Indiana Jones and the Dial of Destiny - Isolated Score Track

[Edmilson 7,466]

I'm halfway through the isolated score and honestly the music for the prologue is a little grating, just quotes of the previous Indy scores barely connected by some sense of musical narrative. I must say, Williams did a good job of condensing all the mess into the OST track, kinda like he did with the opening battle of TLJ (another musical mess) into Main Title and Escape.

 

But the score does get better after the rough beginning. Even the quotes of older scores (like Spyders) are more organically integrated. 

 

Edit: wow, the complete film version of the Tuk Tuk chase is awesome! It should've been on the OST, Conveyor Belt or not (and, like Chasing the Snitch, I'd argue it's still much more than just an AOTC rewrite).

[Faleel 5,355]

22 minutes ago, Edmilson said:

I'm halfway through the isolated score and honestly the music for the prologue is a little grating, just quotes of the previous Indy scores barely connected by some sense of musical narrative. I must say, Williams did a good job of condensing all the mess into the OST track, kinda like he did with the opening battle of TLJ (another musical mess) into Main Title and Escape.

 

 

You can tell that some of it is edited though, for example there are bits on the OST track, not in the film.

[Edmilson 7,466]

Just finished it. The last third of the score, beginning with To the Airport, flows much better in complete form! The OST had a decent listening experience, but in C&C it has much more space to breathe and tell a narrative, especially the last third.

 

Overall, a fine score aside from the messy opening.

[crumbs 14,317]

2 hours ago, Edmilson said:

kinda like he did with the opening battle of TLJ (another musical mess)

 

Wait, what? This flows magnificently in complete form!

[Tydirium 1,167]

Has anyone noticed that from 1:38-1:43 in “Confrontation at the Tomb,” the Raiders March appears to be an insert of the version heard at 1:56-2:02 in the OST track “Germany, 1944”? You can hear the edit if you listen closely, right after the first four notes of the theme; all the background instruments abruptly drop out when the insert happens. The final percussion hit syncs up with the new material featuring the muted horns.

 

Pretty interesting. It’s almost like originally it was just supposed to be a brief reference to Raiders March (the first four notes), but then they later decided they wanted more of the theme in there. I’d be very curious to hear the original version.

[crumbs 14,317]

1 hour ago, Tydirium said:

Pretty interesting. It’s almost like originally it was just supposed to be a brief reference to Raiders March (the first four notes), but then they later decided they wanted more of the theme in there. I’d be very curious to hear the original version.

 

Yep, definitely sounds like it was (badly) tracked into that scene. It's obviously not part of the original recording.

 

Frankly a lot of the repurposed music from earlier scores sounds unmusical and badly inserted, as if they just re-recorded a bunch of old cues and gave them to Ramiro to paste wherever. Some of those Jungle Chase excerpts in the train chase sound pasted over new JW material.

 

I wonder if this was temp track love, and these excerpts are the "patches" found in the cue list?

[Archive Collection 214]

There's around 40 secs of additional music in the End Credits - 02:30:14 to 02:30:55.

 

Anyone know where this is from? It's been tracked in.

[King Mark 3,631]

was wondering about that. It seemed something I didn't hear before (but not sure) and if so why was it removed for the OST

[Tom 4,664]

Just to put things in perspective, if you take out the cut and paste moments (even cues), what would remain would be a score three times longer than The Fabelmans.  

 

Moreover, the third of this score is just so damn good.  I think that it exceeds the third act music from both TLC and KotCS.  

[GerateWohl 4,370]

Despite all the complaints here and my personal judgment on the movie itself, the score really shines in the movie. It really was a joy for me experiencing it watching the film. It is some time ago that I felt that way in the cinema. Probably at watching The Force Awakens?

[Damien F 1,742]

Listening to this isolated score makes me REALLY wish TROS also had a isolated score. It is such a shame they didn't follow TLJ's lead.

[Bellosh 3,419]

Well, i'm gonna eat my words that i said earlier that the complete score wouldn't completely change my opinion on this score.

 

I love it even more now with all the gaps filled with the missing bits.

 

That said, i still think the OST presentation is a perfect presentation of the score, although the inclusion of Pulse of the City would have made it more perfect.

 

What about the source music at the auction, was that original material not on the isolated track?  I love that stuff in my complete playlists.

[Taikomochi 1,136]

52 minutes ago, Damien F said:

Listening to this isolated score makes me REALLY wish TROS also had an isolated score. It is such a shame they didn't follow TLJ's lead.

 
I see this said on here a lot, but I honestly think it would sound like shit. Many cues would be hacked to death, like the “Hard to Get Rid Of” track on the FYC. If we were able to actually hear all the cuts the sound editors made, it probably wouldn’t be a good listening experience.

[Bellosh 3,419]

lots of interesting stuff going on at the tail end of Centuries Join Hands

 

great cue!

 

also nothing has changed this opinion:

 

To Athens is the greatest cue in an Indy film since The Last Crusade end credits.

[MrJosh 892]

14 minutes ago, Bellosh said:

 

 

also nothing has changed this opinion:

 

To Athens is the greatest cue in an Indy film since The Last Crusade end credits.

To Athens really really stands out, it's definitely my favorite moment of the whole score. 

[Damien F 1,742]

59 minutes ago, Taikomochi said:

 
I see this said on here a lot, but I honestly think it would sound like shit. Many cues would be hacked to death, like the “Hard to Get Rid Of” track on the FYC. If we were able to actually hear all the cuts the sound editors made, it probably wouldn’t be a good listening experience.

 

Yeah perhaps but at least we would have some new clean music (including some important cues) to make our own edits. But now we have to wait an unknown number of years/decades until a possible expansion.

[Bellosh 3,419]

wow

 

the transition from Confrontation At The Tomb ------> To The Airport is so good

[MrJosh 892]

In Tuk Tuk Chase Pt 2, I know the Conveyor Belt is pretty obvious, but anyone noticing the bit similar to a piece of Chase through Coruscant around the middle of the track and then some of Jango Fett Fight just prior to the cool statement of the Indy B theme? 

[A. A. Ron 1,742]

23 hours ago, Edmilson said:

kinda like he did with the opening battle of TLJ (another musical mess) into Main Title and Escape.

 

21 hours ago, crumbs said:

Wait, what? This flows magnificently in complete form!

 

I'm with Edmilson on this one. Main Title and Escape has always felt like an unfocused and unengaging slog to me. It's easily one of my least favorite Star Wars action pieces.

[Edmilson 7,466]

I think the problem with the opening battle of TLJ is how the filmmakers were constantly demanding revisions, inserts, changing the edit which forced JW to write "fixes", etc. Perhaps we could've gotten a newer, modern equivalent to The Battle of Hoth if JW had been able to write for the finished movie without the constant changes in the edit, and thus being able to provide something a little more coherent.

[DrTenma 116]

10 hours ago, MrJosh said:

In Tuk Tuk Chase Pt 2, I know the Conveyor Belt is pretty obvious, but anyone noticing the bit similar to a piece of Chase through Coruscant around the middle of the track and then some of Jango Fett Fight just prior to the cool statement of the Indy B theme? 

Indeed. But precisely those nods are my favorite parts of that music!

I'm enjoying the isolated track much more than the movie or the OST. I still think this is not his finest work... Probably is the weaker score from all his "saga" works (Harry Potter, Star Wars , Indy...).

[King Mark 3,631]

There's somekind of insert fading over the Archimedes Theme in Centuries Join hands in the Iso Score. That's my only slight annoyance with the final sequence. Is there a way to fix this using the OST track?

[Smeltington 1,440]

On 28/11/2023 at 4:47 PM, MrJosh said:

In Tuk Tuk Chase Pt 2, I know the Conveyor Belt is pretty obvious, but anyone noticing the bit similar to a piece of Chase through Coruscant around the middle of the track and then some of Jango Fett Fight just prior to the cool statement of the Indy B theme? 

 

And it's been 21 years since Chamber of Secrets. AotC must be William Ross' all-time favorite JW score!  

[Bellosh 3,419]

listening to :34 seconds in 'Indy Rescues Baz' .....

 

it's so hard to hear that bit without wanting it to go right into Marion's theme from the jungle chase.

[Gurkensalat 340]

After listening to Pulse of the City, I am wondering why Williams hasn't written something like that himself. I mean with all the citations of older scores, he could just have taking something similar out of, let's say, The Eiger Sanction and adapted for this movie. Probably it would have been more interesting musically nonetheless. 

 

 

[Bellosh 3,419]

how in the world did :18-:22 of To Morocco Again not make the OST version of To Morocco

 

it's so gorgeous!

[Tom 4,664]

37 minutes ago, Gurkensalat said:

After listening to Pulse of the City, I am wondering why Williams hasn't written something like that himself. I mean with all the citations of older scores, he could just have taking something similar out of, let's say, The Eiger Sanction and adapted for this movie. Probably it would have been more interesting musically nonetheless. 

 

 

I wonder if it wasn't Williams's way of being nice.  It sounds like Ross did a lot of work on cues replaced by Williams.  it is cool to have a distinctive moment just for Ross.  

[Indy 17]

1 hour ago, Bellosh said:

listening to :34 seconds in 'Indy Rescues Baz' .....

 

it's so hard to hear that bit without wanting it to go right into Marion' theme from the jungle chase.

I'm glad I'm not the only one. It bothered me when watching the movie as well.

[Gurkensalat 340]

I must say, when the citations of older works are done like in Tuktuk chase, I don't mind them, because they are significantly adapted and integrated into the new composition. And by the way, if one has the option to listen to to the TrueHD format in Surround sound, do it! It sounds so much more involving. No matter if 5.1, 7.1 or Atmos, it is a big difference to simple stereo. 

[Tom 4,664]

On 28/11/2023 at 3:47 PM, MrJosh said:

In Tuk Tuk Chase Pt 2, I know the Conveyor Belt is pretty obvious, 

i have always associated the horn (trombone?) motif in the Conveyor Belt with the horns Mine Chase.  So, this is sort of a full circle moment for me.  

[tee_oh 20]

The indy theme 3:19-3:26 of Ancient Syracuse has to be an insert right? It sounds so tacked on to me. I think possibly even the sustained notes that continue until about 3:39 may be a part of the same insert. I love that whole track but that section feels so cluttered to me with how disparate the different parts sound.

[tmarps 217]

Is the score-only version available on Disney+?? 

[Jay 37,369]

Nope.

[JNHFan2000 2,966]

Maybe in a few months or years.

 

The Last Jedi is on there. So maybe

[Alex 2,835]

The part after the Coruscant-like percussion stuff in Tuk Tuk Chase 2 is deliciously chaotic. There´s so much going on, I am picking up something new each time I listen. Voller and Helena's themes integrated into the On the Conveyer Belt stuff (I think they almost play off each other). Some absolutely mental harp playing going on before Indy's B theme plays as well.

[crocodile 8,017]

Just so you guys know, the UK version DOES feature isolated score on 4K disc, even though it is not advertised on the back cover.

 

 

Karol

[Jay 37,369]

Great!

[1977 1,743]

Nice TV @crocodile!

[Edmilson 7,466]

On 03/12/2023 at 12:27 PM, Alex said:

The part after the Coruscant-like percussion stuff in Tuk Tuk Chase 2 is deliciously chaotic. There´s so much going on, I am picking up something new each time I listen. Voller and Helena's themes integrated into the On the Conveyer Belt stuff (I think they almost play off each other). Some absolutely mental harp playing going on before Indy's B theme plays as well.

Indeed.

 

Ideally, both parts of the Tuk Tuk Chase would be on the OST, but if they absolutely had to choose between one of them, then pt 2 is clearly superior. But maybe Williams was a bit embarrassed with the AOTC quotes?

[Damien F 1,742]

Tuk Tuk Chase Part 2 has that excellent robust rendition of the B theme which is great. Can't believe that was left of the OST.

[Luke Skywalker 1,795]

3 hours ago, crocodile said:

Just so you guys know, the UK version DOES feature isolated score on 4K disc, even though it is not advertised on the back cover.

 

 

Karol

nice to know those extra languages left enough space for the iso score

[Alex 2,835]

3 hours ago, Edmilson said:

Indeed.

 

Ideally, both parts of the Tuk Tuk Chase would be on the OST, but if they absolutely had to choose between one of them, then pt 2 is clearly superior. But maybe Williams was a bit embarrassed with the AOTC quotes?

 

I think it might be a "Bill Ross was a bit too much involved in this" situation.

[Edmilson 7,466]

It sounds like pure Williams to me, not "Ross doing a Williams imitation and reusing his older stuff".

 

But then again I'm the guy who will always defend that Chasing the Snitch was a Williams composition.

[Alex 2,835]

I think it was probably a Williams and Ross composition (I am not sure exactly what that would entail), rather than JW on his own. This might explain why much of the prologue is missing from the OST as well.

[crocodile 8,017]

To be honest, to me it doesn't really matter. It could be an adaptation in some cases, as many of you suggest. Or it could be deliberate attempt from Williams to summarise the franchise in a reminiscence therapy (pun intended) type of a way (along with some other action entries of his career). It might be a bit of a temp track love too. Or all of the above. Either way, Williams has composed "all of it" and signed it off. The film treats the music with quite a lot of respect so perhaps it was consciously designed to be that way from a get go. We've been praising those types of "patchwork" sequels in the past (Die Hard, Batman & Robin, Home Alone) so I can't really see how this is any different. If it means a 90-something can complete gargantuan amount of work in time, then it's fine by me. He's been "looking back" (stylistically) at his career for the past 15 years now (since Crystal Skull) so it's not really shocking. There's more than enough cool new stuff in this anyway.

 

Karol

[Alex 2,835]

Let’s just make sure that in 20 years time we’re still having a debate about who wrote what, like with COS.

[Edmilson 7,466]

10 hours ago, crocodile said:

The film treats the music with quite a lot of respect

That alone makes the movie different than 90% of today's blockbusters.

[Alex 2,835]

Yeah, I was watching the film on Disney+ on Friday, and the music does sound really good in it. It’s not horribly chopped up, it’s nicely mixed, it’s spotted really well. It’s the little things like an orchestral hit as someone jumps onto roof of a Tuk Tuk and stabs a knife through it that gets my blood flowing.

[Richard Penna 3,694]

13 hours ago, crocodile said:

If it means a 90-something can complete gargantuan amount of work in time, then it's fine by me. He's been "looking back" (stylistically) at his career for the past 15 years now (since Crystal Skull) so it's not really shocking.

 

I dunno, I reckon that if a patchwork score involving a large amount of tracking is the end result, I'd argue that having another composer involved to provide more original material would be a better end result than putting up with a load of reused material (way, more than Home Alone reused, surely) just so you can say that Williams composed it all.

 

I had a skim through the iso score, and the amount of material in the main action sequences that sounded completely cobbled together from other scores really astounded me. It wasn't a very satisfying first impression.

[Incanus 5,715]

39 minutes ago, Richard Penna said:

 

I dunno, I reckon that if a patchwork score involving a large amount of tracking is the end result, I'd argue that having another composer involved to provide more original material would be a better end result than putting up with a load of reused material (way, more than Home Alone reused, surely) just so you can say that Williams composed it all.

 

I had a skim through the iso score, and the amount of material in the main action sequences that sounded completely cobbled together from other scores really astounded me. It wasn't a very satisfying first impression.

The opening third is the worst offender. It feels like a complete cut and paste job of schizophrenic borrowing, not just from the Indy scores but from the likes of Minority Report and War of the Worlds as well.

 

I can't believe cobbling together the prologue from such little snippets of Indiana Jones music was very satisfying.

 

The rest 2/3 of the score when it steers into new writing has some quite excellent moments in it. Not on the level of the previous Indy scores but still very nice.