publicist 4,643 Posted April 26, 2018 Share Posted April 26, 2018 14 hours ago, Richard said: What Eno is saying is immature and vitriolic. By whose standards? The intense need for sanitized and orderly speech these days, however throwaway, is laughable. It would make for a poorer, less entertaining world if guys like Eno always get a thick checklist titled 'Please refrain from saying things like...' just because touchy fans could object. Unlucky Bastard and Joni Wiljami 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Naïve Old Fart 9,553 Posted April 26, 2018 Share Posted April 26, 2018 1 hour ago, publicist said: By whose standards? The intense need for sanitized and orderly speech these days, however throwaway, is laughable. It would make for a poorer, less entertaining world if guys like Eno always get a thick checklist titled 'Please refrain from saying things like...' just because touchy fans could object. I'm not "touchy", and, in no way, can I be described as a snowflake. It's been quoted on this thread that Eno thinks that JW is " ISIS". If that's not immature and vitriolic, then I don't know what is? Eno is an intelligent man. I would, simply, like to hear, or read, a considered argument, from him, as to why he dislikes JW's music. That's all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dixon Hill 4,234 Posted April 26, 2018 Share Posted April 26, 2018 2 minutes ago, Richard said: It's been quoted on this thread that Eno thinks that JW is " ISIS". If that's not immature and vitriolic, then I don't know what is? Dude...pretty sure that wasn't a real quote. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Naïve Old Fart 9,553 Posted April 26, 2018 Share Posted April 26, 2018 That's alright, then. I'm still a little mystified that someone would criticise a fellow professional, the way that Eno has criticised JW. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quintus 5,399 Posted April 26, 2018 Share Posted April 26, 2018 9 hours ago, Thor said: Yes, I do appreciate that kind of blunt honesty -- even if I disagree vehemently with the view in question. How is Eno's statements any different from that of Gilliam on Spielberg? No different. But some people are really put off by "bitchiness" and may even lose respect for a person. When I hear celebs or even people we look up to speak like this, I always find its suddenly very easy to imagine them working instead in a warehouse, or a hairdressers. Personally, it's no bother to me to shrug these sorts of things off (and be amused by them). But I can see why the reaction of others might be to look down their noses instead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Score 770 Posted April 26, 2018 Share Posted April 26, 2018 In the course of history, things have been much worse than this: https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/1316010/Brahms-expert-puts-cat-killer-claims-to-sleep.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
publicist 4,643 Posted April 26, 2018 Share Posted April 26, 2018 10 hours ago, Richard said: I'm not "touchy", and, in no way, can I be described as a snowflake. It's been quoted on this thread that Eno thinks that JW is " ISIS". If that's not immature and vitriolic, then I don't know what is? Eno is an intelligent man. I would, simply, like to hear, or read, a considered argument, from him, as to why he dislikes JW's music. That's all. I wasn't necessarily talking about you (alone) but the comments in this and similar threads by and large do not read like 'i dislike snide remarks and are put off by this' but more like 'how dares he!' or 'stone him!' (with the express wish to obliterate the whole work catalogue of said offender). Brian Eno used snide hyperbole to express himself, which he is allowed to do (since it's not a verboten topic) and that's it. He isn't required to put forth 'considered arguments' - maybe he finds that boring, who knows. I just find the reaction to such utterances grotesquely exaggerated. Joni Wiljami 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joni Wiljami 1,206 Posted April 28, 2018 Share Posted April 28, 2018 On 25.4.2018 at 2:08 AM, Quintus said: I see BloodBoal had made it to that Eno thread with his deletion crusade. Oddly though, Hornist has removed his own posts there too. I removed some of the posts, most drunk post with bad english, furious about that dickhead. Dude looking like a peacock. No interest. Bad behaviour. Idiot. Mediocre. Actually lower than that. Windows 95 theme. Train station music. Also that famous doorbell theme, I heard that the chost writer made that lower note and assistant helped with the upper one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dixon Hill 4,234 Posted April 28, 2018 Share Posted April 28, 2018 We can expect the removal of that gem of a post in a while too, then? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joni Wiljami 1,206 Posted April 28, 2018 Share Posted April 28, 2018 Nope.That post of that chicken is final. Thank you for considering it as a gem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick1Ø66 4,722 Posted April 28, 2018 Share Posted April 28, 2018 6 hours ago, hornist said: I removed some of the posts, most drunk post with bad english, furious about that dickhead. Dude looking like a peacock. No interest. Bad behaviour. Idiot. Mediocre. Actually lower than that. Windows 95 theme. Train station music. Also that famous doorbell theme, I heard that the chost writer made that lower note and assistant helped with the upper one. I think you’re still drunk. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joni Wiljami 1,206 Posted April 28, 2018 Share Posted April 28, 2018 Sorry I was. But after hearing JW music live with Chicago orchestra made me think that Brians comment was totally wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lewya 360 Posted May 9, 2018 Author Share Posted May 9, 2018 Apparently Williams knows some of Higdon's music. Christopher Rouse, another Pulitzer prize winner and academic weights in in the comment section: Gloria Coates, one of the most successful female composers alive liked the post as well. Kevin Puts liked the post. Du Yun, a recent Pulitzer prize winner "loved" one of the images. Love spying on what these successful composers think of Williams, wether good, bad or indifferent TownerFan and Marcus 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lewya 360 Posted May 13, 2018 Author Share Posted May 13, 2018 I just found this in a tweet - Georg Friedrich Haas on the Star Wars: The Force Awakens score. His wife asked him what he thought of the score. Georg Friedrich Haas: "It was very good. He has a strong hand with his craft." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lewya 360 Posted June 16, 2018 Author Share Posted June 16, 2018 I just found negative comment (I think): The Pulitzer prize-winning composer Mario Davidovsky said the following about Williams: "John Williams is to music history what an onion bagel is to the history of the space program." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Parker 3,040 Posted June 16, 2018 Share Posted June 16, 2018 Funny, I was thinking Mario is to music history what an aphid is to the history of World War 2. Kasey Kockroach and SteveMc 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveMc 2,674 Posted June 16, 2018 Share Posted June 16, 2018 More art is not for all snobbery. Why don't these individuals bash Mozart while they're at it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Disco Stu 15,495 Posted June 16, 2018 Popular Post Share Posted June 16, 2018 I see Davidovsky is of Williams’ generation. He seems to be just another example of how 20th century art music became a snake eating its tail. Academics writing music for academics. Younger composers have largely left that nonsense behind thankfully. Dixon Hill, Holko, martybmusic and 2 others 4 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loert 2,515 Posted June 16, 2018 Share Posted June 16, 2018 1 hour ago, Lewya said: I just found negative comment (I think): The Pulitzer prize-winning composer Mario Davidovsky said the following about Williams: "John Williams is to music history what an onion bagel is to the history of the space program." OK, but who really cares? Williams simply writes good music, he doesn't have to be the modern day equivalent of Stravinsky or whatever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Dixon Hill 4,234 Posted June 16, 2018 Popular Post Share Posted June 16, 2018 I hate to speak ill of another composer, even in response to the same, but it's painfully obvious that Mr. Davidovsky's page in the history of music will be immensely less significant than John Williams'. What a silly thing for him to say. Not Mr. Big, mahler3, Naïve Old Fart and 2 others 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crocodile 8,019 Posted June 16, 2018 Share Posted June 16, 2018 1 hour ago, Lewya said: I just found negative comment (I think): The Pulitzer prize-winning composer Mario Davidovsky said the following about Williams: "John Williams is to music history what an onion bagel is to the history of the space program." What if the idea of space exploration was triggered by an onion bagel? 🤔 Karol Not Mr. Big 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Holko 9,531 Posted June 17, 2018 Share Posted June 17, 2018 Even if you look down on film music and don't care for his other work, you cannot deny Williams does what he does very well. At the very least his ability to make people interested in the orchestra and perhaps more open to "serious" music should be commended. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Score 770 Posted June 17, 2018 Share Posted June 17, 2018 8 hours ago, Disco Stu said: I see Davidovsky is of Williams’ generation. He seems to be just another example of how 20th century art music became a snake eating its tail. Academics writing music for academics. Younger composers have largely left that nonsense behind thankfully. I will always thank people like John Williams and some other great film composers because they managed to partially invert that tendency. They showed that it is still possible to write music that is pleasant to listen to, while keeping to deliver a high-level artistic content. This feat alone is worth of an important place in the history of music. Marcus and Joni Wiljami 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
publicist 4,643 Posted June 17, 2018 Share Posted June 17, 2018 The guy probably only heard the Star Wars main title a million times. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Holko 9,531 Posted June 17, 2018 Share Posted June 17, 2018 I could live with that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lewya 360 Posted June 18, 2018 Author Share Posted June 18, 2018 Curious, does anyone here know if John Adams has ever said something about John Williams? I have missed that if so. I am curious what Adams thinks about Williams, I remember that Adams was critical of Spielberg in an interview. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lewya 360 Posted June 18, 2018 Author Share Posted June 18, 2018 . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gkgyver 1,645 Posted June 19, 2018 Share Posted June 19, 2018 On 13. Mai 2018 at 7:59 AM, Lewya said: I just found this in a tweet - Georg Friedrich Haas on the Star Wars: The Force Awakens score. His wife asked him what he thought of the score. Georg Friedrich Haas: "It was very good. He has a strong hand with his craft." No need for big fonts, that's about as generic of a comment as they come. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lewya 360 Posted July 20, 2018 Author Share Posted July 20, 2018 The Pulitzer Prize winning composer Ned Rorem weights in on Williams and it is negative - this was back in 1987, mind you: Interview: Certain film composers enjoy a very wide audience: for example, Jerry Goldsmith, John Williams Rorem: Goldsmith is inventive and evocative and personal. But there's nothing John Williams has written that Richard Strauss has written better. Now that Strauss' copyright has expired, John Williams has cribbed verbatim the tone poems of Strauss who, during his lifetime, was one of the highest paid composers who ever lived. Yet Williams is said to have made a billion [sic] dollars from his uncredited riflings. Interviewer: One also hears criticism that Williams steals far too much from Max Steiner and Erich Wolfgang Korngold as well. Rorem: All art is in a sense taking from what has already existed and making it your own, but Williams doesn't make it his own — he makes it lesser Strauss. There's hardly any distinguished movie music being written today because 9 out of 10 movies use amorphous rock scores, or no scores at all, or simply a meaningless oleo of bathos, like Marvin Hamlisch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Disco Stu 15,495 Posted July 20, 2018 Share Posted July 20, 2018 Strauss’ copyright wasn’t even expired in 1987, lol. I’m not even sure it is now Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Holko 9,531 Posted July 20, 2018 Share Posted July 20, 2018 Yeah, if we count the standard 70 years after death, it'll be next year, unless the family decides they want to leech off of him more like with Gershwin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loert 2,515 Posted July 20, 2018 Share Posted July 20, 2018 1 hour ago, Lewya said: Interview: Certain film composers enjoy a very wide audience: for example, Jerry Goldsmith, John Williams Rorem: Goldsmith is inventive and evocative and personal. But there's nothing John Williams has written that Richard Strauss has written better. Now that Strauss' copyright has expired, John Williams has cribbed verbatim the tone poems of Strauss who, during his lifetime, was one of the highest paid composers who ever lived. Yet Williams is said to have made a billion [sic] dollars from his uncredited riflings. Interviewer: One also hears criticism that Williams steals far too much from Max Steiner and Erich Wolfgang Korngold as well. Rorem: All art is in a sense taking from what has already existed and making it your own, but Williams doesn't make it his own — he makes it lesser Strauss. There's hardly any distinguished movie music being written today because 9 out of 10 movies use amorphous rock scores, or no scores at all, or simply a meaningless oleo of bathos, like Marvin Hamlisch. OMG! This is clinical levels of delusion. Btw, "there's nothing John Williams has written that Richard Strauss has written better" actually means the opposite of what I think Rorem was trying to say. Nemesis and mahler3 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveMc 2,674 Posted July 20, 2018 Share Posted July 20, 2018 More than delusion. He simply refuses (at least in '87) to think of John Williams as a worthy composer, primarily because he is a successful one, I suppose. He clearly hadn't heard Empire of the Sun yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Parker 3,040 Posted July 20, 2018 Share Posted July 20, 2018 No, I didn't post rerecordings of the Strauss piece (though I wouldn't blame you for thinking so!) Atbleast Strauss knew how to actually incorporate emotion! If you think this is bad, check out AI! He had the gall to steal from Strauss so blatantly, and think no one would notice! Amazing how someone like Williams can so blatantly steal from the great giants, and become celebrated and praised by the uncultured simpletons of the world, especially America! Thankfully there's cultured people like me to see through the shroud. 1 hour ago, Steve McQueen said: More than delusion. He simply refuses (at least in '87) to think of John Williams as a worthy composer, primarily because he is a successful one, I suppose. He clearly hadn't heard Empire of the Sun yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Locrius 97 Posted July 21, 2018 Share Posted July 21, 2018 13 hours ago, Lewya said: But there's nothing John Williams has written that Richard Strauss has written better. Doesn't he actually mean "But there's nothing John Williams has written that Richard Strauss has not written better."? The quote as it stands, without the word "not", would actually mean he's praising Williams over Strauss. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lewya 360 Posted July 21, 2018 Author Share Posted July 21, 2018 They probably forgot to include "not" in the article yes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Faleel 5,359 Posted July 21, 2018 Share Posted July 21, 2018 Or "n't" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Parker 3,040 Posted July 21, 2018 Share Posted July 21, 2018 I think we've had enough go around on omissions of negatives this week..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jurassic Shark 12,091 Posted July 21, 2018 Share Posted July 21, 2018 It's still one more day to go! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kasey Kockroach 2,344 Posted July 21, 2018 Share Posted July 21, 2018 On 5/13/2018 at 12:59 AM, Lewya said: I just found this in a tweet - Georg Friedrich Haas on the Star Wars: The Force Awakens score. His wife asked him what he thought of the score. Georg Friedrich Haas: "It was very good. He has a strong hand with his craft." Daisy Ridley likes a man who's good with his hands.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Marian Schedenig 8,211 Posted July 21, 2018 Popular Post Share Posted July 21, 2018 1 hour ago, kaseykockroach said: Daisy Ridley likes a man who's good with his hands.. Cerebral Cortex, MrJosh and Disco Stu 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lewya 360 Posted November 5, 2018 Author Share Posted November 5, 2018 The esteemed Thomas Adés recently in an interview said that he loves Williams (and Waxman, Bernstein, Legrand) in film music: Obviously, there is a fine tradition of classical composers scoring film. Were there particular composers that inspired you? Adés: "In film music, I love Franz Waxman, Michel Legrand, Elmer Bernstein, and John Williams. Of classical composers who have written for film: Sergei Prokofiev, Per Nørgård." - https://bleeckerstreetmedia.com/guilds/editorial/interview-with-composter-thomas-ades?return=colette Mason Bates wrote this back in 2016 about E.T.: Incanus 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gkgyver 1,645 Posted November 6, 2018 Share Posted November 6, 2018 Master Bates with style. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Lewya 360 Posted November 19, 2018 Author Popular Post Share Posted November 19, 2018 More Kevin Puts: Puts has written in virtually every musical genre; is there something new he’d like to try? Puts: “I’d like to write film music. I think I’m just as influenced in my own music by film music, and film itself as I am by art music. Some of the first music I really loved was John Williams’s film scores when I was a kid—Star Wars, E.T. I still love them deeply, and I have the scores now. I hope I can find a way to do that.” - https://www.sfsymphony.org/Watch-Listen-Learn/Read-Program-Notes/Articles-Interviews/Original-Voices-Composers-Kevin-Puts-and-Anna-Clyn.aspx SteveMc, Once, TownerFan and 1 other 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toothless 964 Posted December 3, 2018 Share Posted December 3, 2018 Not composers, but I did not want to create a new thread just for this. For those of you who are interrested to hear some LSO members' thoughts on John Williams music. EDIT : Of course question are in french but answers are in english Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
karelm 2,915 Posted December 3, 2018 Share Posted December 3, 2018 On 11/18/2018 at 10:44 PM, Lewya said: More Kevin Puts: Puts has written in virtually every musical genre; is there something new he’d like to try? Puts: “I’d like to write film music. I think I’m just as influenced in my own music by film music, and film itself as I am by art music. Some of the first music I really loved was John Williams’s film scores when I was a kid—Star Wars, E.T. I still love them deeply, and I have the scores now. I hope I can find a way to do that.” - https://www.sfsymphony.org/Watch-Listen-Learn/Read-Program-Notes/Articles-Interviews/Original-Voices-Composers-Kevin-Puts-and-Anna-Clyn.aspx Yes, he's a huge JW fan. We talked about it after a rehearsal of his piano concerto with the LA chamber orchestra. After the very fine rehearsal we went for a walk around the music center and he made his admiration for film music and JW very clear. No snobbery from him and he would make a very fine film composer considering his considerable talent and dramatic instinct as displayed in his operas and symphonies. Loert and mahler3 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post karelm 2,915 Posted December 10, 2018 Popular Post Share Posted December 10, 2018 Derek Bourgeois (English composer, 1941-2017): "Today the composers he most admires are John Adams and John Williams: "There was, for a while, a huge amount of scorn poured on composers who still wrote melodies and harmonies and all the rest of it. I think audiences were put off so much that they haven't really recovered. There's still a huge mistrust of new music, even though an awful lot of it now is much more approachable." - Guardian interview with the composer, 2009 mahler3, SteveMc and Once 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toothless 964 Posted December 11, 2018 Share Posted December 11, 2018 18:42 - 19:14 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Disco Stu 15,495 Posted December 11, 2018 Share Posted December 11, 2018 What's he saying about John Williams? Once 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveMc 2,674 Posted December 11, 2018 Share Posted December 11, 2018 Am I wrong, or is he commending Williams for taking a diverse array of influences (Jazz, Stravinsky, Ravel, Massenett) into unique music that has broad public appeal? @Bespin? @Chewy? Chewy 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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