fililando 19 Posted April 14, 2018 Share Posted April 14, 2018 Good evening, I was score reading some ROTS cues and I found this trombones passage which recalled me the Elegy for Cello. I'd like to know where Williams quotes himself, uses similar motives, orchestration, etc. in his works. Both consciously (like in E.T. with Yoda's theme) or unconsciously. Ricard 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corellian2019 387 Posted April 14, 2018 Share Posted April 14, 2018 The "Ark of the Covenant" theme in The Last Crusade Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Naïve Old Fart 9,636 Posted April 14, 2018 Share Posted April 14, 2018 THE LONG GOODBYE, in CANTO BIGHT. JW also rerecorded MAGGIE SHOOTS POOL, for use in the Promenade Room scenes, in THE TOWERING INFERNO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smeltington 1,441 Posted April 14, 2018 Share Posted April 14, 2018 Esplanade Overture in the score for Monsignor. Several pieces of other scores were "borrowed" for Chamber of Secrets. And the troll cue from HP1 borrows from Home Alone... 2, I think? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
artguy360 1,844 Posted April 14, 2018 Share Posted April 14, 2018 Yoda's theme in ET. Duel of the Fates and ESB Vader vs Luke music in ROTS. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John 2,032 Posted April 14, 2018 Share Posted April 14, 2018 There’s a bit of music at 1:40 in “Emperor’s Throne Room” that sounds like Key’s theme from E.T. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt S. 496 Posted April 14, 2018 Share Posted April 14, 2018 Quotes from Jaws and CE3K appear in the score to 1941. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrScratch 294 Posted April 15, 2018 Share Posted April 15, 2018 The Basket Chase in Temple Of Doom. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex 2,836 Posted April 15, 2018 Share Posted April 15, 2018 There are some parts in The Quidditch Match and Ludlow’s Demise (around 1.36) which are very similar Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Kühni 485 Posted April 15, 2018 Popular Post Share Posted April 15, 2018 War of the Worlds in Kingdom of the Crystal Skull. Ricardo Mortimer, Chewy and Arpy 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thor 7,582 Posted April 15, 2018 Share Posted April 15, 2018 Some of the titles mentioned here are just assumptions made by the poster, not confirmed references: Quote THE LONG GOODBYE, in CANTO BIGHT. And the troll cue from HP1 borrows from Home Alone... 2, I think? There are some parts in The Quidditch Match and Ludlow’s Demise (around 1.36) which are very similar War of the Worlds in Kingdom of the Crystal Skull. I'm tempted to say "Make Me Rainbows" from FITZWILLY and "In the Moonlight" from SABRINA, but again, I'm unsure if it's an intended reuse of the melody. There's a 'silent film' motif in THE KATHERINE REED STORY which he reused for his 'silent film montage'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted April 15, 2018 Share Posted April 15, 2018 Jabba's theme in TPM. Mitth'raw'nuorodo 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josh500 1,615 Posted April 15, 2018 Share Posted April 15, 2018 Just now, Stefancos said: Jabba's theme in TPM. Is that quoting himself? It's the same franchise! So this theme from the Star Wars cannon was just used. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted April 15, 2018 Share Posted April 15, 2018 Its the only time JW used that thene outside ROTJ. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Chen G. 3,990 Posted April 15, 2018 Popular Post Share Posted April 15, 2018 I wouldn't call using leitmotives as "quoting oneself", especially when they're varied and used in narrativelly appropriate situations. I would say however that intentionally quoting a specific variation in verbatim would count as quoting, like the Imperial March variation from Bespin in Revenge of the Sith, or Leia's and Yoda's themes from the concert arrangements in The Last Jedi. On the flipside, I'd also not dub using a little generic phrase or chord progression as "quoting oneself". Its more of an issue of style. Quotes need to be a little more substantive (like the aforementioned "Long Goodbye" quote in The Last Jedi) or, at least, much more persisent throughout a large portion of one's body of work: e.g. Horner's "danger" gestures. There's also a discussion to be had on whether specific timbral and orchestrational choices constitute "quoting". fililando, TheUlyssesian, Ricard and 1 other 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jurassic Shark 12,162 Posted April 15, 2018 Share Posted April 15, 2018 2 hours ago, Thor said: I'm tempted to say "Make Me Rainbows" from FITZWILLY and "In the Moonlight" from SABRINA, but again, I'm unsure if it's an intended reuse of the melody. I think this if fairly certain without the need for a confirmation. He probably went back to his roots to find something which could fit in Sabrina. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jilal 569 Posted April 15, 2018 Share Posted April 15, 2018 16 hours ago, fililando said: Good evening, I was score reading some ROTS cues and I found this trombones passage which recalled me the Elegy for Cello. I'd like to know where Williams quotes himself, uses similar motives, orchestration, etc. in his works. Both consciously (like in E.T. with Yoda's theme) or unconsciously. Is that the cue underscoring the Anakin & Obi-Wan vs. Dooku duel? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thor 7,582 Posted April 15, 2018 Share Posted April 15, 2018 Quote I think this if fairly certain without the need for a confirmation. He probably went back to his roots to find something which could fit in Sabrina. Could be, but they're not 100% identical. Also -- and correct me if I'm wrong -- doesn't he reuse material from AN UNFINISHED JOURNEY in A TIMELESS CALL? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jurassic Shark 12,162 Posted April 15, 2018 Share Posted April 15, 2018 2 hours ago, Thor said: Could be, but they're not 100% identical. No, but if a musicologist was to analyze the similarities of the two songs, the conclusion would likely be that Moonlight is a version or a variation of Rainbows. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Kasey Kockroach 2,345 Posted April 15, 2018 Popular Post Share Posted April 15, 2018 "According to myself, I'm the greatest composer of all time." -John Williams quoting himself Jurassic Shark, Mitth'raw'nuorodo and Josh500 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fililando 19 Posted April 16, 2018 Author Share Posted April 16, 2018 20 hours ago, Chen G. said: I wouldn't call using leitmotives as "quoting oneself", especially when they're varied and used in narrativelly appropriate situations. I would say however that intentionally quoting a specific variation in verbatim would count as quoting, like the Imperial March variation from Bespin in Revenge of the Sith, or Leia's and Yoda's themes from the concert arrangements in The Last Jedi. On the flipside, I'd also not dub using a little generic phrase or chord progression as "quoting oneself". Its more of an issue of style. Quotes need to be a little more substantive (like the aforementioned "Long Goodbye" quote in The Last Jedi) or, at least, much more persisent throughout a large portion of one's body of work: e.g. Horner's "danger" gestures. There's also a discussion to be had on whether specific timbral and orchestrational choices constitute "quoting". Thanks for this reply! That's what I meant: the issue of style. Maybe quotes wasn't the right word. I'd like to discover melodic sequences that Williams, because of his style, uses unintentionally (or for sure he notices similarities but keep them because it's a matter of style and inner voice). I am sorry if I still can't explain what I really want to say. For example, there's a part on Hook score which melodically reminds me a lot the Harry Potter one. I don't remember the exact point, I'll post here once I have time to listen to it. 20 hours ago, Jilal said: Is that the cue underscoring the Anakin & Obi-Wan vs. Dooku duel? This is the "Death of Dooku" cue Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jurassic Shark 12,162 Posted April 16, 2018 Share Posted April 16, 2018 "Duu-du-du-duuuu, duu-du-duuuu, duu-du-du-duuuu, duu-du-duu-duu-duuuu!" -John Williams quoting the Raiders March Mitth'raw'nuorodo 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smeltington 1,441 Posted April 16, 2018 Share Posted April 16, 2018 5 hours ago, fililando said: I'd like to discover melodic sequences that Williams, because of his style, uses unintentionally (or for sure he notices similarities but keep them because it's a matter of style and inner voice). There are at least a few of these that appear over and over again. Somebody pointed this out, I think it was last year, how prevalent a certain descending phrase from Flag Parade is in his work. It's in Hook (Granny Wendy?), it appears in HP1, Munich, and quite a few other places. Sorry I don't have time at the moment to think of more examples with timestamps, or find that thread. People have also noticed the similarity between Across the Stars and the Hook prologue, and this has to do especially with a 5-note phrase that Williams uses in both. He also uses it in a ton of other themes, like Jane Eyre (just the first four notes), Fawkes the Phoenix, and many more. Maybe later I'll have time to post YouTube samples. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chen G. 3,990 Posted April 16, 2018 Share Posted April 16, 2018 Also, the kind of resmeblence that people hear between Rose's theme and Anakin's. The similarity there stems from the style which Williams uses to convey youthfulness in his themes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tallguy 3,424 Posted April 16, 2018 Share Posted April 16, 2018 On 4/15/2018 at 3:39 AM, Stefancos said: Its the only time JW used that thene outside ROTJ. It's the only time Jabba appeared outside of ROTJ. Williams only used Luke and Leia once outside of ROTJ as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted April 16, 2018 Share Posted April 16, 2018 Exactly! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom 4,685 Posted April 16, 2018 Share Posted April 16, 2018 Battle of the Heroes in TLJ death of Paige scene. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jurassic Shark 12,162 Posted April 16, 2018 Share Posted April 16, 2018 Well, she was a hero. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KingPin 201 Posted April 17, 2018 Share Posted April 17, 2018 Dry Your Tears Afrika being quoted in both The Patriot theme and in the “Civil Rights and the Women’s Movement” Part of The Unfinished Journey stands out for me. Also the Land Race from Far and Away being quoted in the first movement of The Unfinished Journey. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Illustrious Jerry 3,356 Posted April 26, 2018 Share Posted April 26, 2018 Good lord 7:50-8:30 something in the background sounds like its straight out of "Chrome Dome" or Escape. I can't find the corresponding track, but I just saw the movie and the scene where the daughter is looking straight into the eye of the machine has a more obvious quote, of what is almost exactly the horn trills and flares in this: fililando and Jurassic Shark 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gruesome Son of a Bitch 6,489 Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 Snoke sounds like the film version insert from the approach to Pankot Palace. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ricardo Mortimer 43 Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 On 14. 4. 2018 at 11:27 PM, Richard said: THE LONG GOODBYE, in CANTO BIGHT. JW also rerecorded MAGGIE SHOOTS POOL, for use in the Promenade Room scenes, in THE TOWERING INFERNO. Where is Canto Bight in The Long Goodbye? Please YT link. Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Naïve Old Fart 9,636 Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 I'm watching it later. I'll get back to you with a time. I think that it's in the fathier chase. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pellaeon 593 Posted May 6, 2018 Share Posted May 6, 2018 Sounds a bit like Luke’s Theme in the trumpet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gruesome Son of a Bitch 6,489 Posted May 10, 2018 Share Posted May 10, 2018 The Immolation Scene sounds similar to Saying Goodbye from Amazing Stories: The Mission. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Rick 1,157 Posted February 12, 2019 Share Posted February 12, 2019 Race to the Room / Hot Pursuit has a cue starting at 2:30 and again at 2:50 that sounds similar to The Basket Game and/or Indy's First Adventure, but can't quite place where. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ins 42 Posted February 13, 2019 Share Posted February 13, 2019 Circus Train at 5:30 bears some familiarity: https://youtu.be/u8sxMFoPGsM Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now