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Indiana Jones and the Temple of Doom appreciation thread (film & score)


Jurassic Shark

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3 hours ago, Jurassic Shark said:

I was thinking about perhaps the most implausible sequence - the falling raft - after reading some negative takes on it. And I have to say it's never bothered me. It's an exhilarating escape and I have no problem accepting the implausability of it, unlike the nuked fridge of Crystal Skull. 

You can argue if this was more implausible than the jump of the lore or Indy stopping the lore just with his shue soles. But the scene with the falling raft came after we had a few years earlier that scene where Luke Skywalker falls into the abyss in Cloud City. And this was really comparably dumb.

 

This movie fell into Spieberg's early post E.T. phase were there always had to be these kids in his movies what I didn't like. And Willie is really annoying. Spielberg was in love.

 

Anyway, the movie was pleasantly different from the first one, the opening is the best of any Indy movie and the score is fantastic.

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Parade of the Slave Children (Slave Children’s Crusade?) is perhaps the theme that best represents sweeping high adventure on an exotic global scale for the entire series. 
 

Anyone know why it has the two titles?

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58 minutes ago, Thor said:

I always believed it could sustain more minutes. Well, fastforward a few years and I got hold of the expanded boot, and subsequently the expanded Concorde release. Well, they both deflated my initial feeling. It did NOT stand up to an expanded presentation.

 

Expectations subverted! :D

 

1 hour ago, Bellosh said:

The film was never referenced again in the other sequels until Dial.  Which I was not a fan of....

 

What do you mean - you're not a fan of the reference in DoD, or you're not a fan of this being the only reference?

 

58 minutes ago, Thor said:

So the the OST was the ultimate presentation of the score, after all.

 

I find the OST too short, and something between the OST and the Concord would probably be a sweet point to me.

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36 minutes ago, Jurassic Shark said:

What do you mean - you're not a fan of the reference in DoD, or you're not a fan of this being the only reference?

 

I'm simply not a fan of it being referenced at all.  Since TLC and KOTCS did not, Dial felt like the writers going "HEY GUYS WE REMEMBER TEMPLE OF DOOM!!"

 

A movie that wants to be taken seriously but Indy talking about the blood of Kali which was a blip of his life on adventures felt cheesy to me.

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The score for this feels like a constant stream of interconnected tracks. Where Raiders is spotted more sparsely in comparison, I can think of maybe four scenes in this sans-music. I read somewhere that it's like a ballet, and I really like that description for it, especially in the final third of the film.

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The movie is a bizarre mixture of things that work spectacularly and things that emphatically don't. I enjoy it and I genuinely respect it not being a retread of its superior predecessor. But I wish it wasn't so flawed.

 

The score is also a big change of direction, but a more successful one. It sounds very different from Raiders but still gives that top-notch score a run for its money.

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This was easily my least favourite of the trilogy when I was younger. With the falling raft, the dinner scene and Willie being my biggest problems with the film. But the score (that's the Concord and leaks) was always a close second to Last Crusade for me.

 

But several years ago I watched it in the cinema with an audience and the laughter at how over the top Willie was and the jokes during the dinner scene kind of made me give it a second chance. 

 

Something I've come to love is how different it is following Raiders, that Willie isn't just a copy of Marion, that she's her own character and arguably the only Indy girl to have a arc. Short Round has always been great and I love how much Ke Huy Quan and Harrison Ford play off each other, their chemistry is just fun to watch. Mola Ram is also a great villain, while maybe not quite as threatening as the Nazis, Amrish Puri plays him perfectly as a villain of the week. 

 

And the opening sequence, say what you will about Raiders being iconic and Crusade giving us an origin for Indy, but everything here is just perfect, the homage to musicals with Anything Goes, the tension back and forth with Lao Che, the chaos trying to get the antidote and the chase through Shanghai and the reveal Indy is on a plane owned by Lao is just a fantastic opening of a film and is definitely my favourite of the first three. 

 

These days my biggest problems are still the raft falling, had it began falling straight on to a slope instead of the big drop and then sliding down the mountain it might not have broken my suspension of disbelief. The dinner scene and how it's still culturally insensitive, there was an extra bit during the scene that was cut where Indy says to Captain Blumburtt about the choice of cuisine and how it's not normal and something is clearly wrong would certainly help make it clear that what was happening wasn't typical. And that Indy has the same arc as Raiders, someone who doesn't believe in the supernatural is convinced otherwise, with Temple being a prequel his conversation to Marcus in Raiders about superstition retroactively feels out of place.

 

TLDR didn't like it growing up but have come to love and appreciate it compared to Raiders and Crusade. 

 

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Temple of Doom will always be my least favorite of the Trilogy, but only compared to the classic Raiders and the great Last Crusade. I’m glad ToD exists, because it shows how filmmakers like George Lucas dared taking risks and not just give the same successful formula over and over again.

Temple feels like a fever dream that Indy had to live through between his two great adventures for the Ark of the Covenant and the Holy Grail. It’s dark and crazy, but has plenty to offer. And Williams’ score saves it yet again, like he did Jaws and Star Wars. So thank you, Maestro.

 

IMG_9929.webp

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32 minutes ago, JTW said:

it shows how filmmakers like George Lucas dared taking risks and not just give the same successful formula over and over again.

 

Just like he did with episode I.

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My mum took me to see Raiders with a school friend, but I don’t remember it much - I must only have been about seven.

 

Temple, on the other hand, came out when I was ten, which is probably the ideal age. I saw it countless times and, it being the mid-80s, saw no cultural issues in any of it. It’s a much less comfortable watch now, but I think it’s been long enough that I can now watch it with a certain distance and appreciate it for what it is.

 

And the score is still extraordinary. Yet another example of JW giving a film a far better score than it deserved (á la Hook, Far & Away)

 

Mark

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17 hours ago, QuartalHarmony said:

My mum took me to see Raiders with a school friend, but I don’t remember it much - I must only have been about seven.

 

Isn't that waaay too young for such a film?

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4 hours ago, Jurassic Shark said:

 

Isn't that waaay too young for such a film?


Maybe if looked at today, but back then parents in general weren't as vigilant I think. And as a kid who loved horror and intense fantasy, I'm glad mine weren't and brought me to see whatever PG-rated film I saw advertised on the covers of Famous Monsters of Filmland and Fangoria magazines.

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Apparently Raiders being recorded in London was more of a George Lucas thing. After that, every subsequent Indy score, as well as every Spielberg score, was done in the US.

 

It makes me wonder what a London Symphony Orchestra recording of ET would be like.

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24 minutes ago, Edmilson said:

It makes me wonder what a London Symphony Orchestra recording of ET would be like.


It's funny because when I was young I just assumed it was the LSO for all of them. Was surprised to find out it was actually the Hollywood Studio Symphony performing the hell out of these scores. I'm content with the recordings and can't imagine the LSO bringing much more to the sound, so I don't wonder.

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1 hour ago, Edmilson said:

It makes me wonder what a London Symphony Orchestra recording of ET would be like.

 

Around the time of E.T.'s release in the UK (December, 1982), there was a record by the LSO released (on, if memory serves, either the Pickwick, or the MFP label), where they perform a version of "Adventures On Earth".

It was bloody awful.

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On 4/12/2023 at 8:28 AM, Jurassic Shark said:

Isn't that waaay too young for such a film?


By 2023 standards, probably. By 1981 parenting standards? Absolutely fine.

 

In the UK, it was an A certificate in 1981 which meant it could be seen by children if accompanied by an adult. Since then, it’s been reclassified as PG and then re-reclassified as a 12A. Autre temps, autre moeurs, as we say in Wiltshire.

 

Personally, of all the things in my childhood that I look back on and think ‘that was a bit iffy’, this isn’t one of them.

 

Mark

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  • 1 month later...
On 4/12/2023 at 7:10 PM, Edmilson said:

It makes me wonder what a London Symphony Orchestra recording of ET would be like.

LEGENDARY.

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8 hours ago, Jurassic Shark said:

Well actually...

 

 

I know you've said that you don't like this recording, but judging from this clip it sounds fine. Not better than the OST, but fine.

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On 04/12/2023 at 3:06 PM, Haasch said:

Goofy question I couldn't find an answer to: was there any reason given why this one was recorded in L.A.? 

If I read correctly somewhere, it's because, by 1984, recording engineer Eric Tomlinson wasn't working for Anvil Studios anymore (were they recorded the OT and Raiders as well). So maybe it was more "convenient" to stay in the US.

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A shame, as I'd take Maurice Murphy over Malcolm McNab (the rest of the brass, too) any day of the week, but it's still the best score in the series, to me at least.

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