. But a welcome one.

 

It's blatant revisionism, and this is your response!? So this is how liberty dies: with Prequels quotes.

[John 2,032]

Are you proud of your little "rebellion", @Mattris?

 

[Dixon Hill 4,234]

That real?

[Nick Parker 3,040]

3 minutes ago, John said:

Are you proud of your little "rebellion", @Mattris?

 

 

That's disturbing. 

[Gruesome Son of a Bitch 6,488]

14 minutes ago, Margo Channing said:

Come on down, Oswald. I have a surprise for you.

 

Calm down, Artoo! I almost fell.

[Dixon Hill 4,234]

22 minutes ago, Mattris said:

 

...posting dozens of 'defensive' messages daily. Seems like this is all he does now. This is the behavior of a selfish, small man...just shut-up and take a break...This frantic, attack-and-cry-victim mentality from him is, quite frankly, embarrassing...

 

...

[Gruesome Son of a Bitch 6,488]

Small words. From a small being trying to attack what it doesn't understand.

[Arpy 4,145]

@Mattris You are aware how ironic that is? When it's basically that ×1000 from every crybaby who thought Johnson fucked up!

[Dixon Hill 4,234]

The Borg Queen, more feminazi propaganda.

[John 2,032]

2 minutes ago, TGP said:

That real?

 

Unfortunately, yes.

 

7 minutes ago, Nick Parker said:

 That's disturbing. 

 

It really is.

[Dixon Hill 4,234]

Why are there so many fucking crazy obsessive people around lately?

[Gruesome Son of a Bitch 6,488]

They have brought peace to JWFan. Everything is going as planned.

[Arpy 4,145]

I knew franchises like Star Wars and Star Trek have a strong fanbase of devotees, but if that Facebook group is real then it has made me rethink my stance on those devotees, that this fanbase has created a religious cult that truly believes that Disney are committing sacrilegious acts against their holy manuscripts. It's sad, sad that I have to associate myself with such sickening behavior.

[Gruesome Son of a Bitch 6,488]

In other words, you want to go home and rethink your life.

[Guest]

13 minutes ago, TGP said:

Why are there so many fucking crazy obsessive people around lately?

I noticed soon after the 2016 US election a lot of people started acting more strangely, and crazy people started popping up out of no where. No idea if those two things are correlated (they probably are).

 

I think in a lot of ways, the Star Wars divide is very metaphorical to how politics are dividing the world right now. Hence the constant "SJW" arguments. It's all interconnected. It all boils down to conservatives vs. liberals.

[Dixon Hill 4,234]

Seems like the easy explanation but not the right one.  I blame the internet exploited as a soapbox and as a part of a larger cultural decay that seems increasingly fated to yield lots of unstable minds.  Now add the astronomically high level of tribal political thinking to be found everywhere in 2018 and a significant franchise being helmed by a force like Disney.  What a world, eh?

[Gruesome Son of a Bitch 6,488]

A small world, after all.

[Mattris 416]

1 hour ago, John said:

Are you proud of your little "rebellion", @Mattris?

 

I have absolutely nothing to do with that "Rebellion" and disagree with everything they stand for. Do you honestly think those are the goals of 'people like me'?

 

53 minutes ago, Arpy said:

@Mattris You are aware how ironic that is? When it's basically that ×1000 from every crybaby who thought Johnson fucked up!

 

I don't follow. Please explain. As I see it, this division among the Star Wars fandom falls squarely on Kathleen Kennedy's shoulders. And from director's chair to Twitter cry-baby, Rian Johnson's behavior is down right pathetic.

 

38 minutes ago, Manakin Skywalker said:

I noticed soon after the 2016 US election a lot of people started acting more strangely, and crazy people started popping up out of no where. No idea if those two things are correlated (they probably are).

 

I think in a lot of ways, the Star Wars divide is very metaphorical to how politics are dividing the world right now. Hence the constant "SJW" arguments. It's all interconnected. It all boils down to conservatives vs. liberals.

 

32 minutes ago, TGP said:

Seems like the easy explanation but not the right one.  I blame the internet exploited as a soapbox and as a part of a larger cultural decay that seems increasingly fated to yield lots of unstable minds.  Now add the astronomically high level of tribal political thinking to be found everywhere in 2018 and a significant franchise being helmed by a force like Disney.  What a world, eh?

 

You two are onto something here.

[Unlucky Bastard 7,782]

This sinful demon mouse has defied the Almighty. The Lord shall pass judgement on those who dare commit insolence against his mighty kingdom. The mouse's deviant servants will not survive the Rapture, which will take place soon as we are in the End Times!

[Arpy 4,145]

No, the division does not fall on the shoulders of Kathleen Kennedy, nor is Johnson's behavior pathetic.

[John 2,032]

13 minutes ago, Mattris said:

Do you honestly think those are the goals of 'people like me'?

 

Judging by your posts over the past few weeks, yes. 

[Nick Parker 3,040]

If Mattris called these dudes out for their deplorable and loathsome behavior, would he be cast by them as some pariah? 

[Unlucky Bastard 7,782]

Because it's just easier to regard them as some homogenous, monolithic collective group where each of them all support one another.

[Gruesome Son of a Bitch 6,488]

Men like you created the hydrogen bomb. Men like you. Thought it up.

[Arpy 4,145]

I don't think @Mattris does share the goals of some of the most virulent out there, but his tone does smack of someone who has felt dejected by what he perceives to be a mishandling of his fandom.

[Nick Parker 3,040]

I'm just wondering how far the rabbit hole goes as far as this anti-current Star Wars thing. Much like many other groups, there seem to be circles within circles, of various levels of radicalism. Since Mattris denies being as extreme as the people who harass an actress because she played a part in a single motion picture, would those anti-current Star Wars people decry and shun him for not being truly devoted to the cause?

 

Next step:

 

[Unlucky Bastard 7,782]

They troll to support our cause. Soon Kathy-Ma will rule the world.

[mstrox 6,651]

Rian Johnson confirmed that Tran left social media because of these dickbags, by the way.

 

I think that a false sense of ownership or of being owed because they have spent their money, they’re the “customer,” is what’s making these people flip their lids.   I was in the customer service industry long enough to know that a common misconception is that “the customer is always right,” when 90% of the time it’s actually, “the customer is making a scene.”  It’s not all the fans, but it’s the worst fans.  The mouth breathing doofuses, the regular ranting pedants who used to just hang around being shitty and frustrating the people behind the counter at their local comic book stores, have all found each other on social media, where they can be shitty en masse and feel that it gives them some legitimacy.

 

Say what you will about the prequels, but Lucas never kowtowed to fan demands and frustrated the living hell out of them with the prequels.  Then when Disney and Kennedy came along (and by came along, I mean “paid literally billions of dollars to actually own it and not just claim personal ownership because they spent a bunch of money on books and comics and video games and LEGO and owned little plastic Droopy McCool in the eighties”), all of a sudden Lucas and the prequels were sancrosanct, God’s perfect fandom angel, hallowed be thy name.  The revisionist history fascinates me - that Star Wars was perfect and good and everybody loved everything about it until Walter Disney came along and filled it with NASTY LIBERAL IDEAS (which, holy shit you guys check out George Lucas’s politics and the ideas he tried to get across both successfully and unsuccessfully in his Star Wars movies and Clone Wars).  And now fans are tantruming that people aren’t kowtowing to their demands and making divisive movies that not everybody cares for, when that’s exactly what Lucas did when he frustrated them 19, 16, and 13 years ago.