MISSION IMPOSSIBLE: FALLOUT (2018) - Film & Score

[Koray Savas 2,251]

You say it’s not about whether samples were used or not, but then you say that exact thing as an example with Mandy. Can’t be both.

[Locrius 97]

No, I said it's about whether or not it sounds like only samples. Which is what the original Twitter question was about, too.

 

EDIT: And either way lol, if that's the best you can come up with in response, I think I've gotten my point across. People are attacking Drew for asking if anyone else thinks it sounds like mostly/entirely samples. It is perfectly reasonable to ask other people's opinions.

 

EDIT 2: My quote earlier:

 

"I mean, if I hear Johann Johannsson's MANDY score next month, and I ask if people think it sounds like mostly/entirely samples, should that stir up a big Internet storm too? Because one track of MANDY thus far has been released—and I love it!—but I can't tell if it's got a real orchestra thrown in the mix too."

 

So, yeah. Obviously it will have a real orchestra to some extent, but if I can't tell from listening to it, then yes, it's perfectly valid for me to ask if other people also hear primarily samples.

 

 

[Koray Savas 2,251]

You said you weren’t sure if Mandy used an orchestra, not that you knew it used orchestra and whether it sounded like it or not. That’s all I was saying. 

[Dixon Hill 4,234]

2 minutes ago, Locrius said:

No, I said it's about whether or not it sounds like only samples. Which is what the original Twitter question was about, too.

 

EDIT: And either way lol, if that's the best you can come up with in response, I think I've gotten my point across. People are attacking Drew for asking if anyone else thinks it sounds like mostly/entirely samples. It is perfectly reasonable to ask other people's opinions.

 

Oh ye gods... NO ONE IS ATTACKING HIM FOR ASKING OTHER PEOPLE'S OPINIONS AND NO ONE IS SAYING THAT'S A BAD THING.

 

It's about the MOTIVATION behind the question, which, given Soundtrack Meme's past animus with Balfe - which I was not the only person to notice - is hardly an outlandish suspicion.

[Locrius 97]

2 minutes ago, Koray Savas said:

You said you weren’t sure if Mandy used an orchestra, not that you knew it used orchestra and whether it sounded like it or not. 

 

No, I said I couldn't tell there was a real orchestra in that one track that I've heard so far. Of course I assume there is a real orchestra, but the way it sounds, the samples are front-and-center/the main thing. You can still assume there is a real orchestra and not be able to tell, just by listening. Those two things are not mutually exclusive. It sounds like just samples. Drew, likewise, thinks that M:I-6 sounds like just samples. Posting a pic of an orchestra doesn't change people's auditory perception of things. And frankly, it's irrelevant.

[Dixon Hill 4,234]

Can some third party confirm that I'm not insane and this guy is just not getting the point?

[Locrius 97]

3 minutes ago, TGP said:

 

Oh ye gods... NO ONE IS ATTACKING HIM FOR ASKING OTHER PEOPLE'S OPINIONS AND NO ONE IS SAYING THAT'S A BAD THING.

 

It's about the MOTIVATION behind the question, which, given Soundtrack Meme's past animus with Balfe - which I was not the only person to notice - is hardly an outlandish suspicion.

 

Motivation is irrelevant when it's a valid and reasonable question. You've already admitted to caring more about feelings than facts.

[Kasey Kockroach 2,344]

Anyone watched any good porn lately? 

[Dixon Hill 4,234]

Ok mate.  

 

Just now, kaseykockroach said:

Anyone watched any good porn lately? 

 

Yeah but it was scored by Lorne Balfe so I couldn't get it up.

[Koray Savas 2,251]

4 minutes ago, TGP said:

Can some third party confirm that I'm not insane and this guy is just not getting the point?

It’s a perfectly valid question. You see, it’s asking about what it sounds like...

[Locrius 97]

1 minute ago, TGP said:

Can some third party confirm that I'm not insane and this guy is just not getting the point?

 

Dude, I don't care if Balfe and Soundtrack Meme's families have been feuding for generations. The question that was asked, is perfectly valid and, from my own experience with the score, warranted. The thing sounds (on first listen at least) like it's 99% samples. Is there a real orchestra buried somewhere in there? Sure; it's a Hollywood movie, of course they've hired an orchestra. But the Tweeted question asked whether other people think it sounds like mostly samples. Which, IMO, it does. And apparently some other people think the same.

 

Again, I couldn't give any less of a crap if Balfe's great-grandpa murdered Soundtrack Meme's, or vice versa—I don't care why the question was asked; if he didn't ask it, someone else should have. It was valid and is something that evidently multiple people can relate to, regarding this score. So, yeah. You can keep going on about "feelings" and what you think it "means", but there is nothing wrong with the question and nobody should feel bad for asking it. In fact, the only person who should feel bad is the idiot who tagged Balfe (which again, was not Drew) to get this whole thing stirred up.

[Koray Savas 2,251]

But Drew said he knew the answer to the question, so... why ask it?

[Locrius 97]

9 minutes ago, Koray Savas said:

It’s a perfectly valid question. You see, it’s asking about what it sounds like...

 

"Does the "Mission: Impossible - Fallout" score sound like the final product was performed mostly or entirely using samples?"

 

7 minutes ago, Koray Savas said:

But Drew said he knew the answer to the question, so... why ask it?

 

I'm glad Drew knew his own opinion on the matter, before he decided to ask others'. Again, why do you keep using this line of arguing? It makes 0 sense. Of course someone is going to have their own opinion on a Twitter poll before they post the poll. Like I said earlier, if I think McDonald's chicken nuggets don't taste like real chicken, then by your logic I shouldn't ask anyone else if they think the same—because I already know what I think.

 

You are effectively arguing that no one should ever wonder if anyone else shares their opinions on a matter—because their own opinion is all that matters/is needed.

[Dixon Hill 4,234]

6 minutes ago, Locrius said:

there is nothing wrong with the question

 

I agree.

 

6 minutes ago, Locrius said:

nobody should feel bad for asking it

 

I might agree, but some of Drew's past posts don't work in his favor as far as suspicious motivations go.

 

7 minutes ago, Locrius said:

In fact, the only person who should feel bad is the idiot who tagged Balfe (which again, was not Drew) to get this whole thing stirred up.

 

See above.

[Locrius 97]

3 minutes ago, TGP said:

I might agree, but some of Drew's past posts don't work in his favor as far as suspicious motivations go.

 

 

See above.

 

Mind clarifying this? Are you saying you think it was Drew who tagged him? Just curious. Obviously if he did, I fully condemn that. Balfe shouldn't have even been bothered with this whole thing; not worth his time.

[Kasey Kockroach 2,344]

THIS DREW FELLOW DID NOT TAG LORNE BALFE

SOME DWEEB IN THE COMMENTS SECTION DID

I'VE READ "HE SHOULDN'T HAVE TAGGED LORNE BALFE" AT LEAST THREE TIMES, FOR GONZO'S SAKE, DOESN'T ANYONE PAY ATTENTION

[Dixon Hill 4,234]

No, I'm talking about the intention behind the poll itself.  That uncertainty prevents me from saying the person who shared it is the only one with dirty hands here.

[Koray Savas 2,251]

53 minutes ago, Locrius said:

 

"Does the "Mission: Impossible - Fallout" score sound like the final product was performed mostly or entirely using samples?"

 

 

I'm glad Drew knew his own opinion on the matter, before he decided to ask others'. Again, why do you keep using this line of arguing? It makes 0 sense. Of course someone is going to have their own opinion on a Twitter poll before they post the poll. Like I said earlier, if I think McDonald's chicken nuggets don't taste like real chicken, then by your logic I shouldn't ask anyone else if they think the same—because I already know what I think.

 

You are effectively arguing that no one should ever wonder if anyone else shares their opinions on a matter—because their own opinion is all that matters/is needed.

No one cares about your tastes in chicken nuggets, sorry. 

[Locrius 97]

54 minutes ago, kaseykockroach said:

THIS DREW FELLOW DID NOT TAG LORNE BALFE

SOME DWEEB IN THE COMMENTS SECTION DID

I'VE READ "HE SHOULDN'T HAVE TAGGED LORNE BALFE" AT LEAST THREE TIMES, FOR GONZO'S SAKE, DOESN'T ANYONE PAY ATTENTION

 

That's what I thought.

 

13 minutes ago, Koray Savas said:

No one cares about your tastes in chicken nuggets, sorry. 

 

LOL you ignored the point. Only attacking the analogy makes it look like you can't construct an actual response. Let me repeat again:

 

"You are effectively arguing that no one should ever wonder if anyone else shares their opinions on a matter—because their own opinion is all that matters/is needed."

 

I'm not sure how many more ways I can phrase it. You're getting upset because someone wondered if other people think the same as they do. That's insane.

 

EDIT: BTW, you never did explain what you meant when you mentioned people online being "entitled"?

[publicist 4,643]

When did we move on from the vastly more important question if a film score released away from the film should have musical validity?

[Koray Savas 2,251]

8 minutes ago, Locrius said:

BTW, you never did explain what you meant when you mentioned people online being "entitled"?

Yes I did. 

[Arpy 4,145]

12 minutes ago, publicist said:

When did we move on from the vastly more important question if a film score released away from the film should have musical validity?

When we refreshed the page and realized that the tab was 'JWFan'.

[publicist 4,643]

And that it was vastly more fruitful to attack brick and mortar guys from RCP on Twitter. 

[Arpy 4,145]

Could you imagine if JW was on Twitter? You'd have all kinds of numpties tweeting at him about how the prequel Star Wars scores sound different.

[Kasey Kockroach 2,344]

Golly, mister Williams, why is your music so lame?

[publicist 4,643]

We've come to this. Look at this 30-year old letter a fan from our german FB group recently posted to see how cordial such things were handled back then.

 

[Dixon Hill 4,234]

I reckon Jerry would be merciless via Twitter.

[thestat 348]

Dudes. The problem is not if LB had a sample library or wanked off to a microphone. There clearly is an orchestra here and it has been recorded. The problem is not the sound (though it is amusing to hear an engineer make a group of 12 brass players sound like a casio sample). The problem is why does it not do ANYTHING AT ALL. It just makes noise.

[Nick1Ø66 4,718]

7 hours ago, Locrius said:

Please explain what was wrong with the question, @TGP. My take on it is as follows:

@Drew listened to the soundtrack --> he thought the samples sounded especially front-and-center in this particular one --> he wondered if anyone else thought it sounded like the samples were the main/only thing (or if anyone heard any real orchestra hidden beneath the samples).

 

And a bunch of people are jumping down his throat for a perfectly reasonable question.

 

I mean, if I hear Johann Johannsson's MANDY score next month, and I ask if people think it sounds like mostly/entirely samples, should that stir up a big Internet storm too? Because one track of MANDY thus far has been released—and I love it!—but I can't tell if it's got a real orchestra thrown in the mix too. But the way people like you and @Arpy and @Koray Savas are reacting here, you'd think that it would be off-limits for me to wonder that. Why?

 

If I hear a video game score and can't tell whether or not it uses a real orchestra, or if it's just samples—am I not allowed to ask how other people think it sounds?

 

EDIT: To be perfectly honest w/ you by the way, it took me a few listens before I realized that FALLOUT did in fact utilize a real orchestra. I knew it was samples, but I didn't know to what extent. e.g. I wondered if there was an orchestra but it was mostly just buried beneath the samples, I wondered if it was only samples, etc.

 

OT: Looking at your screen name...are you Borg?

[Richard Penna 3,694]

Well, this blew up overnight...

 

I'd agree that the original question on Twitter, while trying to ask a question, was making a statement at the same time, i.e. 'this score sounds like it's mostly synth doesn't it? Who else agrees with me?'. Perhaps could've been better phrased to refer more to the recording techniques and mixing.

[Jay 37,368]

20 hours ago, Richard Penna said:

I find it hard to believe that appreciating a score without seeing the film is unusual. Absolutely there are exceptions, and some scores that only opened up after viewing the film, but I think it works both ways.

 

Absolutely agree 100%.

 

If we had to hold all discussion of new film score music albums until we saw the film in question, what a dreadfully boring place this would be.

[Arpy 4,145]

For one, we wouldn't have endless debates over assigning motifs to characters' legs and shoelaces and other knick knacks. 

[Drew 590]

Part of the flaw of saying that we shouldn't judge music at all outside of the film is that many of us are aware of how music works in context. We have enough expertise to have a good idea of how the music will work, and if the music could have been any better.

 

I'm not saying this to be a dreaded know-it-all.

[Nick Parker 3,040]

Hey y'all, nearin' the end of my vacation, and looking forward to get back to the JWFan...*reads thread*...what the hell have you all been talking about when I was gone?

[Disco Stu 15,495]

You know what's crazy?  This movie is pretty likely going to end up slightly outgrossing Solo, which would push that movie out of the top 5 grossers of the Summer.  That is something that I almost guarantee not one person would have predicted 3 months ago.

[Jurassic Shark 12,079]

So Solo is doing well then in the long run?

[Drew 590]

https://www.thesoundcast.com/2018/08/interview-lorne-balfe-mission.html

 

When Balfe was asked why he continues to engage in discussions on Twitter: "Why would you kind of cut off [from Twitter followers] just because I've got those people who have very kind of crazy thoughts [about the Fallout score]?"

 

[Jurassic Shark 12,079]

You crazy guy!

[Jay 37,368]

Not sure if anyone on this forum was planning on buying the physical edition of the OST, but:

 

Quote

MISSION IMPOSSIBLE: FALLOUT 2 CD UPDATE:

 

Artwork still not approved. It will NOT be going on sale tomorrow at 12 pm pst as scheduled. This title has been delayed until further notice.

As soon as everything gets squared away we shall move forth with the mission.

 

Sorry, guys.

 

[Drew 590]

Random thought/joke: Is it possible that Dan Goldwasser got mad at my polls because he knows that the Fallout CD might not return his monetary investment? (no offense) He helped produce the Rogue Nation album so it wouldn't surprise me if LLL had bought the CD rights before Balfe was announced. Is that even how that stuff works?

[Koray Savas 2,251]

No.

[Incanus 5,715]

I saw this film on Monday and I thought it was a pretty decent fast paced but not terribly surprising or novel entry (What long running formulaic franchise film can be I ask?) in the series. But whoever mixed Balfe's blunt and loud sledgehammer of a score should be fired as it became unbearably ear-splitting at many points. 

[Disco Stu 15,495]

5 hours ago, Incanus said:

I saw this film on Monday and I thought it was a pretty decent fast paced but not terribly surprising or novel entry (What long running formulaic franchise film can be I ask?) in the series. But whoever mixed Balfe's blunt and loud sledgehammer of a score should be fired as it became unbearably ear-splitting at many points. 

 

The music during much of the helicopter chase was particularly unbearable in my opinion.  It's just bad.

[Incanus 5,715]

13 minutes ago, Disco Stu said:

 

The music during much of the helicopter chase was particularly unbearable in my opinion.  It's just bad.

Yup. The London chase finale where Hunt is left on the roof top of the tower with the music blaring on ear-splitting levels was another entirely horrible moment both in the theater and dramatically. A little restraint goes a long way and you can have those dramatic musical moments without having to whack the audience on the ears with such horrible wall of sound.

 

Also scoring anything approaching even remotely serious dramatic moment by drawn out long string chords is getting truly tiresome.

[gkgyver 1,645]

On 6. August 2018 at 5:36 AM, Koray Savas said:

But Drew said he knew the answer to the question, so... why ask it?

 

Simple: to hopefully draw more people's attention to the artistically damaging trend that hacks with choppy samples now score major Hollywood films, and this wretched output by a wretched copycat composer/programmer is a prime opportunity to do so, because it's a project with widespread interest.

 

But of course it's easier and more satisfying to basically throw the entire thing away and accuse the author of malicious intent, than to focus on the actual point.

[Koray Savas 2,251]

Whatever you say. 

[Not Mr. Big 4,639]

Balfe only wrote the music to support the film so I'm sure he's fine with it not having a CD release

[gkgyver 1,645]

He's used to that, ghosting for Zimmer.

[Koray Savas 2,251]

Not a ghost writer if he’s credited. 

[Drew 590]

31 minutes ago, Koray Savas said:

Not a ghost writer if he’s credited. 

 

Credited at the end of an album booklet that most digital listeners don't even have access to...