DigitalfreakNYC 59 Posted October 27, 2019 Share Posted October 27, 2019 I know I'm probably gonna get slaughtered for this but here it goes: I think this is absolutely freakin' incredible. I've been listening to it all day. It's based around the rendition from the Rise of Skywalker trailer and I just find it amazing. I'm sure this will be considered heresy but it's a Williams/Zimmer mash-up that just hits me in the right place. Modern and yet, not. I'd love to hear an actual orchestral version of this. Thoughts? Smaug The Iron and Fargo 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arpy 4,145 Posted October 27, 2019 Share Posted October 27, 2019 I'll give him props for using the other section of the main title that's rarely used, however it was just plain, vanilla trailer music. Montre 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Bayesian 1,363 Posted October 27, 2019 Popular Post Share Posted October 27, 2019 I look forward to the day when the Zimmer sound is considered as badly dated as the reverb-heavy ‘80s synth sound. Montre, gkgyver and Tydirium 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dixon Hill 4,234 Posted October 27, 2019 Share Posted October 27, 2019 Why? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrbellamy 6,287 Posted October 27, 2019 Share Posted October 27, 2019 Just to make you mad! Will and Dixon Hill 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Montre 79 Posted October 27, 2019 Share Posted October 27, 2019 3 hours ago, DigitalfreakNYC said: Modern and yet, not. I'd love to hear an actual orchestral version of this. Thoughts? I’m so ready for people to leave this style behind honestly. I get that it’s supposed to sound epic, but it’s just so tired at this point. Orchestral music the way Williams writes is timeless, and this stuff will sound so dated in less than a decade. This would also sound very bad with an actual orchestra. It’s not really written idiomatically for instruments at all. It’s a pop/rock arrangement of JW’s themes, using virtual orchestral instruments. But that’s the standard sound of this hybrid sort of style. Tydirium and Gnome in Plaid 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arpy 4,145 Posted October 27, 2019 Share Posted October 27, 2019 I don't get the Zimmer association when this type of trailer garbage pops up, it's not his style or sound at all. gkgyver 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Fabulin 3,512 Posted October 27, 2019 Popular Post Share Posted October 27, 2019 I dislike the naming of this style of music "epic". Rózsa's was epic. LOTR was epic.This is just synth noisefest. Tydirium, Montre, gkgyver and 1 other 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Gruesome Son of a Bitch 6,488 Posted October 27, 2019 Popular Post Share Posted October 27, 2019 7 hours ago, DigitalfreakNYC said: I know I'm probably gonna get slaughtered for this but here it goes: Hego-Damask-II, MikeH, Bayesian and 1 other 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quintus 5,399 Posted October 27, 2019 Share Posted October 27, 2019 6 hours ago, Bayesian said: I look forward to the day when the Zimmer sound is considered as badly dated as the reverb-heavy ‘80s synth sound. A fair chunk of his work already does sound badly dated. I like Zimmer, I'm a big fan of his. But his design choices mean he'll only ever be a pop composer. My beloved Interstellar soundtrack, which at points sounds so awesomely state of the art, will in twenty years time diminish to quaint synth ditty status. Some here will remember how cutting edge Oxygène sounded forty years ago. Now it sounds like kitsch prog pop. This of course is why John Williams is timeless and Hans Zimmer isn't. Bayesian and SteveMc 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Montre 79 Posted October 27, 2019 Share Posted October 27, 2019 9 hours ago, Modest Expectations said: I dislike the naming of this style of music "epic". Rózsa's was epic. LOTR was epic.This is just synth noisefest. I agree fully! Those are epic in the real sense of the word. I would describe trailer music as “epic” (well, that’s what it’s going for at least) in the overused sense of the word, and also because there’s really no other purpose to that music beyond trying to hype people up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fabulin 3,512 Posted October 27, 2019 Share Posted October 27, 2019 . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dixon Hill 4,234 Posted October 27, 2019 Share Posted October 27, 2019 10 hours ago, Quintus said: This of course is why John Williams is timeless and Hans Zimmer isn't. That's classic JWFan bullshit though. The currency of John's compositional mannerisms is as subject to an expiration date as that of Hans' or any other composer and both have works that have now passed the date. Music being timeless has nothing to do with its sound but its ability to communicate with the listener and in that regard I think both of them can feel secure about their ongoing legacy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gruesome Son of a Bitch 6,488 Posted October 27, 2019 Share Posted October 27, 2019 Horner and Goldsmith were better anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Quintus 5,399 Posted October 27, 2019 Popular Post Share Posted October 27, 2019 39 minutes ago, Dixon Hill said: That's classic JWFan bullshit though. The currency of John's compositional mannerisms is as subject to an expiration date as that of Hans' or any other composer and both have works that have now passed the date. Perhaps it is, but in the here and now, John's music (as written for orchestra) sounds about as "dated" to me as Tchaikovsky's, or Walton's - which is to say that by and large it isn't dated much at all. Probably because the sound of a real orchestra will always be current. Quote Music being timeless has nothing to do with its sound I disagree with this on a fundamental level because I'm of school of thought that believes aesthetics sit at the top of the hierarchical pecking order when thinking about the lasting impact of music. Hans Zimmer chooses to harness new technologies when producing his sound, which inherently places his music strictly in the here and now. In the short term it sounds cool and occasionally maverick, but in the end technology is replaced by technology - and obsolescence bleeds into the synths and samples that once made the harmonies and rhythms feel so resonant and exciting. In the end, productions turn into the quaint and the kitsch, soundtracking from bygone times. I think Jeff Wayne's The War of the Worlds is a good example of this. Still an enjoyable album, but very much a product of its time. We can listen along to it, quite patronisingly. Orchestral or symphonic music, while not completely immune to the pitfalls mentioned (Williams has written certain pieces which feel stylistically dated), fares far better than "pop scoring" simply by virtue of it being untethered from technology. Because pure accousic sound is intrinsically timeless. Anyway. I listened to the track in the OP. The only way I can describe it is epically generic. That's not to say I don't enjoy it, because I do. Guilty pleasure written all over it, I'd like to hear a fully orchestral version of the arrangement. Jurassic Shark, SteveMc, Montre and 2 others 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post mrbellamy 6,287 Posted October 27, 2019 Popular Post Share Posted October 27, 2019 I don't know if I fully go along with all of that, as far as separating the "orchestra" from "technology". That seems like a bit of a fallacy to me...every instrument in the orchestra is a piece of technology, but one that's been perfected over centuries in concert with its neighbors. The difference with Zimmer is maybe that he's often dealing with introducing tech into the orchestra that's brand new, not time-tested. You never know what'll stick. Williams is usually a little more cautious about that...the "Hedwig's Theme" celesta and the Munich "pulse" are aging pretty nicely. Monsieur Desplat still has my favorite comments on this subject. I've posted this video a few times on here, worth watching to the end. Montre, Arpy, Will and 3 others 4 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quintus 5,399 Posted October 27, 2019 Share Posted October 27, 2019 Do you plug a trumpet or an oboe into an electric socket? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrbellamy 6,287 Posted October 27, 2019 Share Posted October 27, 2019 I know what you’re talking about but I just don’t think it’s theoretically that wild for certain electronic instruments to eventually become perfected and accepted as orchestral standards over many years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quintus 5,399 Posted October 27, 2019 Share Posted October 27, 2019 Oh I reckon that's possible in the near future. But unfortunately for Hans he doesn't have those tools at his disposal right now (and he probably isn't bothered anyway). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dixon Hill 4,234 Posted October 28, 2019 Share Posted October 28, 2019 5 hours ago, Quintus said: I disagree with this on a fundamental level because I'm of school of thought that believes aesthetics sit at the top of the hierarchical pecking order when thinking about the lasting impact of music. Aye we're looking at it very differently then. On a brief timeline it may be fair to say that's true - though consider how many would disagree about the orchestra always sounding timeless, citing even recent Williams scores as being too classical or old fashioned, whatever you see in YouTube comments - but in the longer term I think style gets shaken off and what's actually underneath determines if it's still living in people's minds as vibrant and meaningful. Oxygène may not sound cutting edge anymore but I would hardly reduce it to mere kitsch as a consequence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post samuelkimmusic 6 Posted November 29, 2019 Popular Post Share Posted November 29, 2019 Thanks for sharing! I do agree with most of the comments here. My arrangement is a very generic/plain trailer music trash for sure. Sounds like a Lexus commercial music. lol I just spent 3 hours orchestrating this piece for fun since the final trailer music was very popular at the time, but I think the arrangement gave star wars fans a nostalgic impact. If I spent a couple more days and had a budget for an orchestra, I think the song could've sounded a bit better, honoring John Williams' musical legacy... As a composer, I'm constantly studying John Williams' scores because it is so timeless and beautiful. Anyways thanks to those who listened to the track and gave feedback! Oswin Pond, Fabulin, Quintus and 3 others 4 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheUlyssesian 2,478 Posted November 29, 2019 Share Posted November 29, 2019 Sounds like gutter trash garbage. Here's the reason - Besides the main theme on the piano, the rest is literally template library 'epic' major key nonsense. You could literally replace the star wars theme on piano with almost any other theme on piano. What's carrying the track is your power anthem backing. It is so reductive to melody because it denigrates it to just a 'front vocal' or something. As if this is some kind of bullshit pop track produced in a the garage in 10 mins. What Williams did was creating something beautiful and artful and complex with all the different parts working in harmony to elevate the melody to the status that we all love. This kind of reductive shit is insulting to Williams' art. TolkienSS 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Fabulin 3,512 Posted November 29, 2019 Popular Post Share Posted November 29, 2019 On 29/11/2019 at 9:48 PM, TheUlyssesian said: This kind of reductive shit is insulting to Williams' art. How can you trash someone who literally said he worked on this as an exercise, and for mere 3 hours? Not everyone is a Shostakovich. Let people have fun with Williams' music the way they see it. It is a testament to his legacy that composers in training are using his themes as a basis for personal experimentation, whatever its goals might be. Oswin Pond, toothless, Fargo and 2 others 4 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fargo 297 Posted November 29, 2019 Share Posted November 29, 2019 It’s a pretty misguided viewpoint to think Williams would be insulted because someone was inspired by his music. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Arpy 4,145 Posted November 29, 2019 Popular Post Share Posted November 29, 2019 I love it, Samuel comes over here and explains his work and the very next post to follow is Ulyssesian utterly shitting over it. C'mon man, have some decency. I don't like this trailerized music, but I can recognize and appreciate that at least there was some thought behind it. In effect, it's harmless, it isn't ruining any legacy, nor is it insulting to Williams (who had to endure the disco versions of the day). This is just how composers/arrangers like Samuel are paying homage, experimenting etc. Oswin Pond, Bofur01 and Tydirium 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beautyiseverywhere 0 Posted January 20, 2020 Share Posted January 20, 2020 I just discovered Samuel Kim’s music and I think he has great potential. If you haven’t listened to his album The Rise of Skywalker-the Force Theme, I think you’re missing out. His music sounds a lot like Zimmer and Horner yes, but composers are supposed to have their own unique sound otherwise they would all sound the same. His music is a departure from John Williams classic orchestra which is why I love it. He blends the subtle main theme music over other melodies to create a rich complex piece of music. The song Across the Stars sounds particularly influenced by James Horner Braveheart soundtrack. You can tell he is influenced by many movie composers and he has a few great gems. I would love to hear his music in the Clone Wars or the Mandalorian. *I went back to listen to his scores again and do a quick comparison. The song I mentioned the Force Theme actually has a very similar melody to the track Time in Inception’s soundtrack and Across the Stars sounds very similar to the melody found in Secret Wedding of Braveheart. What It sounds like is an overlay to create a mashup of two composers melodies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post gkgyver 1,645 Posted January 20, 2020 Popular Post Share Posted January 20, 2020 On 11/30/2019 at 12:36 AM, Fargo said: It’s a pretty misguided viewpoint to think Williams would be insulted because someone was inspired by his music. Giacchino begs to differ. Hego-Damask-II, Tydirium and MikeH 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fabulin 3,512 Posted July 30, 2020 Share Posted July 30, 2020 . Tydirium 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pando 141 Posted July 31, 2020 Share Posted July 31, 2020 6 hours ago, Fabulin said: Several unrelated people shared this recently with me, and it's quite nice actually... I could not shut this off fast enough right at the 0:15 mark. gkgyver 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LB Makes Stuff 240 Posted November 13, 2023 Share Posted November 13, 2023 Did he die or something? He hasn’t uploaded in like a year, which is pretty odd to me considering he was pumping bland crap out every other week. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TolkienSS 407 Posted November 13, 2023 Share Posted November 13, 2023 On 29/11/2019 at 10:05 PM, Fabulin said: How can you trash someone who literally said he worked on this as an exercise, and for mere 3 hours? Not everyone is a Shostakovich. And not enough people are trying. Suro-Zet 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Penna 3,689 Posted November 13, 2023 Share Posted November 13, 2023 On 27/10/2019 at 1:16 AM, DigitalfreakNYC said: I'm sure this will be considered heresy but it's a Williams/Zimmer mash-up that just hits me in the right place. Oh, if you want heresy, try this: in what way is the SW theme itself (not the orchestrations, just the basic melody itself of the main 'A' part) not a power anthem? It knocks you over the head with a simple, memorable melody. The difference is the orchestration where there's always more going on in the 'craftsmanship' world than with Williams than with Zimmer, et al. I'd strongly argue that Zimmer (for example) has far more talent at melody than naysayers want to admit, but the difference is that most of the time he approaches the instrumentation in a completely different way to Williams, and that's where the difference lies. On 13/11/2023 at 11:53 AM, TolkienSS said: And not enough people are trying. Imagine if someone entered the scene who was supremely gifted at composing amazing, evocative melodies, but couldn't understand classical orchestration to save their life. I'd rather hear what they had to offer, in a suitable project, instead of deciding their stuff was 'trash' because they can't write for a symphony orchestra. Or their circumstance doesn't allow them to write/record with a huge orchestra, so they use what they have instead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post mstrox 6,651 Posted November 14, 2023 Popular Post Share Posted November 14, 2023 I’d stop sharing my work too if people were as shitty to me as a few of the above. Knight of Ren, Richard Penna and ragoz350 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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