gkgyver 1,645 Posted February 2, 2018 Share Posted February 2, 2018 That track sounds like Golden Age compared to TLJ. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luke Skywalker 1,795 Posted February 2, 2018 Share Posted February 2, 2018 That's the naboo action music....it appears also in the planet core passages when the beasts are attacking the submarine...so no army, battle or vader connections there... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post crumbs 14,316 Posted February 2, 2018 Popular Post Share Posted February 2, 2018 Thought I'd chime in to wash away the tiresome, toxic negativity that pervades this thread from the usual suspects. This score is just fucking magnificent. Listened to most of the action cues again tonight on repeat and still can't believe the level of detail, vibrancy and energy contained in this score. Grateful every day that we're so lucky to be receiving not only new music from the Maestro, but music as sublime as this! A man in his mid-80s has no right to be creating music like this; as John Powell said, he puts composers half his age to shame! Joni Wiljami, Jurassic Shark, ocelot and 6 others 9 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chen G. 3,949 Posted February 2, 2018 Share Posted February 2, 2018 1 hour ago, crumbs said: the tiresome, toxic negativity that pervades this thread from the usual suspects. This score is just fucking magnificent. Because criticism is negative and toxic, whereas praise is...what exactly? Its just a good score. There's nothing truly magnificent about it, to my mind, except the way its mixed in the film (which admittedly is very important) compared to the better composed but nigh inaudible score to The Force Awakens. I quite like a few of the highlights: I like Rose's theme, and that quote of Luke and Leia I found to be really moving, but otherwise its so insistent on existing thematic material, often pulled as-is from existing cues and even concert arrangements, that I can't hail it as one of the better Star Wars scores. Again, not a bad score by any stretch of the imagination, its just fine. But one shouldn't be criticized for wanting more of out it than what it is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Demodex 557 Posted February 2, 2018 Share Posted February 2, 2018 I don't understand the love for TLJ's score, because it is mediocre for a SW score. But if people love it then that's great for them. If someone not liking the score upsets you so much, there is something wrong with you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post mstrox 6,651 Posted February 2, 2018 Popular Post Share Posted February 2, 2018 2 hours ago, crumbs said: Thought I'd chime in to wash away the tiresome, toxic negativity that pervades this thread I've pretty much stopped poking my head into all of the TLJ threads, or at least stopped bothering to reply - for this reason! I thought TLJ was really good and its score even better. I've still never met a person in real life (i.e. non-Internet) who was disappointed with TLJ, for what it's worth. John, WDG01, Falstaft and 2 others 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balahkay 627 Posted February 2, 2018 Share Posted February 2, 2018 Was a thread created for specifically discussing the thematic material in TLJ or the ST in general? I thought there was, but I can't find it... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chen G. 3,949 Posted February 2, 2018 Share Posted February 2, 2018 7 minutes ago, someonefun124 said: Was a thread created for specifically discussing the thematic material in TLJ or the ST in general? I thought there was, but I can't find it... There's a very good leitmotivic break-down of the score here: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balahkay 627 Posted February 2, 2018 Share Posted February 2, 2018 Great, thanks. This is what I remember seeing before. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chen G. 3,949 Posted February 2, 2018 Share Posted February 2, 2018 One of the things the drives me nuts about this score is the end-credits suite. There's that beautiful tribute to Carrie Fisher, which works wonders from a dramatic standpoint: after listening to all this romantic, grand orchestral music (either in just this film or this score, but certainly if you watch or listen to them in the narrative order of the works) you suddenly pull back and present an unadorned, solo piano. Its a great juxtaposition, and a first for a Star Wars score. Its brilliant! But its waaaay too short, and cuts very abruptly back to the orchestral material. I would have prefered listening to it for the rest of the end-credits, or at least for another minute or so. It would also be a much better cap to the score, rather than ending in that chimes figure from the introduction to Rey's theme. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balahkay 627 Posted February 2, 2018 Share Posted February 2, 2018 I agree about the use of Leia's theme in the end credits... it's too abrupt and short. I was originally very disappointed with the end credits suite (both OST and FYC) and while I've warmed up to both, I'm still not completely satisfied since most of it is copy/paste. The TFA end credits suite really spoiled us and set the bar high for future end credits suites. I would have preferred the end credits start with a new arrangement of Leia's theme up to her tribute followed by the new thematic material (Rose/Island/desperation themes) and end with a fanfare rendition of Rey's theme (although I do love that softer version of Rey's theme). Falstaft 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chen G. 3,949 Posted February 2, 2018 Share Posted February 2, 2018 Why this film ends with Rey's theme at all, I have no idea. The main character of the film is Luke. Rey is barely in the third act of the film: her story in this film effectively wraps up at the midpoint. Also, its weird to close the film in what is an introduction figure to a theme, rather than the "meat" of the theme or some end-cap figure, especially since the quoted figure is hardly in the score. But than, I should also confess that I have a strong dislike for that chime figure, in general. Leia's theme on piano closing the film would have been a much nicer parallel to Luke's theme closing The Force Awakens. Bofur01 and Joni Wiljami 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brundlefly 2,385 Posted February 2, 2018 Share Posted February 2, 2018 Rey's plays the most important role in the next episode, which is announced ny the chime figure at the end. It makes perfectly sense. I get the impression SW 8 is seen like HP 2 by some. Too much copy-paste, but the 80% of new music are ignored. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chen G. 3,949 Posted February 2, 2018 Share Posted February 2, 2018 41 minutes ago, Brundlefly said: Rey's plays the most important role in the next episode, which is announced ny the chime figure at the end. It makes perfectly sense. You don't know that, and neither does John Williams. So this interpretation, while you could possibly make it stick in hindsight after we see and hear Episode IX, is certainly not telling of the composer's intention. I think its more in the general line of thought of "well, Rey is the through-line of this trilogy, so I'll use her theme." Its not so much a preview to the next episode because Williams doesn't work like that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smaug The Iron 515 Posted February 2, 2018 Share Posted February 2, 2018 1 hour ago, Chen G. said: Why this film ends with Rey's theme at all, I have no idea. The main character of the film is Luke. Rey is barely in the third act of the film: her story in this film effectively wraps up at the midpoint. Also, its weird to close the film in what is an introduction figure to a theme, rather than the "meat" of the theme or some end-cap figure, especially since the quoted figure is hardly in the score. But than, I should also confess that I have a strong dislike for that chime figure, in general. Leia's theme on piano closing the film would have been a much nicer parallel to Luke's theme closing The Force Awakens. Luke is not the main character in The Force Awakens but his theme is closing the film. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chen G. 3,949 Posted February 2, 2018 Share Posted February 2, 2018 Yeah, but a) finding him is the objective of that film and b) his theme is also the "Star Wars" theme, so you can always fall back on that as far as closing the film with it goes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balahkay 627 Posted February 2, 2018 Share Posted February 2, 2018 While Williams, of course, has no idea about IX, it seems likely the film will center on the continuing dynamic of Ren and Rey, while a ghost Luke guides Rey in a supporting role (Hamill was signed on to do 3 films). There aren't really many options unless if they add more characters or focus more on the broom kid (please no). Rey already tried to get Ren to come to the light side so will she continue that or will she go to the dark side (not at all likely)? I feel like Johnson didn't leave Abrams many options to finish the trilogy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post #SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted February 2, 2018 Popular Post Share Posted February 2, 2018 Johnson gave JJ the opportunity to move Star Wars beyond what it has done before. They already did all the "seduction" to the light/dark side in this film. So JJ will have to think of another angle. There's a lot of SW tropes ep 9 cant use because ep 8 already concluded them, and i find that interesting. Holko, Tiburon, Taikomochi and 5 others 8 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aviazn 273 Posted February 2, 2018 Share Posted February 2, 2018 Just now, Stefancos said: Johnson gave JJ the opportunity to move Star Wars beyond what it has done before. They already did all the "seduction" to the light/dark side in this film. So JJ will have to think of another angle. That’s what I’m afraid of. I don’t think he’s stuck the landing in any of his original material. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balahkay 627 Posted February 2, 2018 Share Posted February 2, 2018 I have a feeling Abrams will play it safe, TLJ backlash or not. I hope to be pleasantly surprised. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chen G. 3,949 Posted February 2, 2018 Share Posted February 2, 2018 38 minutes ago, someonefun124 said: t seems likely the film will center on the continuing dynamic of Ren and Rey, while a ghost Luke guides Rey in a supporting role (Hamill was signed on to do 3 films). There aren't really many options unless if they add more characters or focus more on the broom kid (please no). Rey already tried to get Ren to come to the light side so will she continue that or will she go to the dark side (not at all likely)? I feel like Johnson didn't leave Abrams many options to finish the trilogy. You could expect one new character and/or subplot, in the very least. Screenwriters are generally tempted to make the third film about more than just the resolution of the previous two films. You always want to put some substance into it that is original to that film: e.g. the Ewoks in Return of the Jedi. Actually, because its the conclusive chapter, the temptation to make it "big" by putting more and more additional stuff and multiple storylines into it, is all the more strong. If anything, I would actually say Johnson effectively made it possible for Abrams to do whatever he desires with Episode IX, rather than ending his film in a way that directly suggests the course of the next film. Either way, that says very little of the thematic material that will end up being featured heavily in Williams next score. He could rely heavily on Rey's theme, but he might as well not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted February 2, 2018 Share Posted February 2, 2018 1 hour ago, someonefun124 said: I have a feeling Abrams will play it safe, TLJ backlash or not. I hope to be pleasantly surprised. You want JJ to play it safe? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balahkay 627 Posted February 2, 2018 Share Posted February 2, 2018 I'd like to see a good closing film, regardless of safety. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chen G. 3,949 Posted February 2, 2018 Share Posted February 2, 2018 I wouldn't expect too much. Its so easy for the third film of three to be overwrought and just not as good as at least one, if not both, of the other films. Again, stemming from the conflict between trying to write a conclusion to the previous films, and trying to write an original, stand-alone motion picture; and also from the desire to make it grand and climactic, while often still trying to shy away from true poignancy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brundlefly 2,385 Posted February 3, 2018 Share Posted February 3, 2018 I am hoping for Ep. IX to be the Star Wars film most diverging from the norm, so that it pisses all hardcore fans off even more. The climactic and nostalgic potential is fully exploited, so now to something completely different. There are trilogies whose last entry is the best: The Lord of the Rings Trilogy Dollar Trilogy Once Upon a Time... Trilogy Trilogy of Depressions Indiana Jones Trilogy (to some) Jurassic Park Trilogy (kiddin') Star Wars Prequel Trilogy (doesn't mean anything) Okay, the only coherent franchise that counts is The Lord of the Rings, but who knows. Maybe it won't be the only example for long any more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chen G. 3,949 Posted February 3, 2018 Share Posted February 3, 2018 Yeah, but The Lord of the Rings (and The Hobbit) was essentially one long script and one long movie, all made by one groupe of people, split three ways. Star Wars doesn't even have the bare-bones of the story figured out in advance, and its different episodes are made by different screen-writers and filmmakers, across a longer period of time. So it won't have that sense of a natural conclusion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jurassic Shark 12,076 Posted February 3, 2018 Share Posted February 3, 2018 I predict Ep. IX will be a remake of the now classic TFA. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post crumbs 14,316 Posted February 3, 2018 Popular Post Share Posted February 3, 2018 23 hours ago, Demodex said: If someone not liking the score upsets you so much, there is something wrong with you. It's not about getting "upset" at the fact people don't like the score. It's the fact that we can't have a single thread on a JOHN WILLIAMS FAN FORUM to discuss the score's merits without the usual suspects coming in to condescendingly inform us how wrong we are for liking it. It's derailed literally every TLJ thread on the main forum. I'm not the only poster to basically throw their hands in the air and give up discussing the score due to this; the predictable, ignorant comments about the score's "lack of originality" kill any discussion about its merits. Who gives a fuck if it quotes existing concert suites? Every bloody score in the series does this! As soon as someone started bitching about the post-Main Title ANH motif, I'd had enough -- where was all the outrage at the post-Main Title music being repeated from TPM in AOTC? And all the other various recycling that occurred throughout the prequels? Selective memory, convenient as always. The man is 85 and could have retired decades ago, like most people in their 60s. Instead, we're still fortunate enough to be receiving multiple scores a year and yet all people can do is focus on the negatives, even when presented with a score filled to the brim with brilliance! Staggering level of entitlement. Not Mr. Big, Remco, Tiburon and 10 others 13 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chen G. 3,949 Posted February 3, 2018 Share Posted February 3, 2018 49 minutes ago, crumbs said: the usual suspects coming in to condescendingly inform us how wrong we are for liking it. Who said that? Hell, I'm not even saying that I don't like it. I do! I might even like it more than The Force Awakens: its more extrovert and the mix favors it much more. But its still a lesser score among the Williams/Star Wars repertoire, and I simply try to articulate why that is, to me. I think that's a much more interesting subject for discussion (which is the goal of the forum) and a gracious debate, instead of just a series of comments that all express a similar sentiment of "Dis iz awezom!" That's not a discussion, that's a choir! 49 minutes ago, crumbs said: the predictable, ignorant comments about the score's "lack of originality" kill any discussion about its merits. Who gives a fuck if it quotes existing concert suites? I would hardly call those comments "ignorant". 49 minutes ago, crumbs said: As soon as someone started bitching about the post-Main Title ANH motif, I'd had enough. Again, who bitched about that? 49 minutes ago, crumbs said: where was all the outrage at the post-Main Title music being repeated from TPM in AOTC? And all the other various recycling that occurred throughout the prequels? Selective memory, convenient as always. Not so much convenient memory as much as it is understanding that two wrongs don't make a right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Docteur Qui 1,544 Posted February 3, 2018 Popular Post Share Posted February 3, 2018 I'm with crumbs on this one. Every single discussion about this score that I've been involved in on this forum has died a premature death. Chen, you might not want to hear it but you're one of the worst offenders. If you're not policing people's interpretations of leitmotif, you're comparing Star Wars to LOTR and how much more thematically consistent that work is. Read the room - sometimes opinions are better left unsaid, particularly if they have the potential to prevent any kind of constructive discussion. Contrary to what you may think, the majority of posts about TLJ aren't exactly "Dis iz awezom", but the conversation sure as hell can't progress past "I really like this score and here's why" when people are constantly having their opinions questioned and challenged. It's intimidating and exhausting and makes posting here unpleasant. Smaug The Iron, Remco, Tiburon and 10 others 13 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balahkay 627 Posted February 4, 2018 Share Posted February 4, 2018 I love this score and nobody can my opinion about that. crumbs and ocelot 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post artguy360 1,843 Posted February 4, 2018 Popular Post Share Posted February 4, 2018 It's gonna be a few years before we can discuss TLJ in any kind of long and interesting way because a few posters feel an instinctive urge to respond to any posts of appreciation with some form of negativity, as if the one thing the internet needs more of is negativity. Jurassic Shark, DominicCobb, Balahkay and 1 other 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom 4,658 Posted February 4, 2018 Share Posted February 4, 2018 On 2/2/2018 at 11:03 AM, Stefancos said: Johnson gave JJ the opportunity to move Star Wars beyond what it has done before. They already did all the "seduction" to the light/dark side in this film. So JJ will have to think of another angle. There's a lot of SW tropes ep 9 cant use because ep 8 already concluded them, and i find that interesting. Oh how little faith you have in the power of a plot involving time-travel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ocelot 508 Posted February 4, 2018 Share Posted February 4, 2018 I have TLJ on Repeat now as with TFA. I just wish one particular person would eventually make it longer for me.... It's the size that counts! Jurassic Shark and Bofur01 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crumbs 14,316 Posted February 4, 2018 Share Posted February 4, 2018 Especially knowing the OST only presents half the music recorded! Oh, to have Rian Johnson's iPod for a few hours... ocelot 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balahkay 627 Posted February 4, 2018 Share Posted February 4, 2018 I’m finding myself listening to the FYC more than the OST. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Docteur Qui 1,544 Posted February 4, 2018 Share Posted February 4, 2018 I'm yet to regularly listen to the FYC, mainly because some of the tracks are so all over the place (especially Escape). I also can't get past the digital artefacts in tracks that were tempo-slowed to picture (especially the sublime "Rey's Journey" which is almost unlistenable to me). I'll get around to making my own edit eventually, or listening to someone else's, but for now the OST is cool. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Nick Parker 3,040 Posted February 4, 2018 Popular Post Share Posted February 4, 2018 I mostly stick to the OST as well: it's really nice to have extended versions of tracks like "A New Alliance", but overall I really enjoy the album presentation. This score has endeared itself to me in a way that The Force Awakens hasn't...this score just feels so alive and hearty, there's a certain weight and fullness to the score that's so satisfying to listen to. I was too young to dig in to the Star Wars prequel scores when they came out, and this is the first time I've felt able to live with and discover a new Star Wars score. It's a nice feeling. ocelot, Tiburon, crumbs and 2 others 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brundlefly 2,385 Posted February 4, 2018 Share Posted February 4, 2018 6 hours ago, artguy360 said: It's gonna be a few years before we can discuss TLJ in any kind of long and interesting way because a few posters feel an instinctive urge to respond to any posts of appreciation with some form of negativity, as if the one thing the internet needs more of is negativity. Let's say there's a line, at least in this thread, which seperates the discussion about bitching and negativity from the actual discussion about the music. Behind that line there's just serious and peaceful, but also critical and ambitious discussion, no bitching or insulting or anything else like that. ---------------------------------------------------------------- To be honest, my favourite theme that is introduced in TLJ is the Desperation Theme. I have a faible for solo horns and the big intervall jumps in the melody as well as the fact that it is not so catchy make it one of my all time favourites, I guess. Too bad the cue before Chrome Dome is not on the OST, but at least we have a revision in the end credits suite. crumbs 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
artguy360 1,843 Posted February 4, 2018 Share Posted February 4, 2018 I'm not very high on TLJ score myself but there are parts I enjoy and I am more than able to acknowledge and discuss the positives rather than linger on the negatives. I do hope we get a complete release at some point. Right now the FYC is a bit of a mess and the audio quality is too poor to make it an adequate substitute to any track on the OST. I feel like an entirely different presentation of the score could be arranged with a greater focus on the Resistance and all the material surrounding the "space chase" stuff. crumbs 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post crumbs 14,316 Posted February 4, 2018 Popular Post Share Posted February 4, 2018 Absolutely, there's a bucketload of original music that's unreleased, including heaps of variations on TLJ's new themes, that Williams omitted from the OST in favour of older material (like multiple variations on Yoda's Theme and Leia's Theme). Ironically this is a complete 180 on Williams' usual methodology with sequels, where he seemingly goes out of his way to omit older material and focus on the new. Admittedly he's always been inconsistent in this regard, happy to include note-for-note reprisals (like Qui-Gon's Funeral, The Duel or The Throne Room in ROTS or Revisiting The Ark in KOTCS) but omitting the interesting variations on older material like Padme's Funeral or They Weren't You, Honey or The Waterfall. It's a little disappointing the Desperation Theme gets such little love on the OST. Further showing its versatility, here's a touching variation as Leia farewells Holdo: Then there's some fantastic unreleased material either side of Chrome Dome, including an incredible version of Rose's Theme as Finn & Rose escape the Supremacy: Williams' writing here is note-perfect, especially the dark music as Phasma gives her final glance to Finn. I feel the OST doesn't give the most accurate impression of the film's complete score, with an unusually heavy focus on older themes rather than new ones. Holko, Smaug The Iron, ocelot and 1 other 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Docteur Qui 1,544 Posted February 4, 2018 Popular Post Share Posted February 4, 2018 "Chrome Dome" really is something special joined to the visuals. I've never much enjoyed Williams hitting sync points so frequently in some of his cues (that whole Mickey Mousing thing) but something about this cue is different. I think it's because the harmonies and orchestrations are so heavy and brutal, it makes the music take on a gravity of its own and you can feel every swing and hit of the fight. That last chord especially just hits so hard. It's hard to describe, but it's a similar thing in "A New Alliance". Separate from the visuals the music doesn't work so well; it's so disjointed and uneven. But on-screen it fits incredibly well with the fight between Rey, Kylo and the guards. Holko, Falstaft, Smaug The Iron and 1 other 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post ocelot 508 Posted February 4, 2018 Popular Post Share Posted February 4, 2018 21 hours ago, crumbs said: Absolutely, there's a bucketload of original music that's unreleased, including heaps of variations on TLJ's new themes, that Williams omitted from the OST in favour of older material (like multiple variations on Yoda's Theme and Leia's Theme). Ironically this is a complete 180 on Williams' usual methodology with sequels, where he seemingly goes out of his way to omit older material and focus on the new. Admittedly he's always been inconsistent in this regard, happy to include note-for-note reprisals (like Qui-Gon's Funeral, The Duel or The Throne Room in ROTS or Revisiting The Ark in KOTCS) but omitting the interesting variations on older material like Padme's Funeral or They Weren't You, Honey or The Waterfall. It's a little disappointing the Desperation Theme gets such little love on the OST. Further showing its versatility, here's a touching variation as Leia farewells Holdo: Then there's some fantastic unreleased material either side of Chrome Dome, including an incredible version of Rose's Theme as Finn & Rose escape the Supremacy: Williams' writing here is note-perfect, especially the dark music as Phasma gives her final glance to Finn. I feel the OST doesn't give the most accurate impression of the film's complete score, with an unusually heavy focus on older themes rather than new ones. Yaaassss!!!!! (Sorry, the gay came out of me) Ha! Aaaand it's back in, And Scene! 21 hours ago, Docteur Qui said: "Chrome Dome" really is something special joined to the visuals. I've never much enjoyed Williams hitting sync points so frequently in some of his cues (that whole Mickey Mousing thing) but something about this cue is different. I think it's because the harmonies and orchestrations are so heavy and brutal, it makes the music take on a gravity of its own and you can feel every swing and hit of the fight. That last chord especially just hits so hard. It's hard to describe, but it's a similar thing in "A New Alliance". Separate from the visuals the music doesn't work so well; it's so disjointed and uneven. But on-screen it fits incredibly well with the fight between Rey, Kylo and the guards. I think his Mickey Mousing is fantastic. I'm hating this new thing of scoring against the film over and over. It's a fantastic thing to do... at times..., but I think it's also lazy as if certain composers cannot do anything but write a wet blanket's worth of sound, but I agree that there is something unique in Chrome Dome. Love the harmonies and orchestrations there as well. Docteur Qui, Jurassic Shark, Smaug The Iron and 1 other 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post crumbs 14,316 Posted February 4, 2018 Popular Post Share Posted February 4, 2018 1 minute ago, Docteur Qui said: "Chrome Dome" really is something special joined to the visuals. I've never much enjoyed Williams hitting sync points so frequently in some of his cues (that whole Mickey Mousing thing) but something about this cue is different. I think it's because the harmonies and orchestrations are so heavy and brutal, it makes the music take on a gravity of its own and you can feel every swing and hit of the fight. That last chord especially just hits so hard. Yes! I only timestamped the unreleased section in the YouTube video above, but that entire sequence just blows me away musically. Williams is hitting so many sync points, and it's relatively intact musically, not butchered Abrams style. The Desperation Theme over the wide shot of the shuttle bay is sublime, transitioning into the march over Phasma's badass entrance, seguing into the Rebel Fanfare, then the down-and-dirty percussion as the fight begins. Then it's just one sync point after another, notably Phasma clocking Finn as he falls backwards, then the trumpet flourishes that seemingly match every shot of Phasma's rifle, then the perfect closing hit of brass & percussion as Finn clocks Phasma. And the entire cue is effortless! Again, how on earth is an 85 year old writing music like this? Such a fun amalgamation of Williams' action writing of the 90s and 00s. John, Holko, Smaug The Iron and 3 others 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Docteur Qui 1,544 Posted February 4, 2018 Share Posted February 4, 2018 12 minutes ago, ocelot said: I think his Mickey Mousing is fantastic. I'm hating this new thing of scoring against the film over and over. It's a fantastic thing to do, but I think it's also lazy as if certain composers cannot do anything but write a wet blanket's worth of sound, but I agree that there is something unique in Chrome Dome. Love the harmonies and orchestrations there as well. Each to their own and all that, but I should clarify that I don't have an inherent problem with Mickey Mousing, particularly in light-hearted films and scenes. But a fight scene like the one above could have come across as cheesy if Williams hadn't have made the decisions he did. Either way you look at it, we can agree that he nailed it this time round. ocelot and Breadstick Basilisk 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
artguy360 1,843 Posted February 4, 2018 Share Posted February 4, 2018 If anyone knows how to Mickey Mouse properly, it's JW. ocelot and Breadstick Basilisk 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ocelot 508 Posted February 4, 2018 Share Posted February 4, 2018 21 minutes ago, Docteur Qui said: Each to their own and all that, but I should clarify that I don't have an inherent problem with Mickey Mousing, particularly in light-hearted films and scenes. But a fight scene like the one above could have come across as cheesy if Williams hadn't have made the decisions he did. Either way you look at it, we can agree that he nailed it this time round. Oh I agree totally!!! If the Mickey Mousing here hadn't been totally angry and crunchy, it would have been totally cheesy! That's why I love how he does it! Docteur Qui 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chen G. 3,949 Posted February 4, 2018 Share Posted February 4, 2018 14 hours ago, Docteur Qui said: Chen, you might not want to hear it but you're one of the worst offenders. If you're not policing people's interpretations of leitmotif, you're comparing Star Wars to LOTR and how much more thematically consistent that work is. Read the room - sometimes opinions are better left unsaid, particularly if they have the potential to prevent any kind of constructive discussion. Contrary to what you may think, the majority of posts about TLJ aren't exactly "Dis iz awezom", but the conversation sure as hell can't progress past "I really like this score and here's why" when people are constantly having their opinions questioned and challenged. It's intimidating and exhausting and makes posting here unpleasant. Why would I not want to hear it? As long as we are not going into ad hominem territory or profanities, nothing is "better left unsaid", nothing is off of the table, and "questioning and challenging" others views (including my own) are par for the course, if not the very purpose of the board. That is the very nature of what a discussion is. If that intimidates you, than, you might not want to hear it, but you are not ready to have a discussion. I have no problem with the claim "I really like this score and here's why". A good example would be this: 4 hours ago, Docteur Qui said: "Chrome Dome" really is something special joined to the visuals. I've never much enjoyed Williams hitting sync points so frequently in some of his cues (that whole Mickey Mousing thing) but something about this cue is different. I think it's because the harmonies and orchestrations are so heavy and brutal, it makes the music take on a gravity of its own and you can feel every swing and hit of the fight. That last chord especially just hits so hard. I actually agree (although I have a cordial dislike for the actual sequence in the film) but, you must admit, this kind of articulation of why you like the things you like is the exception, not the rule, as far as this thread is considered. Rather, the "here's why" clause is often left by the wayside. Docteur Qui 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Nick Parker 3,040 Posted February 4, 2018 Popular Post Share Posted February 4, 2018 With all due respect amigo, I think there's a difference between raising a dissenting opinion and adding nuance to a conversation (or a "discussion", as you say). Reading a thread on The Last Jedi movie and seeing you say "The problem with the film is it's subversive to be surprising, and is not dramatically satisfying" over and over, for example adds little for me. I can apply similar complaints for threads focusing around the score. You criticise this thread for being superficial, but citing the same issues you have over and over is, as has been mentioned, off-putting and the same thing you claim to want to avoid. You think people should give more to this thread rather than simply stating banal "I like this score, it's good"? Why don't you ask people directly to expand their comments? Conversation and dialogue isn't a chess match (that in this case has the first pawn being moved from starting position again and again). I was talking with a pretty intense Christian the other day, and I disagree with a number of tenets and ideas held within theiatic religions. But when he would share something regarding his philosophy, I didn't just keep saying, "Yeah, well science proved that wrong." "Mmm, you sure about that?" He was really passionate about this stuff, so I asked him more questions, as I wanted to actually have a conversation with him, and see how his perspectives contributed to who he was as a person. Every once in a while I would bring in my own religion and compare an idea to what he would say, and state my differing perspective...and ya know what, we had an awesome conversation, and left it with a higher understanding and respect for one another. Chen G., Holko, DominicCobb and 4 others 7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brundlefly 2,385 Posted February 4, 2018 Share Posted February 4, 2018 @Chen G. OVER THE LINE! It worked longer than I expected. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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