crumbs 14,316 Posted May 21, 2018 Share Posted May 21, 2018 Yep, that's different from the 3rd idea I posted above. It also appears in Battle of Crait. Good point! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
artguy360 1,843 Posted May 21, 2018 Share Posted May 21, 2018 To me that reoccurring figure has some kind of motivic thing going on, similar to Holdo's theme it has a sense of rising drama and desperation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crumbs 14,316 Posted May 21, 2018 Share Posted May 21, 2018 They seem musically connected which makes thematic sense, but they're all unique motivic ideas to my ears. Cut from the same cloth but hardly "duplications." Just like all the various First Order related fanfares that adorn their fleet ships/vehicles. The Dreadnought, the Supremacy, the battering ram cannon all receive unique ideas that share Williams' trademark musical flourishes for baddies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chen G. 3,949 Posted May 21, 2018 Share Posted May 21, 2018 5 hours ago, crumbs said: it sounds like you're just trying to talk down Williams' writings on TLJ (as usual) by flagrantly disregarding these separate ideas as "duplications." Not at all. I just prefer a more exclusive approach to tracking down leitmotives (or themes). I think its more consistent with the way Williams writes: He (intentionally) doesn't go the Wagner/Shore route of writing a large amount of them: instead, he writes 5-6 of them (or, in this case, half of that), which he can feature more extensivelly and make more distinct. I really don't think he would want us debating whether each three-note snippet from his scores is a leitmotif. I think that leitmotives need to have a clear association, and a specific one: if its something too general and abstract (e.g. action motif) than it probably isn't a leitmotif. Likewise, the motif in question has to be substantial, not just be a generic musical gesture or something that's so brief and inconsequential that it might have re-occured by sheer accident - it needs to be intentional. On the flipside, it has to be something intentional to the score at hand - if its something you find across multiple scores by the composer, its usually more of a stylistic device than a proper leitmotif. A good example from another score is the two-note brass figure that James Horner in Braveheart. Its all over the score. Is it a leitmotif, than? hell, no. First, its too generic: at a mere two notes, the figure is defined more by its timbre (growling low brass) than by the actual music. Second, if you try to pin down its role in the story, its really nothing more than "danger" or "ominous" which is far too abstract (effectivelly a replacement of Horner's prexisting three-note figure used for the same purpose in his earlier scores), and third - having recurred in Titanic - its really more of an expression of Horner's style than it is a specific leitmotif written for this score. I think a great parallel is between leitmotives in a score and callbacks in the dialouge of a script. Not every line that happens twice (or more) in a script is a callback. It maybe too generic to be intentional: think about a character exclaiming "oh my god" when facing danger. A lot of the supposed leitmotif being labeled around JWFan are the musical equivalent of that. Pieter Boelen 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pellaeon 593 Posted June 20, 2018 Share Posted June 20, 2018 For “The Flag Parade” and “The Adventures of Jar Jar,” is the Themes From "The Phantom Menace" and Other Film Hits (Frederic Talgorn & Royal Scottish National Orchestra and Chorus) the way to go? The best or only recording? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Holko 9,526 Posted June 21, 2018 Share Posted June 21, 2018 Does Adventures of Jar Jar change anything or add in little bridges and transitions? From what I remember, it's "just" a collection of score material. bollemanneke 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pellaeon 593 Posted June 25, 2018 Share Posted June 25, 2018 I have no idea. I’m really not a fan of the PT, but I thought I should at least put together for myself a playlist of the concert pieces. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ricard 2,245 Posted June 25, 2018 Share Posted June 25, 2018 On 6/20/2018 at 11:10 PM, Pellaeon said: For “The Flag Parade” and “The Adventures of Jar Jar,” is the Themes From "The Phantom Menace" and Other Film Hits (Frederic Talgorn & Royal Scottish National Orchestra and Chorus) the way to go? The best or only recording? Not the only recording but probably the best. Personally I've always considered the RSNO's to be the go-to recording of the TPM suite -no need to include Main Title and Arrival at Naboo of course. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jurassic Shark 12,076 Posted June 25, 2018 Share Posted June 25, 2018 44 minutes ago, Ricard said: Not the only recording but probably the best. Personally I've always considered the RSNO's to be the go-to recording of the TPM suite -no need to include Main Title and Arrival at Naboo of course. Annoyingly, the main title is flubbed at the intro. Why didn't they do another take? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pellaeon 593 Posted June 25, 2018 Share Posted June 25, 2018 1 hour ago, Ricard said: Personally I've always considered the RSNO's to be the go-to recording of the TPM suite -no need to include Main Title and Arrival at Naboo of course. Appreciate the info. Ricard 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pellaeon 593 Posted August 6, 2018 Share Posted August 6, 2018 On 12/19/2015 at 5:27 PM, Score said: The Force Awakens 1) March of the Resistance 2) Rey's Theme 3) Scherzo for X-Wings 4) The Jedi Steps (concert version) 5) The Jedi Steps and Finale Please add “Adagio” to your list! SteveMc and tmarps 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Score 770 Posted August 7, 2018 Share Posted August 7, 2018 16 hours ago, Pellaeon said: Please add “Adagio” to your list! Done! I wish he had included it in the Suite from the beginning... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pellaeon 593 Posted August 7, 2018 Share Posted August 7, 2018 5 hours ago, Score said: Done! I wish he had included it in the Suite from the beginning... Me too, but I’m still happy to have it! Oh, and don’t forget “The Adventures of Han”. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Score 770 Posted August 9, 2018 Share Posted August 9, 2018 On 8/7/2018 at 5:10 PM, Pellaeon said: Me too, but I’m still happy to have it! Oh, and don’t forget “The Adventures of Han”. Ok, I added that one as well. Although, as far as I know, this is not yet officially confirmed to be a concert piece. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Parker 3,040 Posted August 9, 2018 Share Posted August 9, 2018 8 minutes ago, Score said: Ok, I added that one as well. Although, as far as I know, this is not yet officially confirmed to be a concert piece. It's already been performed in concert multiple times. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Score 770 Posted August 9, 2018 Share Posted August 9, 2018 3 hours ago, Nick Parker said: It's already been performed in concert multiple times. Ah, I must have missed something then. Ok, the list is complete... until episode IX, or the next surprise! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Demodex 557 Posted August 19, 2018 Share Posted August 19, 2018 On 8/6/2018 at 12:39 PM, Pellaeon said: Please add “Adagio” to your list! What the hell is Adagio? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Disco Stu 15,495 Posted August 19, 2018 Share Posted August 19, 2018 6 minutes ago, Demodex said: What the hell is Adagio? You missed it? http://www.jwfan.com/forums/index.php?/topic/28749-new-williams-concert-arrangement-adagio-from-the-force-awakens-premiering-august-7th-2018-at-tanglewood-update-world-premiere-was-march-2018-in-mexico-city-video-on-page-1/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Demodex 557 Posted August 19, 2018 Share Posted August 19, 2018 So it's The Starkiller cue? Where can I hear this? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Parker 3,040 Posted August 20, 2018 Share Posted August 20, 2018 There's a video of it a few posts down in that thread's first page..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
publicist 4,643 Posted August 21, 2018 Share Posted August 21, 2018 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bollemanneke 3,348 Posted February 17, 2019 Share Posted February 17, 2019 Could anyone tell me where I can hear the two different Yoda's theme versions? Do we have any recording of Cantina Band that conforms to the signature edition? Do we have an official recording of the alternate TFA brass finale yet? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Score 770 Posted February 17, 2019 Share Posted February 17, 2019 1 hour ago, bollemanneke said: Could anyone tell me where I can hear the two different Yoda's theme versions? The old version is the one available on the 1997 2CD release, you can listen to it here: The more recent version (that uses a portion of the End Credits arrangement) was used basically in every concert, for example this one: Compare the section that starts at 1:20 in the first video (the old version) with the same section that starts around 1:23 in the second video (the new version), and you'll hear the difference. The second version is the Signature Edition one, which coincides with the version orchestrated by Spencer that was available for rental decades ago. bollemanneke 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom 4,658 Posted February 17, 2019 Share Posted February 17, 2019 My guess is that the following is the signature edition of the Cantina Band (beginning around 53:00): Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Score 770 Posted February 18, 2019 Share Posted February 18, 2019 11 hours ago, Tom said: My guess is that the following is the signature edition of the Cantina Band (beginning around 53:00): No, the (wonderful) version in the video is heavily re-arranged: almost the whole orchestra is playing at the end, and there is an extended sax solo (55:25) that is not in the SE. The SE score is the same as another score that was published decades ago in another edition (Fox) and it basically matches the original recording, except for a concert ending that is not heard in the soundtrack recording. I have heard that ending many years ago, so it was recorded at some point (I had a cassette with that version when I was a kid), but I cannot find it, and I cannot find a reference to what recording it was. _deleted_ and bollemanneke 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Pellaeon 593 Posted July 31, 2019 Popular Post Share Posted July 31, 2019 Possible listening order for an expanded TFA concert program: 01 March of the Resistance 02 Rey’s Theme 03 Adagio 04 Han Solo and the Princess (2018 version) 05 Scherzo for X-Wings 06 The Jedi Steps 07 Finale Thus the five movements of the original published suite stay in order, and the two newer arrangements slot in based on when their equivalent scenes occur in the film. In other words, the whole program is heard in film order except for Resistance, which would occur after Adagio in the film order. Another advantage (IMO) of this is that it keeps a maximum amount of time between the Resistance and Rey themes their reiteration in the Finale. I realize that it’s totally headcanon to consider the new Han and Leia arrangement a part of TFA, so, drop it if you prefer. Just to me it doesn’t fit well with ESB. Cerebral Cortex, The Illustrious Jerry and Smeltington 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bollemanneke 3,348 Posted July 31, 2019 Share Posted July 31, 2019 Very nice order! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post BrotherSound 2,242 Posted August 24, 2019 Popular Post Share Posted August 24, 2019 I happened to see this photo from the Library of Congress, with a handwritten cover page (by Williams himself, it seems), showing the very first, 5-movement version of the Star Wars suite. Note the December 5, 1977 date: rough cut, Score, KingPin and 2 others 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crumbs 14,316 Posted August 25, 2019 Share Posted August 25, 2019 Do these new arrangements with ASM count? If so, that's 5 new suites (Leia's Theme, Across the Stars, Rey's Theme, Luke & Leia, Yoda's Theme, possibly Han Solo and the Princess but it's not on the album). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Score 770 Posted August 25, 2019 Share Posted August 25, 2019 37 minutes ago, crumbs said: Do these new arrangements with ASM count? If so, that's 5 new suites (Leia's Theme, Across the Stars, Rey's Theme, Luke & Leia, Yoda's Theme, possibly Han Solo and the Princess but it's not on the album). I have updated the list! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stravinsky 206 Posted May 1, 2022 Share Posted May 1, 2022 This is my playlist of the Star Wars Concert versions. Can anyone tell me if I'm missing anything in terms of alternate/new arrangements? Cheers R https://open.spotify.com/playlist/5kewathmok03wM21Ar5rXn?si=UtlXqzrWRBOCSRi4E8OJng&utm_source=copy-link Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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